Don’t Pull A Gun At A Snowball Fight
You have undoubtedly heard the highlights: Hundreds of 20- and 30-somethings show up for a Twitter fueled snowball fight at 14th and U streets NW in DC on Saturday. All was apparently fun and games until a snowball hit a Hummer driven by an off-duty DC policeman.
He pulled his gun.
Unsurprisingly, many in the geeky crowd had video cameras. Video was quickly posted to YouTube. One tops Bitly.TV right now. (There you can read a live stream of Tweets about it.) The DC police chief just issued this harsh statement:
I have reviewed the video clips and heard from the public. It is very obvious to me that the officer pulled his service weapon in response to the snowballs hitting his vehicle. I have no doubt about this, nor has the officer denied the accusations.
Let me be very clear in stating that I believe the actions of the officer were totally inappropriate! In no way, should he have handled the situation in this manner. We have taken swift action by placing him on non-contact status until all the facts are gathered and discipline is handed down.
Comments anyone? Some snark to get us started, hopefully President Obama will steer clear of this one…
30 Responses to “Don’t Pull A Gun At A Snowball Fight”
It's a pretty sorry state of affairs in America when a cop pulls a gun because a SNOWball hit his vehicle when he was driving by a SNOWball fight. Pretty sorry indeed…
The snowballs outside are frightful,
But my gun is so delightful.
No matter what You Tube shows
Temper blows, temper blows, temper blows. (to the tune of “Let it Snow”)
Is it safe to say the officer acted stupidly?
DC ST § 22-1309
Formerly cited as DC ST 1981 § 22-1109
District of Columbia Official Code 2001 Edition Currentness
Division IV. Criminal Law and Procedure and Prisoners.
Title 22. Criminal Offenses and Penalties. (Refs & Annos)
Subtitle I. Criminal Offenses.
Chapter 13. Disturbances of the Public Peace.
§ 22-1309. Throwing stones or other missiles.
It shall not be lawful for any person or persons within the District of Columbia to throw any stone or other missile in any street, avenue, alley, road, or highway, or open space, or public square, or inclosure, or to throw any stone or other missile from any place into any street, avenue, road, or highway, alley, open space, public square, or inclosure, under a penalty of not more than $500 for every such offense.
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Sure the officer overreacted a bit, but the snowball throwers should have been charged with the above offense. They recklessly endangered lives by throwing snowballs at moving cars. Having fun doesn't give you the right to potentially put the lives of others at risk. If they were minors, give them a warning, if adults charge them.
Additionally if the officer had identified himself as such before being hit with a snowball the following should apply:
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DC ST § 22-405
Formerly cited as DC ST 1981 § 22-505
District of Columbia Official Code 2001 Edition Currentness
Division IV. Criminal Law and Procedure and Prisoners.
Title 22. Criminal Offenses and Penalties. (Refs & Annos)
Subtitle I. Criminal Offenses.
Chapter 4. Assault; Mayhem; Threats. (Refs & Annos)
§ 22-405. Assault on member of police force, campus or university special police, or fire department.
(a) For the purposes of this section, the term “law enforcement officer” means any officer or member of any police force operating and authorized to act in the District of Columbia, including any reserve officer or designated civilian employee of the Metropolitan Police Department, any licensed special police officer, any officer or member of any fire department operating in the District of Columbia, any officer or employee of any penal or correctional institution of the District of Columbia, any officer or employee of the government of the District of Columbia charged with the supervision of juveniles being confined pursuant to law in any facility of the District of Columbia regardless of whether such institution or facility is located within the District, any investigator or code inspector employed by the government of the District of Columbia, or any officer or employee of the Department of Youth Rehabilitation Services, Court Services and Offender Supervision Agency, the Social Services Division of the Superior Court, or Pretrial Services Agency charged with intake, assessment, or community supervision.
