An Internet hub for moderates, centrists, and independents, with domestic and international news, analysis, original reporting, and popular features from the left, center, and right

« Republicans And Adultery

Iran’s Youth and Women’s Movement Analyzed (Guest Voice) »

An Ordinary Citizen Speaks out on Republican Party’s “Values”

Posted by DORIAN DE WIND in Media, Politics, Society.
Jun 26th, 2009 | Comments

letter

As I have written before, unbelievably good common sense and wisdom can be found in many of the letters written daily by regular Americans to the editors of their newspapers.

In a book about and dedicated to Letters to the Editor*, the authors make this comment:

Again and again, we found citizens speaking freely and from their hearts, recording a personal yet public diary of our community…Here was a marvelous sense of humor, there a deep need to set the record straight. And under it all was a resilient faith that no matter the crisis at hand, things were bound to get better in time…

And so it is this morning.

In my local newspaper there is a letter that expresses my sentiments—and, I believe, the sentiments of millions of Americans—on the recent succession of moral and family values transgressions by politicians of the Party that, in my opinion, have claimed those values to be exclusively theirs and, moreover, have attempted to use such alleged moral and religious superiority to malign and marginalize members of the opposing Party.

Here’s the letter that, more eloquently than I ever could, expresses “a deep need to set the record straight”

Friday, June 26, 2009

It’s over, Republicans

You are not the party of family values, the moral majority, the party of God or any other silly title you want to give yourselves. You’re just like everyone else — black or white, gay or straight, atheist or believers.

You can go to church seven days a week and pray seven times a day. You’re just human beings. No better than anybody else.

As a proud atheist, I will put my morals up against Pat Robertson, George W. Bush or anyone else who pretends to speak to God. Get over yourselves and work with the rest of us to make our country and the rest of the world a better place.

Remember God may or may not be watching you, but if he or she is, that deity knows who you really are — and so do we.

Randy Humphries

Round Rock

CODA: I truly believe that all Americans, Republicans, Democrats, or whatever, share virtues and failings equally, including politicians. However, when politicians of either party, or the party itself, use such virtues or failings to vilify the entire opposition, it is not only hypocritical, it’s just wrong.

And, yes, Democratic politicians have been guilty, too.

*The book referred to above, “Letters to the Editor—Two Hundred Years in the Life of an American Town,” was edited by Gerard Stropnicky, Tom Byrn, James Goode, and Jerry Matheny

Image Courtesy www.safecom.org.au

  • Dr J
    These cries of "hypocrisy" miss the point, IMHO. Social conservatives never claimed they're immune to sin, they claim the right to decide what sin is. And they've earned that right because they read the Bible more or have more respect for tradition or a keener eye for slippery slopes or some factor they would probably have trouble pinning down precisely.

    So if you're a proud atheist, are you for or against adultery? If you don't have a problem with it, beating up conservatives for practicing it just buys in to their definitions of right and wrong. If you do, you're in violent agreement with the conservatives, and your criticism should be directed at Mark Sanford who committed it, not the many conservatives who didn't.
  • D. E.Rodriguez
    DR_J:

    "Social conservatives never claimed they're immune to sin, they claim the right to decide what sin is."

    Who gave them that "right"?

    "And they've earned that right because they read the Bible more or have more respect for tradition or a keener eye for slippery slopes or some factor they would probably have trouble pinning down precisely."

    That is an insult to every Christian Democrat. Do only Christian Conservatives "read the Bible?"

    If I read you correctly, "reading the bible" gives one "more respect for tradition, etc.?" Perhaps if you had said "observing the teachings of the Bible", your statement may have had a little more credibility.

    "So if you're a proud atheist, are you for or against adultery?"

    No, I am not an atheist, I am a Christian, but what's that got to do with the issue at hand? And can atheists not be "proud" of what they are? Who are we, Christians, to judge?

    And yes, I am against adultery, as the Bible teaches us. But I don't go around beating up Conservatives for it. Democrats and Conservatives alike commit adultery. I am against the political hypocrisy of a party that uses morality , family values and religion to beat up the opposition.

