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Posted by on Jun 21, 2006 in At TMV | 28 comments

And So American Political Rhetoric Sinks To A New Low

You have to pause and ask yourself what has happened to American political debate when people can say crap like this and others can welcome it and agreeingly nod their heads, wanting more.

FOOTNOTE: Yours truly does not agree with many of the blogs that want an immediate pullout from Iraq. But the comment linked above is beyond inaccurate. It is truly worthy of utter contempt. Meanwhile, I just heard a talk show host on the left an hour ago claim that people in the Bush administration could easily cut people’s heads off. THAT was also truly worthy of contempt. So, you see, the guy linked to on the right has a mirror image on the left.

So you never realized that part of the blogosphere has been happy that two young Americans were unspeakably butchered in Iraq? You didn’t?

Well, neither has the blogosophere. We ALL learn something new every day.

It’s hate radio folks (on the right and left). Part of an overall hate politics. And, yes, sometimes it spills over into the blogsophere — but not in the way the link above says. The assertion in the link above is — shall we be highly charitable? — a luncheon meat made by Oscar Meyer. And we don’t mean ham. There are other words, but we don’t write about bovine excretory functions here.

This issue is not “accuracy.” It’s the growing, festering, unchecked partisan hatred that has become so profound in this country that the goal is no longer to debate issues and to convince but to destroy, discredit and even take out opponents (a popular new technique is to expose the identities of anonymous bloggers with whom you disagree).

American political debate has become poisoned and it shows no sign of getting better.

If the linked statement above, the recent Ann Coulter comments about 911 widows being oh so happy that their husbands are dead so they can get a lot of attention and money, and the comments of that liberal talk show host are considered acceptable and not demanding instant repudiation on the part of patriots of ALL parties, then where will this country be in 10 years in terms of political debate?

You’ve heard of road rage?

Welcome to 21st Century America: the age of Political Rage.

PS: Mr. L. So just what are all these leftist sites that WELCOME the butchering of American soldiers?

For your information, patriots come in ALL religions, belong to ALL political parties.

Democrats and independents were outraged today when we heard the news as well.

Did only Republicans die in our country’s many wars?

Or were there — and are there — Democrats’ and independents’ names among the military dead, too?

Did these leftist blogs you read have names?

And back to those leftist websites you read. Were they tiny ones or ones with lots of hits? How many leftist blogs are there? And out of those, how many of them “welcome” the brutal deaths of these two young men? Specifically what are the URLs of those sites that “welcome” the deaths of these brave American young people who are serving in a capacity that YOU never served in (and I never served in)?

You’ll get your audience, Mr. L, because you, like Coulter and that guy on the left, realize that the culture of outrageousness and demonization is what “sells” and connects. Balance? How 19th (not even 20th) century.

You and that guy on the left will get lots of listeners. But we know of one who neither of you will get.

Just look at how our political debate has declined by reading that link above. It’s irrelevant whether you like leftist blogs or not. You KNOW that leftist blogs are NOT “welcoming” the mutilation, likely decapitation and reported eye-gouging of those young men.

Now project where we are now. Project where we’ll be in 10 years from now if this continues.

Scary isn’t it?

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Copyright 2006 The Moderate Voice
  • Eural

    Sadly, the people that really need to read – and think – about this never really do. I have a friend who’s a died in the wool “dittohead” and I constantly give him examples of Limbaugh’s distortions and lies concerning the left. He just says Limbaugh’s the only one really “telling it like it is” and if he gets a few things wrong now and again it still close enough to the truth it doesn’t matter. Colbert can’t make this stuff up. By the way he had the same response when I sent him this news item as well – basically, we all know what the left is like and deep down they are happy for these murders so Limbaugh is just saying what everyone’s really thinking. And Joe, by merely pointing this out you have revealed your obvious partisan, liberal agenda. Scary, scary, stuff.

  • merlallen

    It’s possible that the junkie wrote the email himself.

  • merlallen

    I told my ditto head friend that only a fool listens to anything a junkie says.

  • Mike P.

    “So, you see, the guy linked to on the right has a mirror image on the left.”

    Joe, I don’t know who the host is that you’re talking about, but I can say, most assuredly, he is not the Left’s “mirror image” of Rush. There is no such creature. What are Rush’s audience numbers? What is the Left’s host’s?

    No, there are no Left mirror images of the Right’s hate mongers. Who’s the Left’s Hannity? Who’s Liddy? Who’s (Weiner) Savage? Who’s Malkin, Coulter, Hinderaker… Who is Anita Bryant, for that matter? Actually, I guess you got me with Lieberman on that one.

  • Pyst

    The only way to end this constant cycle of editorial/published/talk pundit trash, is for those that are slandered to do exactly what someone in hollywood does when this happens.