(b) Whoever without justifiable and excusable cause, assaults, resists, opposes, impedes, intimidates, or interferes with a law enforcement officer on account of, or while that law enforcement officer is engaged in the performance of his or her official duties shall be guilty of a misdemeanor and, upon conviction, shall be imprisoned not more than 180 days or fined not more than $1,000, or both.
The problem isn't that the officer objected to being hit with a snowball or that said snowballers might have been in technical violation of the law. Reacting the way he did showed he was humor-impaired, a not uncommon thing in police officers, and no big deal.
The problem is that he PULLED A GUN on people who were not engaged in any activity that justified potential deadly force. (You should never pull out a gun you're not prepared to use, particularly if you are a police officer). This demonstrates that said police officer has questionable judgement.
Really, Leo!!
If we charged everyone who ever threw a snowball “into any street, avenue, road, or highway, alley, open space, public square, or inclosure” everyone in America would have a criminal record. Assuming of course that one considers a snowball to be a “missile.” I'd take that case in a heartbeat just for the fun of arguing that “missile” in the context of a snowball fight is unconstitutionally vague under the Fourth, Fifth and Fourteenth Amendments. BTW, I'd think I'd have a very good chance of winning the way the statute is written.
In that context, I especially would like to see the D.C. attorney's office try to justify the illegality of throwing a snowball into an “open space”…one of the statutes prohibitions.
This is a winter play activity, a friggin' snowball fight. Must we really criminalize everything? Criminy jeepers.
A bit? A bit?? Gee, d'ya think? I'll do you the favor of assuming you're playing devils advocate here, otherwise your judgement is as failed as the officer's. Yup, you guessed it, I'm playing the common sense card!
I see nothing wrong with charging an arresting someone who put their own jollies over the public saftey by pelting the cars of unsuspecting motorist driving in sub optimal condition.
If they are kids give em a warning, if they are adults apply the law.
The common sense card says you don't pelt moving cars with something that might distract or impair the driver. The common sense card says you get a bit pissed when you see someone who does such a pelting. so yeah the police officer over reacted a bit, but he did not point the gun, nor fire it.
The other police who arrived did a great job. There are so many things to thank our law enforcement officials for, yet some folk would rather try to sensationalize a minor overreaction and lose sight of the big picture.
Leo – Get off your high horse and get real. Tell me about all the times you voluntarily requested a ticket and fine for everytime you endangered public saftety by speeding. Ever drive with a couple of beers under your belt? I suspect you have personally endanged public safety in your car much more significantly than these couple of snowballs. Should officers pull their gun everytime they stop a speeder? Leo – you are out in lala land on this one.
A cop who is an a**hole, now that's a first…
And a conservative who approves, also a first…
Leonidas -
You sure you're not a closet lefty? Sounds all too politically correct to me…sort of like smoking bans (public safety), hate crimes (safety of a protected of a class), gun control (public safety). Just asking.
Anyway I think we need to make an amendment. Instead of life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness, it should read “that all people are created equal and endowed with certain inalienable rights…life, liberty, the pursuit of happiness and the right to have a little fun every once in a while.” You & your left wing friends, with all of your politically correct let's-make-having-fun-a-crime notwithstanding. Still smiling.
Yeah, I know, it can be distracting to have a snowball hit your car. Been there. Yeah, most law enforcement do a great job. But, like any profession, there are great, there are good and there are ugh. Pulling a gun at a snowball fight is way, way over the edge…way beyond “a bit”. Legal point, the statute is actually not a crime…it's a violation…like spitting on the sidewalk or jaywalking is a violation. Pulling a gun over a violation is so far out of bounds, so far beyond standard police procedure and practice, I can't believe it requires a comment.
Now, serious, be intellectually honest and respond to my point that the statute in question (the part you conveniently left out when quoting me), by your interpretation of “missile” would make it a violation, subject to a $500 fine, to throw a snowball into an “open space.” Do you agree with that, or do you just want to enforce the parts of the statute you like? You see, Leo, if you're going to enforce one part you have to be willing to enforce it all.
Happy holidays. Nice to have a bone to pick with you again…I was getting really bored agreeing with you the last several weeks.