    "your criticism should be directed at Mark Sanford who committed it, not the many conservatives who didn't."

    Please, read my post again. My criticism is directed against Republican Governor Sanford and against Republican polticians who have used, and contiue to use, the "values, morality and religion" slogans to club and diminish the opposition/



    Thank you for commenting on my post without ad hominen
  • "You can go to church seven days a week and pray seven times a day. You’re just human beings. No better than anybody else."
    I've never met anyone who claimed different. This is a fantastic example of a major strawman! Thanks for finding it!

    "As a proud atheist, I will put my morals up against Pat Robertson, George W. Bush or anyone else who pretends to speak to God. Get over yourselves and work with the rest of us to make our country and the rest of the world a better place."
    Wow, what a great example of someone blaming someone else for the problem they are a party to! Yes, it is those other people who must change so we can make progress! Oh, what a relief it must be to be an atheist and not have to be responsible for getting along with other people! Let's compare the efforts of "proud atheists" to those of the Southern Baptist in rebuilding houses after Katrina. Let's compare the efforts of "proud atheists" with the Episcopal Development Corporation in providing affordable housing and getting homeless families into homes. Let's compare the efforts of "proud atheists" to the efforts of the United Methodist Women in providing blankets to the homeless or in providing medicinal aid to the Pacific islands.

    I agree! This sets the entire record straight!
  • D. E.Rodriguez
    Thurmanhart:

    "You can go to church seven days a week and pray seven times a day. You’re just human beings. No better than anybody else."

    "I've never met anyone who claimed different." Just listen to the Religious Right and you'll find some who indeed "claim different, in particular as to who "is eligible" to "be saved" in the after life

    "As a proud atheist, I will put my morals up against Pat Robertson, George W. Bush or anyone else who pretends to speak to God. Get over yourselves and work with the rest of us to make our country and the rest of the world a better place."

    "Wow, what a great example of someone blaming someone else for the problem they are a party to! "

    What problem are you referring to? Being an atheist?

    "Oh, what a relief it must be to be an atheist and not have to be responsible for getting along with other people!"

    Please explain. Do you know atheists who don't "have to be responsible for getting along with other people!" ? What does this mean?


    "Let's compare the efforts of "proud atheists" to those of the Southern Baptist in rebuilding houses after Katrina. Let's compare the efforts of "proud atheists" with the Episcopal Development Corporation in providing affordable housing and getting homeless families into homes. Let's compare the efforts of "proud atheists" to the efforts of the United Methodist Women in providing blankets to the homeless or in providing medicinal aid to the Pacific islands."

    I am not an atheist, but I am sure atheists do just as many good deeds for the poor, the needy, the homeless, etc. Do you have any evidence to the contrary?

    The fact that atheist organizations or individuals don't tout their charitable acts, doesn't necessarily mean they don't do them

    Thanks for your comments
  • Zzzzz
    Wow, Thurmenhart, way to ignore context. The proud Atheist comment came from the fact that conservative Christians often accuse people of being immoral because they are Godless. I'm an atheist. I know I can't get elected to office because of it. I have been lectured by conservative Christian acquaintences more times than I can count. I have been told I can't possibly be a moral person. I have listened while conservative media types trash my beliefs, my values, my politics, everything over and over again. Then, all too frequently, months or years later, some of those people end up getting caught cheating, lying, stealing, committing adultery, etc. And when we respond with, 'Uh huh. Another hypocrit. Maybe they should have been minding their own morality, instead of lecturing me', we get your kind of comeback. I can loosely translate it as, 'Christians ARE more moral than YOU people.'

