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From Tiny ACORNs Grow… Rot?

Posted by JAZZ SHAW, Assistant Editor in At TMV.
Oct 9th, 2008 | Comments

Let me preface this post by saying that I still believe 100% in Get Out The Vote (GOTV) efforts. The more informed voters we have out there considering the issues and casting their votes, the better off we are. We, as a country, may make mistakes now and again, but hopefully we learn from them and move on more the wiser. But there is one group – specifically the Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now, or ACORN – who just seems to keep showing up in the headlines for all the wrong reasons.

Case in point: In Indiana, the Marion County (Indianapolis) area seems to have managed the
astonishing task of registering 105% of its eligible residents to vote.

So we have 644,197 people eligible to be registered in Marion County/Indianapolis, and 677,401 people registered. Congratulations go to Indianapolis for having 105% of its residents registered!

Or how about registering a 7 year old girl to vote in Connecticut? Or one man in Cleveland who was registered to vote three times in a single day using two different home addresses? Perhaps you prefer the story of a convicted felon in Milwaukee registering not only himself to vote, but registering others as well? (No matter your take on felon voting restrictions, it’s currently illegal in Wisconsin and ACORN should know that.)

There are only so many of these tales that we can read before concluding that – at least in some of their chapters – there is more going on here than simply a helpful group of citizens trying to encourage maximum participation in the electoral process. There is also the fact that in each of these instances, the benefactor of the alleged abuses seems to be the Democratic Party. Here’s a news flash for you, ACORN… your candidates are already doing fine in the polls. If you try to rig the game any further in your favor, you diminish the credibility of the ticket and call the validity of any victory you may achieve into question. Not to mention that such activities, if true, are illegal and, frankly, disgusting.

In the past I’ve been reluctant to point fingers at this group, since I’ve long found the dismal turnout rate during our elections to be depressing. Getting more people to the polls is an admirable goal. But election tampering and voter fraud are far more depressing. ACORN has earned themselves a much closer look by authorities, in my opinion, and the sooner the better.

  • Marlowecan
    An outrageous post! Typical right-wing voter suppression!
    This is exactly why poll monitoring and voter ID must be banned.... :)

    ACORN is, as Jazz indicates, notorious for its connections to voter fraud.

    It is always the bizarro stories that catch the news: This year in Nevada, the Dallas Cowboys starting lineup get registration cards . . . in 2004 Mickey Mouse and Donald Duck get theirs thanks to ACORN.

    Jazz is also correct in noting that the beneficiaries of this are invariably Democrat.
    Which explains why . . . in the recently proposed bailout package . . . Democrats put in language to divert money to the Housing Trust Fund, which has been used to fund ACORN in the past. Obama's association with ACORN is also well-known.

    Thus, I predict nothing will happen.

    Anyone who questions ACORN . . . unless they have a registration card from ACORN registered to Mary Poppins or Foghorn Leghorn ("unfortunate, isolated mistakes")...will be condemned as right-wing voter-suppressing hacks and racists.
  • CStanley
    The problem with all GOTV efforts is that they're almost always partisan attempts to drive turnout of low information voters to the polls to vote for the party favored by the group who's promoting the effort. Personally I don't see any positive value in getting people to the polls if the only information they get is what is delivered to them by a group with an agenda to promote one party. Yes, it's sad that so many people don't take the time to vote- but it's only a move in a positive direction if those people become genuinely motivated to understand who and what they're voting for rather than responding to propaganda.

    As a conservative, I'll admit that part of the complaint for me is that the GOTV efforts generally target demographics that favor the Democratic party- but I will also say that any efforts by the GOP to disenfranchise certain voters is equally offensive (that's not to say that I think most voter ID laws fit in that category- I DO think it's necessary to preserve the integrity of elections by requiring ID, but the laws must ensure that everyone can get photo ID with reasonable effort and at no cost if necessary.)

    A while back, Carter and Baker led a bipartisan commission to study election integrity problems and they focused on both sides of this issue- making sure that fraudulent registration and voting is addressed as well as preventing any inappropriate roadblocks for legitimate citizens to vote. Predictably, each party focused on the part that favored their party instead of working in a bipartisan manner to address BOTH problems.
  • superdestroyer
    Why is it important for people to get out to vote when so few elections are competative. Does it really matter for people to turn out in districts where the leader in every race has a double digit lead.

