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Portait Of A Loss-Prone Party

Portrait Of A Loss-Prone Party

Once again this year the dubious political achievement award may well end up going to Democrats and their party for doing what seemed virtually impossible a few months ago—turning a sure victory this coming November into a very possible defeat.

Who would have thought this could happen? Disgust about Iraq, sour job prospects and soaring inflation, a hugely unpopular Republican president, an apparently divided opposition party. How can one lose with these circumstances in place?

Granted, Democratic Party operatives have shown themselves enormously incompetent in times past, and Democratic activists have often exhibited a high-mindedness that bordered on political insanity. But the barriers to defeat this time around appeared too steep for even these worthies to surmount.

Yet, astonishingly, they just may have done so.

The process of turning sure victory into very possible defeat began with the casual, almost flippant elimination of the most qualified and electable candidates. The only reason being, as far as almost anyone who doesn’t attend party conferences regularly could discern, was because they were just a bunch of old white guys.

Thus, the legislatively most experienced and knowledgeable pair, Senators Biden and Dodd, were gratuitously ignored and ungraciously tossed aside, though either of them, without enemies within the party and able to focus on real issues rather than media ephemera, would certainly be 20 points ahead of John McCain in the polls now and likely to increase that margin by election time.

Next to be unceremoniously chucked was Bill Richardson, whose own extensive experience included a number of significant foreign negotiating successes, executive credentials as a governor, and even a minority group pedigree. He was almost instantly downgraded to possible vice-president status because, well, just because. These are Democrats we are talking about, after all. Those not fully immersed in the activist Democratic mindset can’t possibly fathom reasons behind their thinking. I certainly can’t.

And then, of course, there was poor John Edwards, who was articulating a populist rhetoric that was exactly in sync with the times, and could therefore have beaten McCain so handily in November that they might have appeared to be running in different elections. Edwards was a natural for a Democratic Party axing.

Which left primary voters with just two choices, Clinton and Obama, each of whom had enormous potential to put off a great many voting Americans. Questions about experience, past affiliations (marital and church), gender and race, all hung over this duo from the moment it became clear that one would end up the Democrats’ nominee.

Sound politically dumb? Wait. Everything up to this point was just a warm-up act. It was time to violate the first rule of politics: never turn critical parts of your base against one another. Feminists feel very strongly about Clinton. Blacks feel very strongly about Obama. So whichever one topped the Democratic ticket was well positioned to forfeit a big chunk of the party’s base.

There’s an old axiom among poker players. After sitting down at the table, if you haven’t spotted “the fish,” the usual loser, within five minutes, you’re the fish. Look across the political table, my fellow Democrats. Look for the fish, the loser. And if you don’t see one, think about what that might say about yourself.

One personal observation here. I have always voted Democratic. I have looked to this party to represent my own interests because I believed these were in tune with the interests of most other Americans. I think the Democratic Party has failed me badly and served the country badly in recent elections, and it may well have done so again because it focused more on making a point than on winning.

I hope this concern does not turn out to be well founded. I very, very, very much hope this concern does not turn out to be well-founded.

  • pacatrue
    I have to disagree with much of the commentary this time, Michael. First up, Edwards is not in sync with the times economically. His message of redistribution of wealth simply is not where most Americans are, right or wrong. Economics is a high priority for Americans, but poverty is not, again right ot wrong. Stabilize housing prices and wages, and Americans will be happy to move back to the economy of the 90s -- the economy which created much of the distribution of wealth problems now driving poverty.

    Similarly, I'm not sure Biden, Dodd, and Richardson would be ahead. Outside of political circles, people don't really know who they are. I say that as someone who thought about joining a campaign for the first time in my life for Richardson. Clinton does not seem particularly inspiring to me, but there's no one more famous. People vote for a known commodity. Obama was not well known but was able to make people care in ways that B, D, and R simply couldn't.
  • saintixe56
    IIMHO , I fear that the DNC has played bad turn on...Obama; by all means Dean leadership has been good awful, this MI/FL abcess should habeen lanced months ago; instead of that we have been lingering suffering
    meanwhile some egos who begged to be bruised got bruised
    some BHO bloggers are plain stupid some HRC voters belong to the same tweety bird club
    so we have 2 groups of very stupid democrats, a very poor leadership, a man whoplays by the rules, yes it is not fun, but the rules was to get delegates not the popular vote and when voters actually write about stealing delegates in caucuses the answer is what were you doing in those caucuses ; nothing so dont be surprised
    strategy is important in war if you aim to win that is
    Bush is an example the dem party is alas following by not adpating ; innovating; we are stuck with an elected congress who is frozen in face of the dismal bush administration
    and they do nothing

    no wonder people vote less and less
    why should they it is the very same tepid bland waterwashed soup
    by not standing his ground since the beginning to HRC blackmail and by actually not daring to speak up he allows her voters to believe the fight can keep on
    in fact he allows or worse gives Obama and about every not white american the unfair= yet soon to be held as a truth that when you play the rules set by Whitey regardless you won, he will whine and steal from you
    I dont dare to iméagine what would happen if Obama gave up
    oh HRC voters would be mad with joy, but I would give a wide berth around Harleem for a very very long time
    to have not choice
    but describe that about the democrats as the party who denied the AA tells the future of next elections fiascoes
  • Slamfu
    I'm in agreement with pacatrue pretty much. The other candidates have pretty much run a Gore/Kerry style campaign, very reactive and seemingly based on polls. These are the types of campaigns that have lost for democrats before, and I'm sure would again.

