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Health Care Reform: Why So Damn Difficult?

Confession time: I’m still all over the board on the health care reform debate. I share the cost concerns of the cost concerned. I share the coverage concerns of the coverage concerned. I like the “cooperatives” idea; but I’m not opposed to the “public plan” idea, especially if it can be honestly structured to “compete on a level playing field with private insurers,” as suggested by Sen. Schumer and seconded by Sen. Specter. Better yet, “the Schumer proposal is in line with the principles of the major reform campaign Health Care for America Now” or HCAN.

Great. I hope it works out, although what still bothers me about this debate is why such incredible energy is spent on seeking an administrative role for government, rather than keeping its role focused on setting rules.

For instance, Congress could develop a comprehensive set of rules, starting with some of the features of Medicare cited by frequent TMV commenter “GreenDreams,” including …

no eligibility requirements or physicals
no exclusion of pre-existing conditions
no cancellation for excess use of services
no penalty for moving or changing jobs
no re-applying for coverage if moving or changing jobs

Congress could then add to or elaborate on those rules with HCAN’s principles, including …

Health care benefits should cover all necessary care including preventative services and treatment needed by those with serious and chronic diseases and conditions.

Health care coverage with out-of-pocket costs including premiums, co-pays, and deductibles [should be] based on a family’s ability to pay for health care and without limits on payments for covered services.

[Establish a] watchdog role on all plans, to assure that risk is fairly spread among all health care payers and that insurers do not turn people away, raise rates, or drop coverage based on a person’s health history or wrongly delay or deny care.

And then, rather than create another massive, complex government program, Congress would do nothing more than require every current and would-be insurer — public or private, for-profit or not — to either follow the rules or face penalties or get out of the way.

Sure, those rules are tough, and they might force every private insurer to respond, “Go to hell; no can do.” And then we end up with a single-payer, government-run system, after all. But I doubt that happens. I doubt it happens because, in my limited experience, where there’s a daunting challenge, there’s a million or more people willing to tackle it. It’s the ultimate American genome: “Hey, there’s an unclimbable mountain; let’s climb it.” (I know that sounds “pollyanna,” but I also think the point stands.)

And thus, I’ll repeat (with great naivete) the question in the title of this post: Why is this so damn difficult? If we all effectively agree that everyone should have a shot at good health care, why do we insist on complicating it with discussions about massive programs rather than forceful, comprehensive, fair-minded rules of the road? Wouldn’t the latter get us to the same place without all the associated trouble and cost and concern?

* * *

ADDENDUM In the comments, DLS and CStanley raise the “gotcha” factor that I conveniently overlooked in the preceding text; it’s essentially the same “gotcha” factor that Dr. Darshak Sanghavi raised in his June 23 contribution to Slate:

Not everybody can have everything, and the sooner we admit that, the sooner our health care debate will get realistic.

In other words, the “rules” suggested above can’t be the only rules. Any entity — private or public — to stay solvent, will need to exercise limits (and be allowed to exercise limits) on what and how much is covered. Even in the fairest plans, there will be a percentage of people who face the prospect of either paying more out of pocket or, to be blunt, suffering and perhaps dying. There’s not enough money or good will in the world to prevent that from happening.

But none of that counters the fundamental point of this post: That government might best fulfill its purpose by establishing rules/guidelines rather than administering programs.

That said, I’m intrigued by CStanley’s combination, rules-plus-programs scenario:

The best system IMO would be govt encouragement of healthcare savings accounts for our routine care, affordable catastrophic care packages for most working people (insurance companies would offer these and can also offer boutique coverage for more stuff if the market will bear it, but premiums would be appropriately high), keep Medicaid for the working poor or unemployable, and create a govt funded option for a pool of high risk patients.

And with that, I think I have answered why this subject is so damn difficult: Because, it seems, there’s always another factor to consider; there’s always another intriguing proposal to debate. So it goes.

  • jwest
    All the problems with healthcare could be easily solved if one law was passed that stated:

    “It is illegal for any insurance company or government program to pay for a medical procedure that will not extend the life of the patient for at least one year (as determined by statistical studies based on age, gender, pre-existing conditions and other ailments).”

    Until you stop giving heart/lung transplants to 82 year olds, you’re never going to be able to treat all the kids in the country.

    If the person has the cash, naturally they can do whatever they want. But if it’s a shared risk as with insurance or public money, heroic measures are not justified to prolong the heartbeats of people who are trying their best to die.
  • DLS
    J. West -- some are already examining not only quantity but quality of life conferred by treatment. This is, for example, being incorporated into the latest revision of the scheme for organ allocation related to transplantation. Think of it in real-world terms as an "official" rationalization of the obvious logical move to allocate poorer-quality organs (from poorer-quality, i.e., older and sicker, donors) to older and sicker recipients.

