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Posted by on Jun 24, 2016 in England, International | 19 comments

UK ship ‘needs new captain’ after Leave vote – Cameron

Hot on the heels of the seismic vote for the UK to leave the EU came the dramatic announcement from David Cameron that he will step down as prime minister by the autumn. He had pledged the referendum and led the campaign to remain in the EU. Cameron appeared outside Number 10 Downing Street at breakfast…

  • Brownies girl

    One thing I don’t now, or *ever* will, understand, is this: why in heaven’s name did Cameron decide to put this incredibly important decision (on whether to stay or leave the EU) up for a national referendum? We elect leaders to make these important decisions — we don’t let a majority of ignoramuses take the field and vote out of “a lark” with no knowlege about what the results of what a negative vote would mean.

    If someone can explain this to me, I’m open to hearing it. Because right now, I’m happy to see Cameron gone — he made a **huge** mistake and he’s paying the price. What a stupid arrogant man he was, to do that.

    • KP

      Pretty straight forward; he wanted to be re-elected.

      “In 2013, besieged by the increasingly assertive anti-European Union wing of his own Conservative Party, Mr. Cameron made a promise intended to keep a short-term peace among the Tories before the 2015 general election: If re-elected, he would hold an in-or-out referendum on continued British membership in the bloc.”

      But the anti-European movement started much earlier in the UK.

      In 2004 ten eastern European nations joined the EU. They were many poor who came top the UK and were willing to work cheap; sometimes near half the wages.

      In 2007, fifteen Royal Navy personnel from the HMS Cornwall were held by Iranian Revolutionary Guard. The UK felt they were humiliated similar to US Navy peeps recently. The Brits looked to Brussels for help but it was slow in coming. That rankled a lot of Brits, who, as you know well are a proud lot and don’t like giving up control to Brussels.

      The push back was building for more than ten years for a number of reasons. I do think Island nations tend to be a bot more xenophobic than some others. The Brits seem to like the English Channel more than Europe.

      Then add the 65 million refuges looking to find a new home in Europe and elsewhere the last three years and (right or wrong) Cameron started writing checks he couldn’t cash to get re-elected.

      I defer to you and others (i.e. Shannon Lee) who know more than I do. Just doing some due diligence and trying to understand it all.

      • Brownies girl

        KP writes: “Pretty straight forward; he [Cameron] wanted to be re-elected.”

        Yeah well, that was a dumb move then on his part, if you ask me. Beyond dumb, in fact — downright stupid, arrogant, selfish and with no regard to what’d happen to his (and MY birthplace) country if he lost. I occasionally bet, but NEVER without a thought about what’ll happen if I lose. Can I *afford* to lose? is what I always ask myself. If I can’t afford to lose, I don’t bet. Cameron, I’m now seeing — didn’t do that. Foresight is not his strength, it seems.

        Then you write: “Then add the 65 million refuges looking to find a new home in Europe and elsewhere the last three years and (right or wrong) Cameron started writing checks he couldn’t cash to get re-elected.”

        I’ve checked around Google, and can’t seem to find a number that adds up to “65 million” refugees. (And by the way, it’s spelled ‘refugees’ — not refuges — refuges is the plural of refuge. (Not wishing to be rude, I only mention it because I’ve noticed you’ve misspelled the word in several other posts here & thought at first it was just a typo). If you have a cite for *65 MILLION* refugees seeking a new home in Europe in the past three years, please post it. I’d be eager to look it up.

        Meantime — thanks for your response. BG

        • KP

          My pleasure.

          Sounds like we agree.

          On the 65million, I commented “in Europe and elsewhere”. The link below may be helpful and is more specific than I was. Please let me know.

          Did you find my response to the question you asked about how the RNC could handle doing away with Trump helpful in some way? It was in response to your comment/question in Joe’s thread “Classic New York Daily News Anti-Trump Front Page”.

          • KP

            Much appreciated on correcting my spelling error(s).

            Refugee _not the same_ as refuge.

          • Brownies girl

            KP – thanks for the link. Of the 65 million refugees you cited, it seems that that includes “40.8 million people internally displaced within their own countries.” So as of now, these 40+ million are NOT seeking refuge in European (or elsewhere) countries — they’re sticking at home, at least for now. It’s this latter math that was screwing up my head. Thanks for clearing it up.

            As to your question regarding your response to a comment I made on Joe’s thread, “Classic New York Daily News Anti-Trump Front Page”, you know, I honest to God didn’t read it (was off line for a few days) — and now can’t find it. I need a link for that too.
            I really dislike this system we’re now working with on TMV – we used to get notifications if someone responded — and then we could respond back. Wish we could go back to that. Meantime — send a link to that thread if you can. Am truly sorry I didn’t respond, I honestly didn’t see it. Thanks. BG

            PS – it is 30C outside right now 9 pm – (85F) and humid as hell downtown. I am suffering the heat — and hate it with a passion. Do not ever wish for hyperhydrosis — especially from the head. Sweat running from your scalp into your eyes stings like hell. The A/C is on the fritz, thank the lord for fans!

          • KP
          • KP

            Be safe. I have a floatie with your name on it if you ever visit San Diego.

          • KP

            I also have a hard time finding responses. I find this helpful ==>

            In the header is a “click” titled “AUTHORS & EDITORIAL STAFF”.

            If you recall who the original poster was you can easily find all posts by all authors.

            In fact, you can access all 59 original posts I have contributed to TMV.

            But be warned, I do not write about politics.

      • dduck

        Some of the 65 million persons are actually: “An internally displaced person (IDP) is someone who is forced to flee his or her home but who remains within his or her country’s borders. They are often referred to as refugees, although they do not fall within the current legal definition of a refugee.”
        They seek refuge where they can.

        • dduck

          I just reread this article and thought it reminded me of something. Although, I must say this is peace (did I spell that right) valley compared to the old days on TMV; thanks TMV posers and commenters.

          • KP

            In the spirit of Brownies girl … … not wishing to be rude) posers is spelled posters 🙂


          • dduck

            Oh thank you kind sir, although that doesn’t count if it was a Freudian slip

        • KP

          Yes, more accurate than the way I commented.

          To be clear, I am trying to understand “LEAVING” as are many others.

          Bob commented with some interesting data relative to age and voting.

          I wonder what the voting would resemble if “Little England” (something like the fly over zone in the US but the north in England) is also broken down vs the “elite” down south and the midlands.

          • KP

            I am guessing the “disgusting imbecils” are geographically gathered together and there is much in breeding 🙂

          • Brownies girl

            It’s spelled “imbeciles” —- (eye-rolling thingy). Snerk!

          • KP


            With affection, “Yer killin’ me, Smalls”.

          • dduck

            See Shmoos, they are similar.

        • Brownies girl

          dd writes: “……They are often referred to as refugees, although they do not fall within the current legal definition of a refugee. They seek refuge where they can.”

          Thanks dd, for the clarification. You’re right. BG

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