Do I complain about the officer when I get pulled for speeding and post something on You Tube? Nope. I recognize that I broke the law and I suffer the consequences. I've had a cop reach his gun one when I was pulled and reached for my glove compartment for my registration, did I make a big deal about it? nope. I understood his being cautious and explained my intent clearly and did not threaten him.
Some of us appreciate what the police do for us, even when its not in our favor and we have to face the music for our own irresponsibility.
Not at the risk of the lives of others I think. I have no problem with willing particcipants lobbing snowballs at each other and not potentially causing an accident, but I can't condone folks being jerks and risking injury to others to have some fun.
*throws a snowball at Tidbits (who is not operating a car)* =P
Leo, “Do I complain about the officer when I get pulled for speeding and post something on You Tube? Nope. I recognize that I broke the law and I suffer the consequences. I've had a cop reach his gun one when I was pulled and reached for my glove compartment for my registration, did I make a big deal about it? nope. I understood his being cautious and explained my intent clearly and did not threaten him.”
So…. you're saying that you knowingly put others in danger and you're happy to accept the responsibility of a ticket? What about some time in the future when you knowingly put others in danger and then seriously hurt or kill someone?
Laws are meant to protect people and punishment (fines, jail time) are meant to deter people from putting others at risk. It doesn't seem that the fees deter you from breaking the law. I guess there should be stiffer penalties.
Why will you not answer the question I have twice asked and now ask a third time?
“Now, serious, be intellectually honest and respond to my point that the statute in question (the part you conveniently left out when quoting me), by your interpretation of “missile” would make it a violation, subject to a $500 fine, to throw a snowball into an “open space.” Do you agree with that, or do you just want to enforce the parts of the statute you like? You see, Leo, if you're going to enforce one part you have to be willing to enforce it all.”
Are you really that afraid of admitting that someone other than you may have made a point? This is beginning to remind me of the “hiking up the skirt” discussion, though not to that extreme. Quit dodging the question.
I agree that people who throw objects at cars, distracting drivers are putting others at risk. However in this situation there is a snowstorm, the police officer is driving slowly down a street with kids throwing snowballs. As a driver it is his responsibility to be aware of his surroundings. Being hit by a snowball when you see kids throwing snowballs all around you should be no surprise.
If I were driving through that area it would be my responsibility to make sure I did not hit anyone with my car and I'd keep my eyes open. If I am not willing (or able) to be aware of my surroundings in such situations especially during a snowstorm, then I'd stay at home.
If these were kids who were hiding behind bushes and throwing snowballs at unsuspecting cars, then they should be arrested.
Forget trying to convince Leonides, just challenge him to a snowball fight instead. It can be in a park so that no passing motorists need to be further inconvenienced.
Frith_Ra,
Thanks. I'm not trying to convince Leonidas. I am simply frustrated that he takes an obviously, and clearly identified, humorous part of a comment and treats it like it was meant seriously, but will not reply to the part of the comment that was clearly identified as serious.
Yes, I understand your point about Leo's intransigence. Unfortunately it's hard to challenge someone to a snowball fight in Scottsdale for reasons beyond my control. Appreciate your comment.
No and Yes. No, because I do not believe that speeding in some cases puts people at greater risks, sometimes driving the speed limit does this in my view and there are some studies that support this. Yes because I realize that right or wrong in my assessment I have to accept the laws of society and I don't gripe about it except for lobbying to change speed limits based on such studies.
Now there have been sometimes when I was definately speeding more than an arguably more safe speed, but aside from a silly time of irresponsible youth, these have always been unintentional. I don't speed to make up for being late. I was an idiot jerk sometimes when i was younger, and thats a fact. I also shot bottle rockets at moving security cars as a kid. That was stupid too, I grew up.
When that happens you can rightly call me a hypocrite. Until then….
I wonder what would have happen 20 years ago If a White Officer or person would have road up on snow ball fight ??
Sorry I missed your question, here goes.