    This is in addition to what you originally have addressed, something known for ages, avoidance of "futility."
  • DLS
    I'll note one thing here that merits mention even though it's tangential to the process of reform itself, namely that so many people are misleading themselves and others by referring to preventive care and so much more in addition to catastrophic care as "insurance" [sic]. It is nothing of the kind. Insurance is for unwanted events that we usually don't experience and we don't want to experience. Injury or other illness requiring hospitalization (such as after an auto collision or being shot) is an example of what we mean by events against which we insure ourselves, in other words, typical events associated with catastrophe and "catastropic care."

    What so often is referred to as insurance is nothing of the kind (preventive, routine care being the most glaring example). This instead is pre-paid (installment-plan) health care, typically comprehensive care.

    Pre-paid comprehensive health care is no more "insurance" [sic] than Social Security old-age payments.
  • DLS
    "Why is this so damn difficult?"

    Many special interests and an enormous amount of money are at stake, that's why.
  • CStanley
    It's also probably not economically feasible for private insurance to meet all of those mandates- at least not without the change in mindset that DLS recommends (from assuming that 'health insurance' pays for everything vs. having it as a safety net for catastrophic illness or accident.

    If we keep the current mindset and believe the myth that we pay into a pooled risk group for comprehensive care for life, and all of the above requirements were mandated, then the already out of control price of health insurance would go through the stratosphere. And more and more working people, including most of the middle class, would be unable to afford the premiums.

    The best system IMO would be govt encouragement of healthcare savings accounts for our routine care, affordable catastrophic care packages for most working people (insurance companies would offer these and can also offer boutique coverage for more stuff if the market will bear it, but premiums would be appropriately high), keep Medicaid for the working poor or unemployable, and create a govt funded option for a pool of high risk patients.

    At the same time though there are a slew of reforms that are needed to actually address cost. These would include trust busting to create more competition in the health insurance industry, nationalize the regulation of health insurance industry to allow people to purchase insurance across state lines, reform medical recordkeeping to streamline admin costs, decouple insurance from employment by levelling the tax advantages for those who purchase their own insurance, address supply issues of providers and tech equipment, tort reform, etc, etc.

    It's not a perfect solution- to some extent we have to face facts that health care is expensive because it is. But I think this is the best combination to both reduce costs (mainly by restoring more competition and addressing supply) and improve people's ability to get coverage.

    Most of the plans that have been on the table are exclusively concerned with increasing coverage as though this magically brings down costs. Most notably absent from those discussions are the effects of increasing demand without concommitant increase in supply- which can lead to only one of two things- higher costs or rationing.
  • Father_Time
    Plans, plans, plans....

    I see all this as a transition to full national healthcare because it is the logical conclusion. It must be a transition of some degree of gradual change or the shock to the current system would be catastrophic.

    COSTS! Nothing "planned" addresses the cost of the current "system". These “plans” only addresses the payment of these stupefying costs. In America, healthcare costs megabucks over the cost of healthcare in virtually the rest of all the world, but statistics show our system is no better and even worse in many areas that other modern countries!

    Just get a plan in place and start making adjustments to it. People must be idiots to think that everything can be changed and solved in One Bill!
  • Just as I've been continually accused of ignoring the costs of "Medicare for all" I think proposals such as those by CS ignore the costs. HSAs are pre-tax, reducing federal revenue, increasing the deficit. Same with leveling the playing field by letting me deduct my insurance cost like those with employer-paid plans. All this is being discussed because somehow, opponents of expanding an already existent program feel the need to keep the insurance companies happy and profitable, though they provide nothing that actually contributes to health care, and much that diminishes it. The suggestion that covering essentially all health services for all would break the bank, is belied by the years of experience globally with single payer systems, that provide better care at lower cost.

    And, as I've stated many times, setting limits is essential, and is already done in both nonprofit and for-profit models, by limits of coverage. I agree (rare as that is) with DLS, that end of life procedures and costs need to be limited. This makes sense, as "The 2008 edition of the Dartmouth Atlas of Health Care found that providing Medicare beneficiaries with severe chronic illnesses with more intense health care in the last two years of life—increased spending, more tests, more procedures and longer hospital stays—is not associated with better patient outcomes."

    The current, actual cost of Medicare is under $7,000 a year ($300 billion/43 million), for a population most likely to need services, the elderly. This compares favorably to the average health care cost for ALL Americans ($7,439). With a younger, more broad based "risk pool" the cost of "Medicare for all" would come down significantly. There are no hidden costs in these numbers, no "unfunded liabilities", just the money actually spent divided by the population served. Thus, expanding Medicare to anyone who wants it, would instantly incorporate all those features highlighted above, at a total cost actually less than the current model that does not include those features.
  • Let me update that.

