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Nidal Hasan: Homicidal and Suicidal Psychoses Is Not Terrorism, Rather, It Comes From Being Psychotically Terrified

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Brain Chemicals, Not Will Alone
We don’t know the qualified diagnoses of Nidal Hasan. But it may have markers of a serious chemicological and brain disturbance.

The subject about how the brain chemicals in the body can go haywire, wrongly signaling a person about events and stimulii around them, causing interpretations and behavior that are either too much or too little– is a subject so large that it would take several libraries to trace what has been researched and written about these matters over the decades.

Once thought to be the province of will, that people ‘decide’ to be a certain way, it is clearly held now that persons who suffer from extreme distortions of reality in every part of their lives, familial, social, work, relational… are not willfull most often.

Neuro-biology tells us that there are vast storms that cross the brains and bodies of those afflicted so deeply, and their ability to have relationships, to work, to find consensual reality with most others, deteriorates… forcing the person so suffering into isolation socially and otherwise… except for those who have complementary mental conditions who may then ally with them.

Paranoid Schizophrenia
Regarding persons who are homicidal and suicidal, there’s a form of schizophrenia that is unfortunately common. I am thinking of the horror that was brought by the undone mind of Harris at Columbine, the undone mind of Cho at Virginia Tech, and now the grave possibility of the same ‘undone’ condition of the mind of the alleged shooter, Maj. Nidal Hasan, at Fort Hood.

There are many many others, including women suicide bombers, Charles Starkweather and Carol Fugate, Charles Manson, and others who were not recognized for the extreme storms raging in their brains before they unleashed their terrified and distorted interpretations of the world on others.

This form of homicidal and suicidal schizophrenia, in its extreme, causes the mind to literally divide the world into good and evil, with usually the person suffering from mental illness as a warrior who must destroy evil.

The paranoid overlay to this illness then causes the ill person to target people who are often innocent of doing anything other than resisting/ rebuffing the mental illness of the person. The person who is ill takes this as proof of their evil. And is often terrified by it, by the images it brings into their minds… and so plans to strike out.

Also, persons with this particular illness are often deeply attracted to any religious system that revolves around death, world’s end, bands of warriors killing everyone, the defense of the one true God by murdering the ‘infidel’ or ‘unbeliever’, etc.

Except instead of hearing these as recordings of previous writers who may or may not have been in peace with God, they hear these religious ideas as concrete, as exhortations to go do likewise.

EVERYTHING is then filtered through the illness which divides the world into the dark and the light.

The rebuffing of the ill person by others is not taken as a mere social snub. It is taken as rebuffing the Warrior of God, as an insult to the Great God Himself. The retaliation is for that: the offense against the warrior and against one’s God.

None of this extreme way of ill thinking makes sense to a rational person. But, it makes perfect sense to any man, any woman who is living with a psychotic storm coursing through their brains night and day… storms that cause one to be highly easily offended, that cause distortion of others’ intentions, that cause one to feel not just unsafe, but hunted down by others.

There is more to this illness. As I said, its many aspects, case studies, medical research about it all spans literally millions of papers and books.

Interventions?
The only semi- and excellently effective ones we know at this time are educating society about the symptoms of the often adolescent onset of this disorder, and accurate diagnoses instead of thinking the increasingly psychotic behavior is merely ‘freedom of speech,’ and ‘freedom of movement.’

Anti-psychotic medicine, to gentle and still the storms, and to slow or stop the psychosis, is what we have to offer a person who suffers from this at present.

A large number of persons with this form of paranoid schizophrenia often take their own lives and sometimes, the lives of others. They have, whether man or woman, come undone and are incapable for more than moments at a time, to think of others as human.

In the end, they are terrified, even despite their bragadoccio. The believe everyone is the enemy. And the enemy must be exterminated.

With help and the minute amounts of daily medicines that regulate the brain’s pathways to a more normal way of thinking that does not take homicidal or suicidal offense at everything in one’s environment, that leaves the person without the hypervigilance and feelings of dread and terror that are made up in one’s own mind, a person can often live a life at peace… for themselves, for others.

‘Peace for others,’ meaning, there is often great and unrelieved suffering in the families and friends of those who dearly love someone whose chemistry of the body is bounding to extremes, or else burning far too low. The families and loved ones are often beside themselves to protect the person who is ill, from themselves. And also to protect vulnerable people in the family, such as children, from the one so afflicted.