    Also, as the U.S. becomes a one party state, how will people feel about voting. Imagine waht 2016 will be like when the entire presidential election could be over by the end of the Democratic New Hampshire primary.
  • CStanley
    I will add that my 14 year old daughter, whom we try not to brainwash but encourage to think for herself, often has very astute observations about this kind of thing.

    She told me the other day that she saw a girl at an outdoor festival going around with a clipboard full of voter registration forms asking people to register to vote and her comment about this was, "If those people haven't gone to register yet, then what makes anyone think that they really care about the election or know who to vote for?"
  • Gichin13
    Looks like something valid to analyze and look into.

    Also seems like a marginal issue to some extent being latched onto by the right given that we are in the maelstrom of the worst economic meltdown of my lifetime, but I would like to know more.
  • Marlowecan
    CStanley said: "Predictably, each party focused on the part that favored their party instead of working in a bipartisan manner to address BOTH problems."

    Hahahaha...so true.

    You make a good point, though. The problem is relatively easily solved by passage of laws mandating some govt. photo ID for voting . . . together with laws ensuring the IDs are available at no cost with minimal effort.

    I notice retail stores with signs up requiring photo ID with credit card purchases, as a means of fighting credit card fraud. Surely the same is an acceptable means of dealing with voter fraud.

    Superdestroyer . . . re: the coming Democratic one-party state. . . .part of me hopes for a McCain victory, just to see your reaction :)
  • I'm only taking exception with Marlowecan's response in one area. When I mentioned that the beneficiaries seem to invariably be Democrats, I was referring specifically to ACORN, and not *all* voting irregularities and shady activities across the land. We've seen some instances of highjinks from both sides, such as the phone banks in New England during the last election cycle. But I agree that ACORN seems to earn a disproportional share of the spotlight, are spread all across the nation, particularly in swing states, and never seem to be working to support the GOP. Just wanted to be clear on that.
  • Marlowecan
    Sort of OT...but thinking about CStanley's daughter's comment:

    I wonder why so many people do not vote in the U.S.? This economic crisis has surely made the importance of government clear to people.

    (To be honest...I have been guilty of not voting in the past, when it seemed it would not make any difference. My partner is religious in her absentee ballots, and scourges me. Mea culpa...)
  • Marlowecan
    Sorry Jazz...I should have worded my response better...as I was specifically referring to ACORN as well in the Dems. benefitting.

    Voting irregularities are, of course, bipartisan . . . though the GOP benefitting ones seem to focus on voter suppression more than GOTV.

    ACORN earns a disproportionate spotlight, I think, because the stories of voter fraud associated with it are funny (e.g., Mickey Mouse, Donald Duck, Mary Poppins, Dallas Cowboys) and thus are picked up by the media. Otherwise, voting irregularities are boring and relegated deep into the back pages.
  • Rudi
    Yes ACORNs practices are disgusting, but it isn't working directly for the party. It isn't like dead Democrtas voting in Chicago. Lets not forget the Republican attempts to disenfranchise new voters in Florida and questionable voting machine placements in Ohio.
  • RememberNovember
    Voter fraud is not party-specific. We had dead voters registered for both Giuliani and Dinkins in NYC.
  • Actually, requiring photo ID for a credit card transaction is prohibited by major credit card company merchant agreements. Stores can request to see photo ID, but if you do not have it or refuse, their merchant agreements with Visa/MasterCard/Amex say they may not refuse to complete the transaction.

    For example:

    Cardholder ID
    Although Visa rules do not preclude merchants from asking for cardholder ID, merchants cannot make an ID a condition of acceptance. Therefore, merchants cannot refuse to complete a purchase transaction because a cardholder refuses to provide ID . Visa believes merchants should not ask for ID as part of their regular card acceptance procedures. Laws in several states also make it illegal for merchants to write a cardholder's personal information, such as an address or phone number, on a sales receipt. P. 29, Visa Merchant Card Acceptance Policy

    Has little to do with the pros and cons for requiring photo ID at the polls, but I like to keep everyone informed of their rights in this day and age, where we perpetually struggle against identity fraud & theft and give up our privacy and individual liberties to misguidedly-intentioned stores.

    Don't even get me started on the illegality of receipt checkers at stores like Walmart and Best Buy! :)
  • Marlowecan
    Lotusflwr...I was actually wondering about just that. Two weeks back, I asked at my local computer shop where I get my parts and saw a sign, and was assured it was legal. Hahahahaha...