    The ACTUAL annual cost for Medicare is under $7000 per person. That's 2007, the latest year I can find. It's $300 billion / 43 million covered. That is 100% of the cost actually paid, including all admin and fraud ($40 billion). That is the per person annual cost of covering the highest cost risk pool in the business, the elderly, from 65 to end of life. The cost of health care for ALL Americans was $7,436 per person for 2004, the latest year I could find, and was going up at 6.7% annually, so should be about $9,000 a year in 2007. There is so much scare talk on this subject, but it appears the actual cost of health care for the highest cost segment of the public is less per person than the average of the overall population, including young healthy adults and children.

    Now if you think I'm coloring those facts in any way, please enlighten me. There is no projection or estimation involved at all, just the actual cost divided by the actual served population. Let me note additionally, that the 65+ population is included in the group of "all Americans", bringing the average down somewhat, so the cost of health care for the younger pool per covered person is bound to be higher.
  • Dr J
    GreenDreams, even the 2005 numbers were higher than that. Medicare paid $7,064 per beneficiary, and that was less than half of the cost of their care. Since then Medicare's payments have nearly doubled, from $265 billion to $484 billion expected in 2009.
  • Thanks. Any update on the total cost of all Americans, including out of pocket?
  • montanaduse
    Pete, one thing you should considr is the 100,000+ jobs which may be lost under Obama's plan. Healthcare is one of the largest employers in the nation.

    At my web site, http://www.gorillamedicalsales.com , which is a job board for medical device sales representatives and pharmaceutical representatives to find sales jobs, I have noticed a dramatic downturn in the number of jobs posted as medical companies adopt a wait-and-see attitude towards filling vacan sales positions.

    This is but another negative ramification of medical socialization.
  • Zzzzz
    I can't believe we actually agree on something. (jwest that is)
  • CStanley
    GD, as far as I'm concerned, your complaints about shrinking the federal coffers under a scenario I proposed are unfounded because you fail to consider that I'm also proposing far less liability for the feds to pay for. What the heck is wrong with people spending their own money on healthcare- considering that the increase in competition really would drive prices down, while there is absolutely nothing in the current proposal that really does that- instead of sending the money to DC and then having the government pay out for our healthcare?

    montanaduse also points out a very relevant topic that I forgot to mention- massive unemployment that will result if we topple the private insurance industry. Perhaps instead of continuing to accuse me and other conservatives of having some protectionist motivation for the big insurance companies, you should stop to consider that those companies employ millions of people? (BTW, since several people in these healthcare threads have complained when conservatives call the liberal plans socialistic, can't we also ask in reverse for you to steer clear of all the ad hominems about our motivations, ie, stop implying that we're corporatist capitalist pigs?)

    And one final point about your repeated accusation along those lines that I must be interested in protecting the big insurance companies- how in the world do you think they would embrace my proposal to break them up and stop all the megamergers?
  • Dr J
    GreenDreams, if you believe more Kaiser Foundation numbers, a little over $8000 per person. If the over-65s are 10% of the population and are paying $14K on average (per the previous link), that means the under-65s average $7300.

    What's not obvious to me in these Kaiser numbers is how many times the dollars are getting counted. If you just divide the total size of the health care industry by the population (as they appear to have done), you'll count a dollar once when an employer pays it to an insurer, again when the insurer pays it to a hospital, a third time when the hospital pays it to a nurse, and maybe a fourth when the nurse pays it to her union. Though it will have had bites taken out of it at each stage. Anyway, I'm not sure how far I trust these numbers.

    Nor am I sure what conclusion the numbers lead up to. It's well known that the old need more health care than the young, and as I'm discovering lately, the middle-aged need more as well. You yourself have said that the dominant rising health care cost is end-of-life treatment. So it will take some heroics to show that Medicare covers the old for less than the young.
  • CS, I'm not "complaining" about shrinking federal revenue. I'm pointing out the internal inconsistency of your position. I believe you have many times "complained" about the cost of a single-payer system or "public option." "How will you pay for it?" I'm asking the same question. Believe me, I'm all for the federal government giving me the tax break that YOU currently get for your health insurance. And the ability to put pre-tax dollars into a HSA. It's flagrantly unfair that the small but remarkably productive group of us who run small businesses, or work in them, or are entrepreneurs, get to foot the bill for all of you employer paid insurance people, plus all of those on government health-care plans. The uninsured help pay for YOUR insurance while getting no services for their contribution.