Yeah I don't put much weight on that part either.
Perhaps this law could apply instead, it is similar.
DC ST § 22-1308
Formerly cited as DC ST 1981 § 22-1108
District of Columbia Official Code 2001 Edition Currentness
Division IV. Criminal Law and Procedure and Prisoners.
Title 22. Criminal Offenses and Penalties. (Refs & Annos)
Subtitle I. Criminal Offenses.
Chapter 13. Disturbances of the Public Peace.
§ 22-1308. Playing games in streets.
It shall not be lawful for any person or persons to play the game of football, or any other game with a ball, in any of the streets, avenues, or alleys in the City of Washington; nor shall it be lawful for any person or persons to play the game of bandy, shindy, or any other game by which a ball, stone, or other substance is struck or propelled by any stick, cane, or other substance in any street, avenue, or alley in the City of Washington, under a penalty of not more than $5 for each and every such offense.
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However, I think the missile one is more appropriate since the target in this case were moving cars and not just being accidentally struck by a ball or frisbee, but intentionally targeted.
Sorry took your “humorous” part as being serious and your “serious” part as being humorous. Anyhow have responded now.
No excuses, coward! Mudballs at 20 paces! =P
Then we'll meet in my yard here outside of Denver & throw snowballs until the road is clear. ;D
“No excuses, coward! Mudballs at 20 paces! =P”
Now that might get someone arrested since you cannot pick up mud without picking up rocks & throwing rocks or other missiles …. :þ
Fine, Leo, mudballs at 20 paces. Loser buys the beer.
Ah, hell, you can't make mudballs here either; it's all sand. Let's just have a beer.
Frith_Ra,
No snowballs. Snowballs only grow where it's cold. There's a reason I live in Scottsdale. Though Denver is lovely…in the summer.
Just join Leo & I for a beer. All this talk of snowballs and mudballs and having fun is making me feel like a criminal.
Snowball Beer Summit it Is!
Tidbits: I like this less filling beer
Leonidas: I like it because it tastes great
Tidbits: Less filling!
Leonidas: Tastes Great!
Hmm better order another round, this could take a bit to resolve =D
Sounds good, Leo.
If we go to the Buffalo Chip Saloon and Dance Hall, where they have live bulls for the bull riding Wednesday and Friday, we could pick up “something” off the ground to throw. But, you'll need to keep your politically correct, commie views to yourself. This is an open carry state, and the ones who don't carry enforce their love of liberty with the butt end of a pool cue.
Double Jack up, Bartender.
This officer was absolutely and totally out of line. You can try and justify his actions by stating the sections of the code that can j be made to apply to the citizen's actions, howeve:
It is apparent to me (IMHO) tha the officer was angered by anyone having the AUDACITY to throw a (several) snowballs at MY HUMMER!
He exited his vehicle with anger and was seeking someone to punish for their infraction against his dignity. He was soon emotionally overcome by his inability to establish CONTROL over the situation and chose to resort to his most threatening tool in an attempt to regain the respect he felt he was not being offered from the citizens.
At that point the citizens became the defacto victims of his personality disorder.
LEOs are held to a higher standard of behavior than ordinary citizens (for good reason).
Imagine your reaction had this been an ordinary citizen with a concealed weapons permit, who exited his vehicle and behaved in this mannerwhile attempting to place the “snowball offender” under citizens arrest for your missle infraction.
Watch the video and observe Det, Baylor's posture and see if you feel that he is being phsyically menacing and behaving in a manner that warrants review and censure from his department.
I certainly see it. Being a cop is a brutal, horrible profession. It is very difficult to come trhough a career without some sort of personality problems.
I observed the tricked out hummer, the giant fur lined coat and the gold necklace worn on top of his shirt. Add those to the physically agressive posturing, his verbal taunting of the citizens, much less the misuse of his sidearm. You draw your own conclusion.
This man needs p
sychiatric evaluation from his department. For his health, the safety of those he works alongside and the public he serves.