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Catapulting the Propaganda on Taxes
If there ever was a doubt that a lie repeated often enough can supplant the truth in people’s perceptions of reality, take a look at the two graphs below. The first is from the Tax Policy Center and compares the after-income effects of the McCain and Obama tax proposals.
Now, take a look at what Americans believe each candidate’s tax proposal will do:
Although only 1% of Americans will see an actual tax increase under Obama’s plan, 53% believe he will increase their taxes. I was a little curious why Republicans hammered Obama so hard on taxes during the convention when his policy actually benefits most Americans more than McCain’s. I guess they just thought they wouldn’t get called on it.
H/T to Hilzoy. Cross-posted at Ablogistan.
73 Responses to “Catapulting the Propaganda on Taxes”
pacatrue,
On that count, Sarah Palin had a tanning bed installed in the Governors mansion.
These Republicans are so down to earth
To be more productive in my comments, it's looking less and less like either campaign will a chance to implement much of either of their platforms in the first two years. With the financial collapse going on, it's looking like many, many billions of dollars for 2009 or 2010 will be allocated to keeping that system afloat. Obama will only be able to get through one or two of his programs. McCain will likely try to borrow his way out of it, but apparently, the market for our debt has been getting tighter, which could force him to delay tax cuts at best.
To be more productive in my comments, it's looking less and less like either campaign will a chance to implement much of either of their platforms in the first two years. With the financial collapse going on, it's looking like many, many billions of dollars for 2009 or 2010 will be allocated to keeping that system afloat. Obama will only be able to get through one or two of his programs. McCain will likely try to borrow his way out of it, but apparently, the market for our debt has been getting tighter, which could force him to delay tax cuts at best.
Let's be honest here, George Bush and friends came into power with a healthy economy. They have screwed up the economic health of this country so badly (in many ways, including a bogus war) that regardless of who comes into office, they will inherit a job of Sisyphean proportions. This is reason enough not to reward the GOP with a vote in November. It isn't rocket science folks.
Let's be honest here, George Bush and friends came into power with a healthy economy. They have screwed up the economic health of this country so badly (in many ways, including a bogus war) that regardless of who comes into office, they will inherit a job of Sisyphean proportions. This is reason enough not to reward the GOP with a vote in November. It isn't rocket science folks.
JSpencer,
The S&P was well off of its high before January 20, 2001. The economy was slowing down due to the dot.com bust and the overspending due to Y2K. Al Gore would have face the same slowing economy and would have face the same problems after 9/11. The Clinton ADministration went six years with no signicant changes to the tax code, no new spending programs, and no new entitlements. The last six years of the Clinton ADministration is about as close as the U.S. has ever gotten to a libertarian government.
I doubt if an Obama Administration with the Democrats in charge of Congress will have anything in common with the Clinton Administration. Pork barrel spending in West Virginia and new entitlement programs will slide through without vetos when the Democrats are in charge of everything.
JSpencer,
The S&P was well off of its high before January 20, 2001. The economy was slowing down due to the dot.com bust and the overspending due to Y2K. Al Gore would have face the same slowing economy and would have face the same problems after 9/11. The Clinton ADministration went six years with no signicant changes to the tax code, no new spending programs, and no new entitlements. The last six years of the Clinton ADministration is about as close as the U.S. has ever gotten to a libertarian government.
I doubt if an Obama Administration with the Democrats in charge of Congress will have anything in common with the Clinton Administration. Pork barrel spending in West Virginia and new entitlement programs will slide through without vetos when the Democrats are in charge of everything.
SD, if your suggestion is the economy would have spiraled down and the war ensued regardless of who was at the helm, then I reject the notion. Gore was not the intellectual lightweight Bush was for one thing, and his cabinet would have reflected that difference. The extent to which our economy is/will be stressed by the Iraq war would be non-existent as well. 8 years is plenty of time to reap penalties when an administration combines negligence with incompetence. We well may have encountered economic problems, but they might have also been moderated with some creative foresight. At any rate, I doubt most folks would buy into the idea that all the misery that took place under the Bush watch was inevitable… including the economy.