    So how do you respond to the fact that this proud atheist donates to the United Way, the Red Cross, has done volunteer work with poor children, sent care packages to soldiers, and so forth? What about the other atheists I know in Engineers Without Borders, the Peace Corp, the Red Cross, Habitat for Humanity, and so forth? It is great that many Christians also roll up their sleves and work to make the world a better place. That kind of work is something we can all agree on.
  • D. E.Rodriguez
    Thank you so much, Zzzzz, for addressing the many unfair and unsupported smears against atheists.
  • Zzzzz
    Oh, and FYI, this proud atheist has NEVER cheated on my spouse.
  • tbr48
    Mark Sanford, the private citizen, had moral failings just like any of us are subject to. I don't think there is any argument about that. If he were just a private citizen, these failings would only be an issue for his wife, children, family, and friends. However, he chose to make himself a public figure, and going further, claimed his morality and religious beliefs were a cornerstone of his trustworthiness and ability to lead. He and others of his party have consistently over the years made these claims to further their political ambitions. They have gone even farther, often laying exclusive claims to godliness and morality while ridiculing and vilifying those of other political bent as immoral and godless. There are two issues here, one is the personal failures of a man, and the other is the hypocrisy of using religion and morality as a political tool. When Clinton was impeached for his moral failings, Sanford called for him to resign. If Sanford really believed what he preaches he would do the same. But at this point, after the events of the past few days, we all now know that Mark Sanford, by his own words, not only has the exact moral failings he has railed against on the political stump, but also exhibits the exact kind of hypocrisy one would expect from those who use religion to further political ambitions.
  • D. E.Rodriguez
    This from Salon.com (that Liberal rag):

    "(And get this) According to Williams Jones, president of Columbia International University, Mr. Sanford and his wife joined an intensive Bible study group in the last few months. (A very Republican thing to do)"

    http://open.salon.com/blog/middleagedwomanblogg...
  • limeh2o
    The author of the letter to the editor happens to conduct a myriad of charitable acts and donates to many human causes. The gist of the letter was addressing the hypocracy that exists when people in office publically sling mud at others (e.g. Clinton for cheating) and then do the same. The message speaks to those who believe that a title or a specific organization makes them part of the elite. While I myself am a Christian, I don't believe other Christians should look down on others merely because they are different. Often I find Christians do the right thing out of fear instead of doing it because it is the moral thing to do.
  • Don Quijote
    Wikipedia - Taylor and Pat Robertson

    Taylor and Pat Robertson

    According to a 2 June 1999, article in The Virginian-Pilot,[31] Taylor had extensive business dealings with American televangelist Pat Robertson. According to the article, Taylor gave Robertson (who also had business dealings with dictator Mobutu Sese Seko of Zaire) the rights to mine for diamonds in Liberia's mineral-rich countryside. According to two Operation Blessing pilots who reported this incident to the state of Virginia for investigation in 1994, Robertson used his Operation Blessing planes to haul diamond-mining equipment to Robertson's mines in Liberia, despite the fact that Robertson was telling his 700 Club viewers that the planes were sending relief supplies to the victims of the genocide in Rwanda. The subsequent investigation by the state of Virginia concluded that Robertson diverted his ministry's donations to the Liberian diamond-mining operation, but Attorney General of Virginia Mark Earley blocked any potential prosecution against Robertson, as the relief supplies were also sent.[32]


    Hypocrisy, Thy name is Christian Conservative.
  • D. E.Rodriguez
    Thanks for the reference DQ.

    Perhaps this is one of those religious charitable "efforts" Thurmanhart was extolling, and comparing to alleged atheist lack of charitable actions.
  • "Please explain. Do you know atheists who don't "have to be responsible for getting along with other people!" ? What does this mean?"

    It means that the letter you site claims that things will get better when the Religious Right changes...instead of trying to learn to get along with them. It puts the responsibility of getting along with someone else.

    "I am not an atheist, but I am sure atheists do just as many good deeds for the poor, the needy, the homeless, etc. Do you have any evidence to the contrary?

    The fact that atheist organizations or individuals don't tout their charitable acts, doesn't necessarily mean they don't do them."