For loving families and friends, having their loved one returned to them in some way that allows peace for all, is often nothing short of a miracle.

______________
CODA
Cruel interventions
There is as large a body of work about the cruel interventions regarding those who are suffering from serious mental distortions of reality: ice baths with patient laced in under leather over-cover causing hypothermia and death; being chained to lie in one’s offal day after day until the infection from supperating bed sores literally kill the person, deadly assault for aggression, rape of over-drugged patients, surgical removal of brain parts without legal standing, liberal use of stun guns for minor infractions in institutions. The list is very long and very very heart rending.

Poor diagnostic skills, lack of awareness
I’d also just mention that sometimes even those who are most qualified to diagnose, dont see the conditions right before their eyes. It could be because they dont want to have one more very difficult to deal with client at the center who takes up substantial resources. It could be they are book-smart and street-stupid. It could be not being perceptive in spades. It could be that they think being kind will help, and diagnoses is stigma. But kindness alone will not stop the storms in a person’s mind that rage and rage unbidden and ceaselessly.

For homicidal and suicidal psychotic ideation… which is fierce, relentless and obsessive…. only an accurate understanding of the symptoms, and as best we have at the moment, those minute amounts of medicine that can create calm so the person can think clearly, rather than one obsessive disorganized and often deadly scatter-shot thought over and over. I have seen it and seen it wherein someone in charge would not pay critical and informed attention when I and others said more than once, This person has homicidal and suicidal ideation repeatedly. Sadly, in my personal experience, extremely with grief that never goes away, twice my and others’ warnings were brushed off by those in charge. One family is missing a son. Another family is missing their father and their mother.

Refusing care
Whether a person suffering from such a deeply distorting illness will continue their medicine, is an issue. In another situation altogether, we have a person in our foster family who wanders several states away. They have a different form of schizophrenia than we are talking about. But, because of extreme mind fantasies, they wander… impulsive and unprotected from predators on the streets. They are now nearly 70. They’ve given to criminals all their family inheritance from their parents. By impulsive insults to others, they have been beaten up by others, further injuring head and eyes. They have injured others as well.

We’ve made the calls and received the calls for decades. Sometimes they will be found and helped. Other times they insist aggressively and ragefully that all doctors, all who help, are bad people. They cannot grasp how dangerous it is to be at the mercy of a mind that projects evil and badness on others. They beg for money for imagined surgeries, based on self-diagnoses of some condition they read about in the newspaper. All their immediate family has closed them off. They are often angry and terrified by ‘what others do,’ yet insist nothing is awry in their life or worldview… and then lurch into the deadly streets to wander buffeted by psychosis again.

The saddest distortion of all; that the mean streets are safe. They are not. And our foster relative is not safe, either. Can talk a good game, but the sum of their life is a shatters. And laws are such where they wander, that nothing can be done to intervene. The reality is, as always, far more complicated than armchair observation. And far more helpless making in some cases.

Unintended consequence of laws
In the case of Nidal Hasan, I think too, if there is a serious mental disturbance present… then a thorough analyses of ‘failure to see/ failure to report’ would have to look at the laws of the military and his domicile state, that would determine… if he were suffering a psychosis… whether as in some other states in the U.S…. no person can be held and treated against their will.

The issue with such laws that were put into place to stop abuse of those ill, those not ill but merely contrary, and those not ill but purported to be by their greedy relatives, etc., is that the unintended consequences of such laws is… also far too often… they prevent the most extremely ill and vulnerable from being brought to a true helping place where the mind’s storms can be quieted and peace returned to the person.

Some think differently
Though there are some who speak of letting people with extreme psychoses wander and be at the mercy of street thugs and criminals… that it’s just another form of the diversity of human nature to be so ill, that ‘freedom to be not well,” is a human right that ought not be interrupted, despite the person not being able to work, not able to raise one’s children, not able to return love other than in rote ways, not able to carry their own weight, not able without huge financial resources from somewhere to live a half-way safe life…

and there are some who attempt to assign mystical proportions to a person of extreme psychosis… even though they can clearly see that person can in no other way live life with some decent and ongoing sense of security and peace and productivity.