SD, if your suggestion is the economy would have spiraled down and the war ensued regardless of who was at the helm, then I reject the notion. Gore was not the intellectual lightweight Bush was for one thing, and his cabinet would have reflected that difference. The extent to which our economy is/will be stressed by the Iraq war would be non-existent as well. 8 years is plenty of time to reap penalties when an administration combines negligence with incompetence. We well may have encountered economic problems, but they might have also been moderated with some creative foresight. At any rate, I doubt most folks would buy into the idea that all the misery that took place under the Bush watch was inevitable… including the economy.
I believe this analysis is correct.
Since I normally disagree with Superdestroyer, I felt honor-bound to highlight my agreement.
However–and I'm sure anyone still reading this thread knew there was a big but coming–it's astounding to me that the fact that this is something Democrats actually did becomes an argument against voting for Democrats.
Really, it's mind-bending.
Republicans used to be the party of fiscal responsibilty, but now they believe that, in the words of Dick Cheney, “Deficits don't matter“.
Isn't that a huge part of how we got to this point economically?
I believe this analysis is correct.
Since I normally disagree with Superdestroyer, I felt honor-bound to highlight my agreement.
However–and I'm sure anyone still reading this thread knew there was a big but coming–it's astounding to me that the fact that this is something Democrats actually did becomes an argument against voting for Democrats.
Really, it's mind-bending.
Republicans used to be the party of fiscal responsibilty, but now they believe that, in the words of Dick Cheney, “Deficits don't matter“.
Isn't that a huge part of how we got to this point economically?
Bush 41, “Read my lips, no new taxes.”
Bush 41, “Read my lips, no new taxes.”
George,
since neither McCain nor Obama are promising to be like the Clinton Administration, what a happened during the Clinton Administration is not a good reason to over for either candidate. However, a government divided between McCain and the Democrats in Congress is probably more likely to control spending that a government totally dominated by Democrats.
George,
since neither McCain nor Obama are promising to be like the Clinton Administration, what a happened during the Clinton Administration is not a good reason to over for either candidate. However, a government divided between McCain and the Democrats in Congress is probably more likely to control spending that a government totally dominated by Democrats.
Disagree with your scenario SD. What you are describing would is a recipe for gridlock, hence a continuing status quo descent… that is, unless McCain were to suddenly morph back into what he claims he once was.
Disagree with your scenario SD. What you are describing would is a recipe for gridlock, hence a continuing status quo descent… that is, unless McCain were to suddenly morph back into what he claims he once was.
Superdestroyer–
I can only repeat my point: Republicans used to be the party of fiscal responsibility. Now Republican dogma is that deficits don't matter.
And current Republican strategy is, as JSpencer notes, gridlock.
Though I note you've given up the idea that McCain is unelectable.
Superdestroyer–
I can only repeat my point: Republicans used to be the party of fiscal responsibility. Now Republican dogma is that deficits don't matter.
And current Republican strategy is, as JSpencer notes, gridlock.
Though I note you've given up the idea that McCain is unelectable.
And how could I forget–McCain's chief economic advisor was the author of the deregulation that brought about this mess.
(The linked article was written in March, not in response to the current shock going through the financial markets.)
And how could I forget–McCain's chief economic advisor was the author of the deregulation that brought about this mess.
(The linked article was written in March, not in response to the current shock going through the financial markets.)
Jspencer,
Girdlock is the only time that the deficit appear to go down. Since neither party wants to support the others programs, gridlock limits the size of the government.
And McCain is still unelectable. The MSM has the collective desire to keep the elction close so that people will watch news programs. However, I am sure that the Democrats will out some Republican as a homosexual or child abuser like they have the last two elections and that will throw the swing states to Obama. I also wonder if Obama would take back the Biden pick if he had the chance. The MSM has been listening to Biden for decades and is just not interested.
Jspencer,
Girdlock is the only time that the deficit appear to go down. Since neither party wants to support the others programs, gridlock limits the size of the government.
And McCain is still unelectable. The MSM has the collective desire to keep the elction close so that people will watch news programs. However, I am sure that the Democrats will out some Republican as a homosexual or child abuser like they have the last two elections and that will throw the swing states to Obama. I also wonder if Obama would take back the Biden pick if he had the chance. The MSM has been listening to Biden for decades and is just not interested.