    I never claimed that atheists don't give to the poor, etc. However, the letter claims that the Religious Right is well known for "who they are." Those are just a few examples of who they are. And, by the way, it isn't about touting what they do, it's the fact that they cared enough to organize and do something. Sure, atheists can do that, and some do, but if we're going to compare groups, then let's actually compare groups, shall we?
  • I'm glad you do so much to make the world a better place, and I could care less whether you do or don't believe in any particular god. As far as I could tell, you weren't brought up in the letter, though. What the letter did was trash an entire group for a failing of a few. This is, in my experience, a classic tactic of atheists. "Mark Sanford is a hypocrit; therefore all Christians are just like him." It's not only demeaning to an entire group of people, but it is also a very serious fault of logic.
  • The problem is that the letter you wrote is an ad hominem attack itself. It uses the failings of one man to attack the political stance of a party that represents millions. How crazy is that? Sure, you can easily come up with a half-dozen other examples, but it's still less than a fraction of a fraction of either Republicans or conservative Christians. But, what the hell, let's condemn the whole group, shall we?

    The letter you posted doesn't address Mark Sanford. He isn't mentioned at all. It says, "It's over, Republicans." and talks about people who "pretend to talk to God." The post says that the reason a LTE is to "set the record straight." It does nothing of the sort.
  • D. E.Rodriguez
    "I never claimed that atheists don't give to the poor, etc"

    Thanks for clarifying your comments and giving atheists some credit.
  • Or, maybe, knowing that their marriage was in trouble, they sought help through their church. Why is this a "Republican" thing to do? Any proof that it was a partisan Bible study or is this just another ad hominem attack against an entire group of people?
  • "Hypocrisy, Thy name is Christian Conservative."
    snip
    "Perhaps this is one of those religious charitable "efforts" Thurmanhart was extolling, and comparing to alleged atheist lack of charitable actions."

    hahahahahaha...you are SO funny. You should try out for one of those reality shows.

    More of the "condemn the group for the actions of one person" stuff. Wonderful.
  • D. E.Rodriguez
    Thurmanhart:

    "The problem is that the letter you wrote is an ad hominem attack itself"

    Please read the post again. I did not write the letter.
  • D. E.Rodriguez
    Thurmanhart:

    "hahahahahaha...you are SO funny. You should try out for one of those reality shows
    Taylor and Pat Robertson"

    I am sorry, but I don't see anything funny in what Don Quijote posted about the alleged diamond mines business dealings of American televangelist Pat Robertson, who "used his Operation Blessing planes to haul diamond-mining equipment to Robertson's mines in Liberia, despite the fact that Robertson was telling his 700 Club viewers that the planes were sending relief supplies to the victims of the genocide in Rwanda."
  • D. E.Rodriguez
    "Sure, you can easily come up with a half-dozen other examples, but it's still less than a fraction of a fraction of either Republicans or conservative Christians. But, what the hell, let's condemn the whole group, shall we?"

    Please read my post again. Nowhere do I condemn "the whole group". I specifically single out Republican politicians and a Republican Party that that, "in my opinion, have claimed those values to be exclusively theirs and, moreover, have attempted to use such alleged moral and religious superiority to malign and marginalize members of the opposing Party."

    And:

    "CODA: I truly believe that all Americans, Republicans, Democrats, or whatever, share virtues and failings equally, including politicians. However, when politicians of either party, or the party itself, use such virtues or failings to vilify the entire opposition, it is not only hypocritical, it’s just wrong.

    And, yes, Democratic politicians have been guilty, too."

    And, no I did not write the letter, and yes, I found it to be a very relevant letter to the ongoing discussion about hypocrisy.
  • D. E.Rodriguez
    Thurmanharrt:

    ""Hypocrisy, Thy name is Christian Conservative."

    "hahahahahaha...you are SO funny. You should try out for one of those reality shows"

    Don Quijote will be pleased to learn this
  • "I am sorry, but I don't see anything funny in what Don Quijote posted about the alleged diamond mines business dealings of American televangelist Pat Robertson, who "used his Operation Blessing planes to haul diamond-mining equipment to Robertson's mines in Liberia, despite the fact that Robertson was telling his 700 Club viewers that the planes were sending relief supplies to the victims of the genocide in Rwanda.""

    You know, you're much too smart to post this. It's obvious that I wasn't laughing at what DQ wrote. I was laughing at YOU for saying that it was a "charitable effort." Come on, if you're going to play dumb, this is useless.
  • You get the creative editing award for the day. Congratulations!
  • "Nowhere do I condemn "the whole group". I specifically single out Republican politicians and a Republican Party..."
    Yes, you are right. The "Republican Party" is not a group at all, is it?