I see it differently. I’ve noted the abuses that can occur with and without laws in place. However, leaving it up to a poor suffering person with extreme mental /chemical disorders to self-diagnose accurately and go for real help that can actually help, is like asking a person at an accident scene with severe internal injuries and who lies on the ground semi-unconscious … to self-diagnose their own life-threatening conditions and walk themselves to the ER.

Sometimes mercy must be bold if possible
Usually someone has to call it like it is. Forget political correctness. Forget ‘boys will be boys’, ‘girls will be girls,’ set aside, ‘this is a harmless state of mind,’ ‘just an opinion I have,’ ‘just a religious belief I have,’ when one is talking about cruelty to self and others, violence of imagination unrelenting.

Someone has to call it like it is. Out of mercy. And true regard and concern. Without backing off because the person so afflicted says they are just fine, can carry on a conversation, dress themselves, eat food, drink coffee, and do what is called basically functional– yet their minds are fragmenting at the speed of thought and not with love, but with resentment, hatred and inhumane thoughts (and actions) toward others.

It ought not be that school administrators, military officers or others STILL not be well trained in symptomatology of the most serious chemical disturbances that violently afflict a person outside their own will… those in charge not realizing out of ignorance or their own biases… that not intervening usefully, compassionately and decisively, can multiply incidences of violence toward others.

There is an elaborate science of war including the study of underlying causes and ways to fight war, but there also has to be a science of peace… knowing its underlying premises and how to build it strongly… starting with studying and learning underlying causes of mental disasters ramping up if intervention are not undertaken. Or, if ‘being nice’ or looking away for personal reasons… overtakes being wise.

It makes sense to take extreme care to not harm a person who is harmless. But, in the same vein, it is insensible to wait to name and help until after all relationships are ripped asunder, after all dreams are in shreds, after relentless day after day high tension in one’s mind has created havoc with the other organs of the body, after worklife becomes impossible, after one’s loved ones flee, after all financial resource is drained, and in the cases of extreme psychosis… after great harm has been done to the person and to others.

It is owed to the human being who is relentlessly chemically fragged day in and day out… to have peace instead of war in their minds. To have calm instead of overly tight triggers that break down other parts of the body with excessive corisol and other chemicals which flood the body corrosively causing other critical health issues.

It is also owed to society to have all souls, insofar as possible, not left without help that truly helps. And in a timely manner.

———–
the drawing is by Rami Al-Ramahi

  • jkremmers
    Terrific insight and most educational, Dr.E. Excuse my tunnel vision for I have sinned so many times for not knowing of which I speak. In yesterday's column, I wrote that Hasan'''s shooting spree was a terrorist act. Legally, it was murder. Based on news reports what we have learned about the major, it adheres to a path of terrorism which, of course, is a conclusion based on not all evidence at hand. What triggered my post was the extreme positions taken by the media. The right says it was terrorism. The left underplayed the fact he was Muslim. After reading your post, I have a sinking feeling both positions are wrong. -- Jer
  • Father_Time
    --[Also, persons with this particular illness are often deeply attracted to any religious system that revolves around death, world’s end, bands of warriors killing everyone, the defense of the one true God by murdering the ‘infidel’ or ‘unbeliever’, etc.]--

    So ten's maybe hundreds of millions of fundamentalist Muslims are sick and therefore their actions excused?

    With regard to Nidal Hasan, I find it extremely difficult to believe that a mental health professional, working daily with, and, supervised by many more mental health professionals, could have such a massive psychotic illness as you describe here, and, not have it noticed.
  • archangel
    ft, I think people more than noticed. As I noted in article, people including myself, have reported, sometimes to have those who have the authority, turn away the reports. We have yet to know the facts in this case of who reported to whom.

    People reported with concern prior to massacres at columbine, virginia tech. And I think you will find in the military too, in this case of Maj Hasan, there was at least one if not more who reported on Maj Hasan.

    Many religions have book tracts that speak of the unbeliever and smiting others, including Christianity. My remark was about people suffering from paranoid schizophrenia, finding in often ancient or modern religious ideas correspondance with their disorder that puts extreme division on the world; dark and light.

    thanks FT

    dr.e
  • archangel
    Jer, I think that the media has often done good in terms of informing the public about mental health issues. But they have also done great damage; such as continually interviewing the raving Charles Manson who is very ill, and acting as though he is some sideshow freak who ought have weight given to his disordered thinking.