    Sue the hell out of them, and force them to recant publically untill they are run off the airwaves, and out of print.

    I really can’t figure out why the people who’s names are drug through the mud with lies don’t fight back. The prime example of this is John Kerry not suing the hell out of the swift boat liars. And don’t get me wrong I am no John Kerry fan, but I can tell that stuff was whipped up in Karl’s lab.

  • Joe

    The issue isn’t audience share; the issue is the kind of rhetoric that is being thrown around.

  • Salmineo

    Thank You Joe.

    It amazes me the ferocity of these Conservative lies. One wonders what kind of self loathing arsehole could possibly make up and broadcast such hate against people he has never met. These neo-con hate propaganda artists routinely lump everybody together under one fantasy stereotype. In reality all these people that neo-cons are condemning, are just everyday people with a different opinion. The neo-con can’t CONVINCE them to change their opinion, because generally all they have is an opinion themselves. So they bash the unseen multitudes from behind closed doors, far away and protected by security guards. Normally should people say these things to other people in person, they stand a very high risk of getting their face kicked in. So the neo-con hides behind a microphone and stirs Americans to hate each other from afar. Cowardly to say the least, but if you query them about this negative behavior in public, Well they say: “Its just a show!”

    Just a show? They NEVER allow anyone to make a solid point against their opinion and never is anyone given uninterrupted time to counter the neo-con opinion, because well its THEIR show.

    Think about this: If indeed it is “just a show”, then these propaganda artists must be silently laughing with disgust at their loyal “ditto-head callers” for stupidly taking the whole damn thing seriously.

    If it is NOT just a show: Then it is organized political propaganda similar too, if not exactly as, the old Soviet propaganda that is always broadcast without a viable differing opinion allowed. Only now its in Colloquial American English.

    However, I think this crap is dangerous to our country because I think it destroys trust among fellow Americans. Apparently damage to our country is irrelevant to people like Limbaugh. Anything for a buck I suppose.

  • Captain Carnage

    Oh dear oh dear….

    Joe posts an insightful message, and immediately people pile on from their own partisan perspective (note singular), thus proving him correct….

    “No, there are no Left mirror images of the Right’s hate mongers. Who’s the Left’s Hannity? Who’s Liddy? Who’s (Weiner) Savage? Who’s Malkin, Coulter, Hinderaker… Who is Anita Bryant, for that matter?”

    So the left is blameless? Hardly. There may not be anti-Coulter, a bizzaro Hannity or a doppleganger-Limbaugh, but the left has it’s own pantheon of divisive extremists.

    Come to think of it, I’m not feeling the love from any of the earlier commenters here either…. Salmineo, you thank Joe for his words, and immediately launch into an attack on conservatives! Then you finish with

    “However, I think this crap is dangerous to our country because I think it destroys trust among fellow Americans. Apparently damage to our country is irrelevant to people like Limbaugh.”

    which is almost a return to objective moderation – but for the the invocation of Limbaugh.

    I don’t live in the US, but the polarisation vibes reach all the way down to Aus, and it’s not pretty.

  • Steve-O

    This isn’t a new low. The conservative talkers have been doing this kind of strawman stuff for YEARS.

    Glad to see the moderates are picking up on this.

    As a self-identified liberal, I don’t shy away from the stigma attached to the label just because of cyst-covered a-holes like Rush. I’m a regular guy, and hopefully I can undo some of the damage by letting my lawnmower-riding suburnite neighbors know that they guy who they trust to pick up their mail when they go out of town is a… Liberal.

    Anybody who wants to see what liberals think of the war can ask one. We promise not to turn you gay and force you to kill your babies.

  • SnarkyShark

    The problem is that the mshy middle has long moaned about the deplorable discourse. They cry out for civility, and then reward the very ones who are the perpetrators.

    Rove insinuates that Kerry arranged to award himself medals and be convienently wounded, and moderates buy into it with no apparent critical thinking at all.

    My brother is squarely in the middle of the road, and I just quit talking to him about any of it. Moderates seem to get pissed off more about being told the truth than about the criminbals who perpetuate the actual deed. Blame the messenger if you will.

    Another thing I notice is if you tell them Bush is doing or will do something, they will say “no way would he do that”, and yet time after time he does exactly that.Fortunatly I notice the see no evil crowd is finally starting to wake up.

    My values are strictly moderate, and always have been. What makes me a flaming liberal apparently is the fact that I woke up early and saw exactly what the right was up to, and how much of it was based on lies.

    The future of this country really does depend on the moderates getting a clue. Lets just hope its not too late.

  • Rudi

    I don’t remember any “moonbats” calling SC voters with the “ni**er baby” McCain attack.
    Where’s Bush comdenation?
    Sri Lanka adoption
    I know for a fact that these calls didn’t originate from NH. This has gotten worse sinse Lee Atwater and Reagan’s killing the “Fairness doctrine”.