    Receipt checkers are BestBuy are illegal?
    Don't mean to get you started ;) but I had no idea.
  • RememberNovember
    "Also, as the U.S. becomes a one party state, how will people feel about voting. Imagine waht 2016 will be like when the entire presidential election could be over by the end of the Democratic New Hampshire primary."

    Been sitting on The Corner, much? How does this differ from the Rovian "default party" one party vision? As opposed to the RLC pre-2006 which was a rubber stamp congress?
    Get real, your cognitive dissonance is showing.

    Personally, I tend to favor a balance- so that checks and balances work and each branch of government has proportionate weight. But that's just crazy talk I know. Call me a radical.

    and to CS's daughter- I question her astuteness and instead see it as cynicism, which is a fatalist's sense of astuteness - her criticism is that "if they haven't done their civic duty by now, why should they bother? Maybe because they were mis-informed, or given the wrong information so that they came to the wrong conclusion-when you have slammed down people for so long it boils down to learned helplessness. The GOP has perfected the voter Skinner Box. . It is part of the vote-cager mentality, and the only real reason why we had to suffer through GWB for two terms. The rules have changed. She has time to learn the difference,so there is hope for her to understand more than one stance/perspective. Who knows you may have a liberal on your hands by the time she graduates college...or you may have a Young Republican. Only time will tell. Please don't take this as a criticism of your parenting skills, as I am only reflecting back on my own political prisonership living under an ultrconservative
    charter member of the NRA household... ( and yeah fwiw I was a junior NRA member for a while )
  • elrod
    Here's the problem with ACORN: They pay their organizers per registered voter. Therefore, ACORN workers have a financial incentive to give duplicate and fictitious registrations.

    No other major GOTV group operates this way.

    The big question is: are these doubly registered (or dead) voters actually voting multiple times? I haven't seen evidence of that yet.

    But ACORN is a disaster and needs to be monitored.
  • Marlowecan, I highly recommend checking out the site The Consumerist. It is a fantastic resource for all things dealing with consumer rights and protections (like receipt-checking, requiring photo ID or surcharges for using a credit card, or arbitration clauses). In addition they cover everything else affecting consumers, from Comcast horror stories to debt-reduction strategies to the implosion of Countrywide and the Wall St. meltdown & bailout. It's one of my "go to" RSS feeds, along with TMV! :) Reading it has made me an infinitely more informed consumer. Presidential elections are but once every 4 years, but I can vote for or against good/bad companies daily with my dollars!
  • superdestroyer
    The idea that receipt checkers are illegal is a stretch. The posts I saw mix up restrictions on the government with restirctions of store keepers in the own store.

    Lotusflwr, you seem like the type of person who sees shop lifting as a victimless crime that should just be ignored. It is very much like the current policies being promoted by both political parties. Let the responsbile honest people be responsible for all of the irresponsible people. You people be willing to give up store security if it meant that everyone paid 10% more?
  • Jim_Satterfield
    Well, I see that no one mentioned that ACORN turns in anyone they catch doing those things. They still need to completely revamp how they run their registration drives, though.

    "I wonder why so many people do not vote in the U.S.?"

    How much does the constant drumbeat of criticism of government by American conservatives contribute to it? How much does the ignorance of the majority of Americans concerning their government and its functions contribute? There are probably more factors than we could think of.
  • Marlowecan
    Cheers for the link, lotusflwr.

    Layout resembles defamer/gawker. Looks like lots of great reading.

    Always good to know how one is being reamed, rather than just being reamed in ignorance. But, as you say, we do have choices.
  • CStanley
    I only meant to introduce my daughter's comment as an aside, but since others have reacted to it I'll add that I responded to her by giving both sides of the GOTV argument. I try to always play devil's advocate and make the opposing case (as one does in debate training, learning to argue just as effectively for either side of an argument by presenting the relevant facts.) RememberNovember, I'm sorry if you came from an authoritarian household where that kind of thinking wasn't encouraged, but thank you for not assuming that all conservative parents are guilty of that.

    As for Jim's point, I can only say that I think a healthy cynicism of government and belief in limiting its powers was a large part of the thinking of our founders, and I believe we do well to continue that tradition. That some people take that too far and consider the government to be the enemy of the people I suppose is true, just as I guess some people demonize corporate America to their own detriment if they choose not to avail themselves of opportunity for financial betterment through the fruits of their labor.
  • Silhouette
    If I was the GOP, I'd be thrilled about ACORN right now. Imagine being able to legally contest votes and retool the election after-the-fact, due to this kind of gross negligence?