    I dont think we know everything. But I am always in love with people like yourself, who continually look to learn, and revise and find the ways through. That kind of inquisitiveness takes it over imbedded position, any day. Let us continue, ok?

    I think too Jer, that like what is called 'differential diagnoses' there are cultural diagnoses, legal 'diagnosis' and political 'diagnoses,' and others. I think all may apply. Murder in one light certainly. Terrorism, yes, it is easy to recruit certain of the mental afflicted to violence. Extreme mental disturbance, yes, very likely. I think that each has its lens. Hopefully to help us understand better how all three of these can horribly go together.

    That Maj Hasan is a Muslim can, I think, only matter depending on what brand he follows. I've been in Christian churches where I am appalled at what the preacher is preaching. It depends not on the religion, I dont think as much as where the emphasis on the religion is placed. I think all religious texts I've read have their calls to war on the enemy in one way or another. The few that dont are exceptional in that particular respect. But also, those very texts that say 'smite the middanite' and similar, also have long long tracts of care, regard, love and holiness, about 95:5, or less

    thanks Jer

    dr.e
  • jkremmers
    Amen, Dr. E -- Jer
  • spirasol
    As you said twice, it could take library to cover all the angles your are suggesting here, but I applaud your effort to cover it all. The problem with hundreds of pathways though is that it is difficult to comment for you've got the chicken and the egg and in reverse and all the caretakers, and the families, -- sure it is complex and with that I can agree.

    But there is a lot of specific information missing about the Major's situation. What did they know, what did others observe, and when did they know it. I think every person engaged with a person about to become homocidal/suicidal weighs the choices. As best as I can gather he was not in treatment, but even if he was, the therapist too, even using all his/her training, intuition, and caring still walks out on the limb with the patient. How much in touch with reality are they? How loose are their associations? How emotional? How distraught? The law says we can't hospitalize them unless they are harmful to self or others, and I have seen people who managed to talk the hospital staff out of hospitalization only to decompensate or attempt, usually suicide, later. The police have to wait until there is a crime. So in a way there is a lot of tedious waiting and worry and the mental health professional is not expected to have a crystal ball so these decisions can be very difficult and painful. I agree it can't be shrugged off or passed on, particularly if all the signals are present, but still the professionals, the systems, and the call can be missed by days or minutes, the result a tragic one. As you said the single professional may act but the systems or other professionals may not agree or cooperate.

    It is interesting to consider too, a conflagration of events and reactions, a perfect storm that might lead to a psychotic break where there were few previous notable symptoms. He is not and will not be the first or the last soldier to boil over just previous to deployment.

    There is much more to know about this case. I am interested to know more about secondary PTSD, a kind of contagion trauma that can occur from being around or listening to too many horror stories, in particular if some of the horrible things done were done to people of the Major's cultural heritage. I have known female mental health professionals who won't/can't and disqualify themselves from treating male child sex abusers.

    I have also read a story about his taking some malaria or other vaccinations in lieu of deployment known for causing some psychotic symptoms in some people. There are also temporary psychotic episodes.

    I do think though to call him a terrorist, is simple, for it is only to look under one shell. To me it is difficult to understand how a person whose immigrant trajectory was as high as his, to accomplish as much as he had, to go against the tenets of his own occupation, his military family, his own family, is hard to understand so easily. Perhaps more information will reveal more. Perhaps blood is thicker than water, especially when the biology becomes unbalanced.

    I sense the people who feel they have enough info are the punishment types, skip the trials, skip trying to understand, -- hang 'em, they might say.
  • Father_Time
    Well I could care less about religion including "Christianity" for some of the same reasons described here.

    Any religion.

    Including self worship. Because that is exactly what I believe Nidal Hasan to have, the religion of selfish, spoiled, self indulging, self gratifying, self centered, self worship. A menace to society to be mentally dissected like a lab specimen and then killed according to the law of capital punishment that applies.

    No compassion afforded a sick human being should be forthcoming.

    He is not that sick.
  • archangel
    "There are also temporary psychotic episodes. "

    very true Spirasol, as you said. Also another possible factor.