    Your suggestion the that competition "really would drive prices down" is just unfounded. Insurance prices have skyrocketed, far above the cost of actual medical care. Insurance companies profit up 500%. Multimillion dollar salaries. The "competitive" model is a complete joke, in terms of driving prices down. Indeed, the consolidation of an unregulated insurance industry has set up a monopolistic system, as I've pointed out, where 94% of markets are uncompetitive. You really think you're going to break up these companies, which obviously own Congress? With respect to consumers driving down prices by having control of the pursestrings, most here have already admitted that 1) sick or injured patients can't really negotiate with providers ("I'm not gonna pay $12 for a bandage. I'll give you $8"), and 2) if you mean saving money by not going to the doctor at all, I don't see that improving public health OR the employment of medical providers. As for "nothing in the current proposal" that reduces prices, as I've pointed out many times, the government, Medicare, negotiates a rate for doctors 19% below private patients, and 25% less for hospitals. I hope you see that private individuals have no chance to negotiate that kind of reduction. Even private insurers are unable to negotiate anything close to that savings. So "sending the money to DC" in fact creates a bigger negotiating position, which is the ONLY way we'll get prices down. Plus their lower overhead and lack of profit saves even more. I've documented 31% savings for doctors and 37% for hospitals. I don't think there is ANY proposal in the "free market" status quo that stands a chance of achieving those savings. If there is, why haven't we seen it already?

    As for your concerns, and those of montanaduse, about medical jobs, I didn't hear any of those concerns when we were talking about the auto industry and its associated supplier businesses, the source of over one million jobs. You said let them fail. There are better ways to create new jobs and save current ones than bleeding federal dollars into insurance companies and a discriminatory system (remember, the feds pick up over $2000 a year of YOUR insurance, but not mine). And I would point out to montanaduse that we are in a critical unemployment crisis right now that affects all sectors. The idea that the healthcare sector should be exempt from this just underscores to me how privileged they feel. Heaven forbid that insurance company moguls making an average of $14 million a year might have to actually get a job that contributes to something other than "increasing shareholder wealth."

    So let's say you get your way. The cost of health care is currently a major factor in America's uncompetitiveness ($1500 worth of health care in an automobile, for example). But since you'd rather see the auto industry fail than the insurance industry, they fail. The insurance companies lose yet another million customers and the entire system starts to crumble. The remaining insurance Co. customers have to pay more to pick up the slack (fewer customers to split the $14,000,000 in CEO pay for instance), and more of them unable to afford it, lose their insurance, further worsening the plight of the insurance companies. Well, good luck with that model. I don't think you answered my question about whether you're willing to bail out the insurance companies when they need a handout.
  • Dr J
    "I don't think there is ANY proposal in the "free market" status quo that stands a chance of achieving those savings. If there is, why haven't we seen it already?"

    Because we don't have a free market, as deep down you already know. Your left hand is complaining that you subsidize us on employer-sponsored plans, while your right is claiming the market is unregulated. Perhaps you're just voluntarily subsidizing us?
  • Well, unregulated in the sense of constraints. I should have said unconstrained by regulation, yet tax-favored at our expense. As with so much else in our corporatocracy, certain sectors of health care-insurance and pharma-are the beneficiaries, not the victims, of government regulations that codify an unfair system on behalf of corporations, not the public interest. I think you probably already know that the system is rigged and that many of the allegations here are ideologically twisted. Want to lower taxes? Eliminate tax exemption for insurance. But the status quo fans here WANT my taxes to support their health care. They just don't want theirs to support anyone else's.

    I think I've gained enough perspective here to understand the mindset of those who will fight to kill health care for all, and it's essentially selfishness and greed. Gimee mine and screw everyone else. The sad part is that we'll probably continue to shovel money into excess insurance and pharma profits to the public detriment and continue to saddle employers with health care costs that price them out of the competitive market. And the big losers are the public, workers and entrepreneurs who are forced to outsource to overseas workers who don't need health insurance benefits, because EVERYONE overseas already has assured health care. Now why don't we just give them some additional incentive to offshore their profits too. Oh yeah. We already have.

    Anyway, by the time your insurance premiums double or triple again, I'll be on Medicare. Then I can comment on the horrors of government health care. Or not.
  • Dr J
    If they're unconstrained by regulation, what are ERISA, COBRA, and HIPAA? Do they push the cost of health insurance up or down?

    And please make up your mind about taxpayer subsidies. If you're for Medicare and for universal public health, you're not against subsidies.
  • You know what I'm for. I'm for everybody paying for something everybody gets, same as every civilized nation on the planet. Right now, I subsidize the health care of about 70% of Americans, including, presumably, yours, and get screwed on my own health care cost. You think that's fair? I've detailed all the things I think are wrong with that, paying more for worse outcomes, millions without access to health care, emergency rooms as primary care, obscene profit for an industry that contributes nothing to actual health care, inability to negotiate lower prices, disadvantages to every company that must pay for health care for employees and then must compete with global businesses that don't. And the injustice that those without employer-paid health care subsidize those with it.

    Anyway, I give up. Nice sparring with you as always.
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