  • Holly in Cincinnati

    Yes, there ARE “Left mirror images of the Right’s hate mongers” and this center-left Democrat sees them on blogs every day!

  • Rudi

    You confuse commenters with media/blogg pudits. Tell me which “moonbat pundits”, either media analysts or blogg editors, who compare to Savage,Limbaugh or Hannity? Go up to the comments of “guest” on Joe’s post(Murdered American GIs Were “Brutally Tortured), the “Wingnuts” are winning the hate side here. Limbaugh,and the like, screen their calls(Left does too), and controls their spin, commenters are just little fish in the pond. My favorites are LittleGreenFootballs and LibertyPost.

  • Chippedchips

    Joe said: FOOTNOTE: Yours truly does not agree with many of the blogs that want an immediate pullout from Iraq.

    I have to agree…our troops are there and stuck like flies on flypaper with no end to their perils in sight.

    But Joe there is nothing, except the dummy in the white house, and the Pentagon’s SECDEF bureaurat and brasshats prosecuting this war from vicarious postitions, to stop the field commanders in Iraq from re-deploying our troops to defendable positions…simply get them out of the cities and bases, billets, chow halls, supply depots, and airports that have been pretargeted and presighted for hit and run rocket and mortar attacks for the past three years.

    And what the hell would be so wrong with sticking the socalled well trained Iraqi soldiers in the Humvee’s and transport vehicles and having them patrol up and back on those IED laden roads? It is after all the Iraqi’s soldiers own country being fought for isn’t it, and the Iraqi’s freedom and (giggle) democracy at risk..not the U S military.

    Your comments please.

  • Holly in Cincinnati

    I don’t bother to watch or listen to media pundits. Folks, there is such a thing as an “Off” button.

    Here’s another example from the right: Apparently the uncle of one of the murdered soldiers is being smeared:

  • Chippedchips


    Is the definition of a Eural BULLSHIT

    Incidently dolt its dyed not died in the wool.

  • Rudi

    where is the “Left mirror images of the Right’s hate mongers”. John “Moonbat” is a pundit/web editor on the Wingnut side. I think you are more right-center than left-center. I wait for Coulter/Malkin to demand “us Liberals” be interned because we chalenge Bush in this FUBAR war.

  • Rudi

    Chip(Cut and Run?),
    I like that redeployment “within Iraq”, it’s not to far off the Murtha version, even better. I will support this war when Bush/Barnes/Kristol sons and daughters are part of the cannon fodder that the troops are. I’m even willing to push Krauthammer over to the Green Zone so that he can report on this FUBAR war better. Presscott Bush allowed your daddy too fight the good fight, when are the Bush twins going to Basra instead of fighting this war from the gossip pages in Washington.

  • Sundog

    Umm, excuse me? There is NO SUCH THING as “liberal hate radio”, you idiot.

  • Chippedchips


    When I was in the SEATO back in the 60’s I witnessed our GI’s forced to live on top of those permanent fixed pretargeted monuments to fools called “basecamps” and get the living hell shelled out of them by known enemy artillary and mortars day and night.

    There were two one star generals and a boat load of colonels and Lt.colonels that should have been courtmartialed for dereliction of duty because they failed to take action to protect those serving under them.

    But in the U S military hierarchy, just like in the U S corporate hierarchy, instead of cashiering senior officer shitasses when they screw up they get promoted and shuffled out to less harmful positions where they gather mold until they retire.

    But let some junior officer, like an army captain or lower, an NCO, or private screw up and they hang them out to dry.

    In a military hierarchy one having one more stripe or greater command shoulder ornement that gives a degree of superiority over someone else, its the old pass the blame buck shit floats down hill.

    In the Mi Lai 4 incident, Lt. Calley had the shit fall on him alone, when every officer in the chain of command in that operation should have been court martialed. Other than the ability to dump all the crap down hill the officer corps has the amazing ability to cover not only there own asses and cover collusively each other’s asses but cover everything else up. Cause if it ain’t in writing and given as an oral order only…”it” just didn’t happen.

  • Rudi

    What is your thoughts on the Oraqi’s standing up. It is my impression that the US military does not trust the Iraqi military and police. For us to leave they will have to be trained and equipped with a full arsenal (M16 to Bradleys and tanks, also need an air force). One othe the General’s who spoke out against Rumsfeld was training the Iraqi’s, I remember his take was FUBAR. How can they stand up driving around in pick up trucks? No high ups held accountable for abu griab except a female reservist General.

  • Chippedchips

    coupla replies in one:

    First, Steve-O you are a self professed “self-identified liberal.

    Give my your personal definiton of the word liberal please…not for argument just curiosity.


    Since I haven’t been in Iraq since mid 2004, I cannot and will not say what would and could happen if the so called now trained Iraqi army took over for U S troops.