    I have in my travels in this world, seen the rare person who purposely took substances known to cause an irregular 'derangement' in order to avoid military service long ago, when being a CO was an option, to serve in another capacity without carrying a weapon. Have also see what some call 'roid rage' seeming accidental side effect of trying to gain muscle and mass with steroids. There are other meds that can unhook normal brain pathways. You are right, it is a layered story. Maj Hasan's facts fore, during and aft, are largely missing yet.

    dr,e
  • dduck12
    As Dr. Freud might have said: Sometimes a nut is just a nut.
  • tidbits
    Archangel -

    I was struck in particular by your idea of developing a "science of peace". A wondeful idea whose time, one hopes, will come soon.
  • superdestroyer
    I love how medical professions are working so hard to ignore the idea that Dr Hasan was a con artist and a scammer. He had no interest in practicing medicine and you hate anyone who got into the his way of pulling off his scam.

    Just look at how is relatives are supporting the scam even though virtually everything they have said had been shown to be false.
  • Marsh
    Dr. E, are you familiar with the work Dr. Nicolleti?
  • archangel
    hi superdestroyer. Which medical professionals do you have in mind who are "working so hard to ignore the idea that Dr. Hasan was a con artist and a scammer?" And who "hates anyone who got into the his way of pulling off his scam"?

    thanks.
  • archangel
    Hi there Marsh... do you mean the Dr. N who was one of the many health professionals who had their take on Columbine?

    thanks.
  • Ghostdreams
    Hi Doc. :D

    I appreciate that you use the word "minute" when talking about antipsychotic dosage and I realize that dosage is one more important issues when discussing side effects but for most of the shrinks I know (and that's not an insignificant number heeh) they have an attitude of "more is better."
    The patient suffers due to the treatment and the suffering is not insignificant. We're not talking about gaining two pounds or slight sedation here. I have yet to meet a person who has not gained a significant amount of weight and much worse, I known several people with TD (tardive dyskinesia) due to antipsychotic therapy.
    Antipsychotic side effects (partial list rom Wikipedia):
    Antipsychotics are associated with a range of side effects. It is well-recognized that many stop taking them (around two-thirds of people in controlled drug trials) due in part to adverse effects. Extrapyramidal reactions include acute dystonias, akathisia, parkinsonism (rigidity and tremor), tardive dyskinesia, tachycardia, hypotension, impotence, lethargy, seizures, intense dreams or nightmares, and hyperprolactinaemia.

    Scary side effect:
    Tardive dyskinesia is a variety of dyskinesia (involuntary, repetitive movements) manifesting as a side effect of long-term or high-dose use of dopamine antagonists, usually antipsychotics. Other dopamine antagonists that can cause tardive dyskinesia are drugs for gastrointestinal disorders (e.g. metoclopramide) and neurological disorders. While newer atypical antipsychotics such as olanzapine and risperidone appear to have less dystonic effects, only clozapine has been shown to have a lower risk of tardive dyskinesia than older antipsychotics.

    TD is not curable.
    This is a "visable" condition. The person's tongue and mouth move ongoing. That is to say, their tongue will move in and out of ther mouth and they move their mouth .. WELL ... it's hard to describe so I've copied a video for anyone who wishes to know more about tardive dyskinesia.
    This lady was on one of the newer anti-psychotics (Geodon) for a year and a half at a high dose and is responding well to amatadine (sp?) but frankly, that is rare and, of course, amatadine has it's own list of side effects.
    There's no way to really describe TD except to see it so I'm giving an url
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BJjXqKa4cbE&feat...

    BTW, the psychiatrist will always mention that there is a CHANCE the patient can get TD and by doing so insures that there is NO CHANCE of the person being able to sue for damages and TD is serious neurological damage. :(
    The older antipsychotics are most famous for the TD condition but the newer meds are having it happen as well...and as for the claim that it's less often ..
    Considering that the "newer" meds are "newer" .. who's to say what we'll be looking at in 10 years.
    Trivia: The phenothiazine catagory of antipsychotic (thorazine, melliril, etc) was originally introduced (in 1935) as an insecticide.
    The BBC on Nov 12, 09 reported:
    150,000 dementia sufferers 'being prescribed anti-psychotic drugs unnecessarily'
    Up to 150,000 people with dementia are being prescribed anti-psychotic drugs unnecessarily, a Government-ordered review disclosed.
    Only around 36,000 of the 180,000 people on the drugs in the UK derive any benefit from them, it said.