    I agree that it is a wonderful example of hypocrisy. Just not the way you want to use it.
  • D. E.Rodriguez
    Thirmanhart:

    "The letter you posted doesn't address Mark Sanford. He isn't mentioned at all. It says, "It's over, Republicans." and talks about people who "pretend to talk to God."

    Written a few days after the Sanford episode, it is very likely it addressed Sanford. If not, it could have addressed John Ensign, Larry Craig, David Vitter, Mark Foley, Ted Haggart, Matthew Joseph Elliott, Robert McKee, Robert "Bob" Allen, John David Roy Atcheson, Richard Curtis, Ted Klaudt, Jim Gibbons...you get the idea
  • D. E.Rodriguez
    "Yes, you are right. The "Republican Party" is not a group at all, is it?"

    Thurmanhart, this is getting a little tiresome, and this will be the last time that I encourage to read my entire post again, very slowly and very carefully, where I clearly said:

    "on the recent succession of moral and family values transgressions by politicians of the Party that, in my opinion, have claimed those values to be exclusively theirs and, moreover, have attempted to use such alleged moral and religious superiority to malign and marginalize members of the opposing Party."

    Again, "politicians of the party that..."

    Anyway, it has been, as you say, very entertaining.

    Thanks for spending so much time on my post. It's appreciated.

    have a wonderful weekend.
  • "Written a few days after the Sanford episode, it is very likely it addressed Sanford. If not, it could have addressed John Ensign, Larry Craig, David Vitter, Mark Foley, Ted Haggart, Matthew Joseph Elliott, Robert McKee, Robert "Bob" Allen, John David Roy Atcheson, Richard Curtis, Ted Klaudt, Jim Gibbons...you get the idea."
    Like I said, you can name all you want and it's still a small fraction. Why not single out "white men" for the outrage..all of those examples are white men, after all.
  • "Thurmanhart, this is getting a little tiresome, and this will be the last time that I encourage to read my entire post again.."
    I have. Each time, I'm less impressed with it.

    Now, if you'll excuse me, I have to get my children ready for Bible study. I suppose that means I'll have to change my voter registration so I fit with the ongoing meme. Just as well, I find Democrats to be as full of hate for people who aren't like them as Republicans ever have been. No less, no more.
  • D. E.Rodriguez
    "I'm glad you do so much to make the world a better place, and I could care less whether you do or don't believe in any particular god."

    Who is this "you" you are referring to?

    I have never claimed I "do so much to make the world a better place,"

    I wish that I did, though
  • D. E.Rodriguez
    "Now, if you'll excuse me, I have to get my children ready for Bible study"

    I believe that's great, Thurmanhart.

    I wish more people, Democrats and Republicans, would pay more attention to their children spiritual needs--whoever their God might be, or not be
  • D. E.Rodriguez
    "Why not single out "white men" for the outrage..all of those examples are white men, after all."

    Oh, Thurmanhart, you know very well that sin knows no race, or gender... or, surprise, religion
  • D. E.Rodriguez
    "Thurmanhart, this is getting a little tiresome, and this will be the last time that I encourage to read my entire post again.."

    Thurmanhart says: "I have."

    Well, did you read something to the effect of :

    "the recent succession of moral and family values transgressions by politicians of the Party that, in my opinion, have claimed those values to be exclusively theirs and, moreover, have attempted to use such alleged moral and religious superiority to malign and marginalize members of the opposing Party. "

    "Politicians of the Party" "Politicians of the Party" "Politicians of the Party"
  • D. E.Rodriguez
    "The letter you posted doesn't address Mark Sanford. He isn't mentioned at all."

    Sorry, as you don't have access to the newspaper, let me describe what appears directly above the letter:

    It is a small color photograph of Governor Sanford wiping a tear, with the following caption:

    "Republican South Carolina Gov. Mark Sanford admitted Wednesday to cheating on his wife."
blog comments powered by Disqus
© 2005-2009 The Moderate Voice | Site design by Elegant Themes | Site customization, hosting, and security by Enxit Group, LLC