    That’s why I was referring U S military deployment into safe defendable areas. You know, still in Iraq but as observers and ready to pull Iraqi soldiers fat out of the fire should they flop.

    You said tanks and Bradley’s…tell ya what friend beyond hand held weapons like the M-16, M-88 sniper rifles, grenade, flame throwers, mines, Laws rockets, transport trucks and Humvees, and ammunition supplies I could give a hoot in hell whether or not Iraqi’s ever see much less get their hands on tanks, artillary, helicopters or anything faster to fly than a Piper Cub.

    Why? Because at this time nobody in the military could trust them to not turn those tanks Bradleys, artillary on our own people.

    No offense intended but I guess you have to have a strict military mind to remember some things…but…remember Saddam’s personal 200,000 loyalist members of his Republican Guard..(hmmm republican guard no less).

    200,000 very trained, battled hardened, members of the Republican guard, that just after the U S led invasion, took off their uniforms, hid all their weapons and ammuntions, went mufti (wore street clothes) and just blended in with the Iraqi crowd.

    Can anyone say that the same 200,000 members of Saddam’s Republican Guard are still in mufti blending in with the Iraqi crowd and NOT back in uniform in bush’s Iraqi army, and ready to turn like snakes on U S troops at the first opportunity.

    This is just one of the reasons, george walker bush’s father wrote in his book as to why Iraq should not be invaded, because there is no viable way to exit once war is entered.

    Right now at least and within the foreseeable future the worst possible thing the U S could do is equip the Iraqi’s with enough war equipment and material to make war on one of their neighbors, like Kuwait and the Saudi’s or make against an under staffed, material depleted, worn to a frazzle U S military contingent remaining in country.

    Like I said in another reply…our troops are caught between a rock and a hard place and stuck in Iraq as flies on flypaper thanks to george walker bush, cheney, and rumsfeld that know as much about prosecuting a war as my three pet toy poodles do…ZIP!!

    You asked Rudi..and that’s the way I see it, and whether anyone else agrees or not..

  • Chippedchips

    Captain Carnage,

    You know fella, a whole lot about a person can be told by the “handle(s)” they use here on the internet in the political blogs.

    Your handle for instance “Captain Carnage” says, right wing all the way dude…nobody needs to read your comments to figure that out.

    I suppose you believe your handle gives you a degree of importance.

    Did you ever serve in the Australian military Capn? If so which branch of service, what rank, what unit, where at, what was your MOS, how long were you in.

    Somehow me thinks you’re just another down under right wing political chickenhawk armchair warrior with a “FOX”hole dug behind your keyboard that never put his pink meat in harms way and the line of fire.

    However I wish you and your Wallaby well and a
    g’day, as probably do some friends of mine that live out at and in “White Man In a Hole.”

  • Salmineo

    Chips…Captain Carnage is a Rupurt Murdoc clone. We have his data. Thanks for the support.

  • Rudi

    I agree with you 100%. I forgot the General who was training the Iraqi army, he is one of the dissident Generals. My point/s I hinted at was:
    1) No one in MSM Liberal or Con will even talk about the fact that me probablly can’t trust the Iraqi army. Just think what Sadr’s or SCIRI’s militias would do with some real rockets launchers or SAM’s. AirForceOne may go up in a big cloud of smoke.
    2) If we don’t equip the Iraqi army with Humvee’s with TOE missiles and such, no tanks or Bradleys. We cannot ever leave that shit hole with an Army less equipped than Before we attacked. Stand up/Stand down BS we will never leave. Why are we building “Supersized permanent bases” and the new Embassy larger that the Vatican City.

  • Captain Carnage


    nope, never been in the forces. But you know, things happen in the world, and I’m not the sort of person that ignores them because I’m not directly involved. I don’t sit there and say, “I’m not allowed an opinion on Iraq, ‘cos I was never a soldier”.

    That would be stupid.

    So there are those non-serving types that agree with you that do not suffer from the same criticism. What entitles them to an opinion, other than the fact that you agree with what they say?

    I never thought much on it, but my “handle” was the name I used for online games. Apologies to any that find it offensive, perhaps I had better reincarnate.

  • Salmineo

    Captain Carnage

    Reincarnate? May I suggest “Buttwheat”…?

  • Chippedchips

    And So American Political Rhetoric Sinks To A New Low…

    …and just when you don’t think it can get any lower, here comes a jackass, make that kangarooass, with UNINFORMED opinion about a people and/or nation where he does not live and digs the hole deeper and sticks his nose in. Go ahead mate..state your opinions about anything you want…I’ll never see em again.

    I will say one thing about Australia..they’re grasshoppers are a helluvalot bigger than ours.

    Apologies to my friends in Perth and White Man In a Hole.

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