    Over prescribing of the drugs is linked to an extra 1,800 deaths a year among elderly people.

    My one and a half cents worth :P
    Ghosty
  • Ghostdreams
    Hi SD.
    I've been thinking about Hassan quite a bit lately and have wondered much the same thing as Doc Estes.
    I know that some folks question how it could be possible for a man with Hassan's education and profession not have known that he was ill.
    Considering the bias and prejudice towards the mentally ill, not to mention the medication therapy given for such an illness (which is a horror), I don't find it a mysterious
    at all.
    There's not much compassion running around in the military for person with a mental illness (that is an understatement).

    I will not be surprised if it turns out that Hassan did say he was having issues and asked for assistance. It does seem that they missed many other clues that this was a man who should not be serving in the army.

    When I served, many of service people did ask for help and were ignored. Everything that I have read concerning current military attitudes is amazingly descriptive of what many of my comrades in arms enjoyed (sarcasm intended) during their time in service and that was 35 years ago. I have been shocked and alarmed to think that 35 years can pass by and our military remains as deeply mired in denial as it was when I was discharged in 1975.
    When I was in many airmen went in seeking help only to be told that:
    1) They were scheming to get an easy out and this was not going to happen.
    2) They were scheming to get sent back home and this was not going to happen
    3) They were scheming to get out of their current tour of duty because of a dear john letter and this was not going to happen.
    4) They were scheming .....

    I'm sure yawl catch my drift...
    Then there was the money issue..
    The service had paid for their training .. did they think it fair for the tax payer to put out all of that money only to have them QUIT? Well, by golly, they were NOT going to quit!

    It is actions and attitudes such as these that, not only do not help people having a mental health crisis but can make things so very much worse. :(
    Having said all of this, I personally don't wish to make a snap judgement but from what little has been released, it doesn't look or sound right to me.
    There is a possibility that Hassan wanted out, said he was troubled, and no one listened and I think it is a possibility that should be looked at because we need to make sure that such a mistake is not repeated.
    No one is saying his behavior is to be condoned.
    They are asking the question if he snapped YET had warned people before hand that he was unwell and having serious issues ... ? Then what?
    Our society does not execute people who are not in control of themselves due to insanity. That went out with the middle ages, eh?

    Be well,
    Ghosty

    PS In my opinion, the death penalty is from the middle ages as well and should be dispensed with, but that's a whole different discussion. :P
  • archangel
    thanks Ghost, those are all cogent first-eye-witness points and valuable. I wish Ghost that there were medicines that were ace accurate, individualized, with far far fewer contraindications and side effects. The risk versus benefit model is still used in medicine, and in many cases it is a good one. But some risks, as you say, are far more risky than others.

    Thank you too for your straight up report on 'scheming' projections by some in the military. That continues to be a shameful response to authentic and critical issues. There has to be a better way to separate slackers from those with genuine concerns. I've seen the 'wanna get out' syndrome in those too, a different category altogether, who were often too immature and ought not have been oversold by recruiters to begin with.

    I always want to say when we speak of so much that seems unspeakable, Ghost, Let us pray.

    thanks.
  • superdestroyer
    The attending physicians at Walter Reed and the residency coordinator had to have realized that Dr Hasan was a scammer. He had poor work habits, has been described as usually late to work, and failed to answer his pages when he was on call. Even his choice of psychiatry residency shows that he was a scammer who had little interest in medicine.

    I suspect that being a devout Muslim was a prop used in the scam to justify things like not working hard during Ramadan, being late to work, or not working any of the Muslim holidays. It is when the scam did not work as well as Dr Hasan believed that he seemed to descend into really believing what he was saying and Dr Hasan began to hate the world.