    Oh, wait, I imagine the GOP has already imagined this... ; )
  • CStanley
    elrod, I'm glad you recognize and acknowledge the disaster that is ACORN.

    I wonder if you or anyone else can answer though, why Obama's fight the smears website claims that the group that he worked with, Vote Smart, is not affiliated with ACORN when ACORN itself claims that Project Vote is one of its offshoots?

    Here's Obama's site

    Here's ACORNlisting Project Vote as an affiliate group.

    And here's one example of a third party (not a source that's critical of ACORN or VoteSmart, so no motivation to try to tie the two together as guilt by association.)
  • CStanley
  • CStanley
    Testing-

    the timer doesn't appear to be working onthe comments, so I'm just checking if the comment function is working. So far it appears that it is, but I guess my last two comments were conversation stoppers.

    Edit: OK, looks like the timer is 'unstuck' after I posted this.
  • jkarczek
    The irony is that an organization that is painted as a bastion of American socialism uses market incentives to stimulate performance and it's doubly ironic that voices on the right are decrying this whole mess so loudly, given their usual "ends always justify the means" embrace of the market. When the performance incentives are not girded with a strong ethical framework and results are not monitored stringently, corruption is the inevitable outcome. This all reminds me of something else. It's been in the news recently, but I just can't quite remember what...
  • CStanley
    Well, that's a good point illustrating why both extremes are wrong, jkarczek. Your analysis works equally well in reverse, to note the irony that a leftist group espoused this market incentive without monitoring and feels that in this case the ends justifies the means.
  • lurxst
    Offering financial incentives is a major sticking point with ACORN's GOTV efforts. Its good that they acknowledge that and hopefully they make amends to their process.
    Its doubtful that Mickey Mouse will ever show up at a poll, so in the end there is no actual commission of voter fraud.

    Conversely, despite protections under the Help America Vote Act, several (Republican, surprise) Secretaries of State are doing massive purges of the voter roles, within the 90 day federal moratorium mandate. This is hundreds of thousands of voters potentially being disenfranchised, compared to the handfuls that may have gotten onto the lists from disingenuous ACORN canvassers.

    In 2006, despite having lived at the same address for 10 years and casting a vote in every election in the same district, I was booted off the voter rolls. Of course I didnt discover this until I showed up and was handed a provisional ballot.

    Fixes do need to be made.
  • CStanley
    The provisional ballot is the fix to the problem you faced though, lurxst. But I certainly hope that ACORN and any other organization that turns in thousands of fraudulent registrations will face fines and/or prosecution because of the enormous burden they're placing on the system.

    If those organizations have a financial DISINCENTIVE for fraud, you can bet that they'll clean up their acts.
  • Slightly off-topic, but related to something that's come up in a thread at my blog today... what, exactly, do we gain by pushing uninformed voters into a voting booth? Is there no way at all to get people informed?
  • CStanley
    My sentiments exactly Polimom. And what are we doing funding with taxpayer dollars an organization that pushes such voters to the polls if they openly espouse political goals that align with one party?
  • CStanley
    A thought that's occurred to me today too is whether the fraudulent registrations might be affecting polling? I haven't looked into it yet but I know a lot of the polls weigh the results according to party registration- so isn't it possible that shifting the ratio of Dem: GOP registrations could be skewing things, maybe in an attempt to create artificial momentum?

    I'm not claiming that the whole effect of increased Dem voter registration is fraudulent, mind you- I certainly realize that a lot of it is real. But it seems like in these last weeks before the close of voter registration, we're suddenly hearing about thousands upon thousands of new registrations, with allegations of pretty widespread fraud, and at the very same time a major jump occurred in the polling (again, realizing that some of that is real due to McCain's missteps during the economic crisis.)
  • It's truly a mess and shouldn't be. We need open and honest registration and I deplore efforts on both sides to manipulate people's right to vote.
  • DLS
    You've been told about ACORN before. I still am surprised Obama's association with that group was not a frequent subject of campaign information by McCain.

    (Use of past tense is not a psychological slip or admission of Obama's victory to come)
  • Sorry -- didn't see your response, CStanley. I agree with you -- why on earth are taxpayers financing ACORN's activities? Even if there weren't questions about how they handle GOTV, they're enormously partisan.
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