    The question is whether failing to scam people should be considered a mental illness.
  • Marsh
    Yes, same person Dr E. and I say this in the context of workplace violence. What I wanted to add is that like most institutions, and I can't believe the Army is any different, those is charge generally only become interested and feel an intervention is necessary if the person has made a direct threat against another individual and even then corrective actions taken are often confusing and contradictory. The subtleties of an indirect threat are often overlooked, glossed over or worse, There is so much we don't know about Hassan and will probably never find out but I'd be willing to bet at some point in his early life someone said, something is not quite right here. But back to Dr. N and his "Avenger model" - they always tell you what they are going to do and so it was with Hassan. (speaking only as an amatuer)
  • Father_Time
    He's not a nut, he's an arsehole.
  • Father_Time
    DR. ESTÉS,
    Let me mention something that I neglected to state at the beginning: Though I am purposely over sensitive to a popular movement to rescue Nidal Hasan's life on the basis of "mental illness", I still very much appreciate your work on the issue. Very much so.
  • Ghostdreams
    Quoting Superdestroyer: "It is when the scam did not work as well as Dr Hasan believed that he seemed to descend into really believing what he was saying and Dr Hasan began to hate the world."

    If I understand you correctly, Dr. Hasan was scamming and then because his scam wasn't working, he descended into a false belief system that led him to murder....
    Are you aware that what you are describing is a man in the grips of a psychotic break?
    IF someone, with intent, builds up a series of falsehoods in order to get "light duty" but then, for whatever reason, then begins to believe his own lies to the extent that his original reality is shattered and then the fellow acts out on his false beliefs...
    That sounds like many of the psychotic situations I have seen.
    Conversely, could it be that Hassan was having issues all along and THAT was why he was such a slacker?
    Most people in our society wish to be functioning, productive and participatory members of this society and they wish to succeed in life as well.
    For a person to become so disaffected with society and with life that he begins to "turn off, tune out, and veg" is usually the beginning of a long descent into darkness and a sickness of mind of soul.

    My two cents,
    Ghost
  • Ghostdreams
    The two are not mutually exclusive.
    You can be both an arsehole and a nutcase at the same time. :P

    My two cents,
    Ghost
  • spirasol
    For those interested in the mental health aspects of this case. Another article written by a former trauma specialist, covers some aspects of case not covered here.

    The Militarization of Mental Health; Death by Denial

    <http://www.counterpunch.org/cramer11132009.html>

    Mary Lynn Cramer, MA, MSW, LICSW worked for many years as a clinical social worker treating children and adults with PTSD and Dissociative symptoms.
  • spirasol
    Camp Lejeune whistle-blower fired
    A psychiatrist who tried to prevent Fort Hood-style violence among Marines about to "lose it" instead loses his job <http://www.salon.com/news/feature/2009/11/15/ca...>

    "A significant number of Navy medical officials and Marine commanders do not get it," a frustrated Manion said about the situation at Camp Lejeune. "They do not understand the implications of what happens if somebody loses it," explained Manion, who has 25 years of experience as a psychiatrist and who also specializes in traumatic brain injury -- exactly the kinds of skills needed so desperately at military hospitals, because mental problems and brain injuries are the signature wounds of the ongoing wars. "People either commit suicide, commit homicide, get drunk, beat up the wife, all these things. I've seen it," he added. "That is how serious this is and they just don't get it."
  • shannonlee
    My two cents...

    Islam didn't cause Hasan to walk into that facility and start shooting. Islam directed the path of his personal destruction towards that facility. Hasan's mental break from reality and religious beliefs caused this tragedy. The mental break being the tipping point.

    So basically, take Islam out of Hasan's life and he still snaps and does who knows what, maybe the same thing. With Islam in Hasan's life, he does this.
  • Ghostdreams
    Now don't hold back or anything FT! Let it all out! It'll help you to feel better. :(
    Mentally dissect him like a lab specimen?
    FT .. are you sure you wish to have our country use our criminals to experiment on?
    I PERSONALLY think it's an EXTREMELY bad idea.
    (Can we say Josef Mengele?!)

    We are supposed to be "better" than the criminal, remember?

    Two cents worth,
    Ghost

    Father_Time quote in regards to Hasan: "A menace to society to be mentally dissected like a lab specimen and then killed according to the law of capital punishment that applies."

    No compassion afforded a sick human being should be forthcoming.
  • Father_Time
    Yes but in this circumstance we NEED the information. The information MUST be extracted.....while we are at it, we might as have him sign zee papers also.
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