    Edwards late and endorsement of a candidate, coming once things were all but decided, only shows me that he isn't one to make decisi ve moves that I'd like in a leader. Similarly, Clinton's hop on the gas tax bandwagon showed me, altho I already had it figured out, that that is her style as well. As I've said before, not leading so much as following from the front. The rest of the democratic leadership in Reid, Pelosi, Dean, seem to also have a "lets wait and see what the polls say" approach.

    The entire article seems based on the opinion that somehow guys that couldn't hold up under the primary process would have maintained under the national election one. Doesn't make sense to me, and in fact it seems to me the one candidate that doesn't mimic the tactics of this loss-prone party is the one still up for office.
  • Davebo
    IIMHO , I fear that the DNC has played bad turn on...Obama; by all means Dean leadership has been good awful, this MI/FL abcess should habeen lanced months ago;


    It was lanced months ago, by the DNC, with support from all Democratic candidates.

    And this is confusing as well.

    so we have 2 groups of very stupid democrats, a very poor leadership, a man whoplays by the rules, yes it is not fun, but the rules was to get delegates not the popular vote


    With Caucuses included it's hard to determine the exact result of the popular vote. But every analysis other than Lannie Davis has Obama winning the popular vote.
  • runasim
    The Democrats are more disorganzed, and contentious because of the nature of the party. It prioritizes inclusiveness, and including variety means including dissention and in-fighting. . It comes with the teritory.

    The GOP prioritizes cut-from-a-pattern membership rolls. Dissent is much more difficult but electon vixtory easier.

    People have to choose which matters more to them: inclusion of variety or easy electability. You can't often have both.
  • runasim
    The popular vote is a bogus issue raised by Clinton.
    The rules, always endorsed by Clinton heretofore, were established in the civil rights era to improve representation.

    If it's deemed the rules need reform or discarding, it can't be done in the middle of a game.. That's called cheating.
  • DLS
    "The Party of Losers" (and worse) has long been more like it. However, don't rush to assume that the Dems this year will necessarily repeat their Choose to Lose decision-making of 2000 and 2004. (Nor are they likely to try again to steal what they lose afterward, as they did in 2000. "Losers" isn't the only part of the longer, full name of that party.)

    Edwards's fake populism never fooled anyone who wasn't going to reflexively vote Dem. He wasn't that much stronger than Obama except as a lawyer lobby flunky.

    All the Obama team needs to do now is take it easy on Clinton until the follow-through at the convention (she can make a big speech -- that crowns the Queen's career, probably, while it launched Obama's only a short time ago), don't become overconfident, and don't do anything stupid or offensive to swing voters. (Obama didn't say anything stupid to AIPAC; had he, it would have been all over the news.)
  • DLS
    "Dean leadership"

    Future Clinton leadership, possibly. (Hillary, that is, not Bill, who can just be shoved to the United Nations.)
  • Neocon
    Runaism

    I have a huge problem with your point that the popular vote now since it might favor Clinton is a bogus issue.

    Prior to this event, the popular vote argument was a HUGE claim by Obama supporters further supporting their claim to the throne. Now that its shifted away from them suddenly its a bogus issue.

    No matter how you slice it. Hillary might have won the popular vote but lost the election. Remember the outrage over that same scenario by the Al Gore/democrats in 2000. It was a legitimate issue and in fact Hillary Clinton came out and proposed that we should look at that as something that needed correcting, Nothing came of it and I bet now she wishes she had stuck to making something happen.

    The die is cast. Hillary won the popular vote. FLORIDA once again stuck it to democrats. Neither Candidate clinched the votes needed to win the nomination and thus we turn to a process whereby the party determines the nominee.

    Good for Obama. Bad for Clinton. The rules are the rules but that does not soothe the anger that many tonight are feeling for Obama and his win. Or for the party and their apparent rejection of Hillary and Bill Clinton.

    This party is in disarray and it will only grow pronounced as the election wears on. I believe Obama will prevail unless those Hillary Supporters flock to McCain in protest. How many people would have never voted for Hillary? Now the question becomes how many in our party will not vote for Obama?
  • elrod
    Neocon,
    Hillary did not win the popular vote, unless you give Obama zero votes in Michigan, or you count zero votes from the caucuses. If you include all primaries, caucuses and give Obama the Uncommitted in Michigan - the most inclusive measure of all - Obama still wins the popular vote.
  • elrod
    I'm sorry, but I find this whole essay to be vapid in the extreme. So the "on-paper" qualified candidates like Biden, Dodd and Richardson didn't go anywhere? Well, I hate to break it to you but this is not a technocracy. It's a democracy. There are real reasons why those men didn't catch - even if I, like most Democrats, admire them greatly. Dodd had no money, little name recognition, and little agenda outside that propounded by the big league candidates. Biden and Richardson are not particularly likable. All have experience. But experience rarely wins the day in American politics. This year is no exception.
  • runasim
    Neocon,
    I think you better read up on the primary election rules of the Dems before you wade into the argument about popular votes.
    It was always about the delegates. Whether a state uses regular poll voitng or caucuses, delegates are assigned according to each state's rules.
    The popular vote in caucus states is not even known, so, at best, Hillary is estimating, and she has had a rather creative way of doing some estimates.

    Please remember that the relevance of Gore vs Bush is nil, because that concerned a whole different set of election issues. Natonal elections are not like Dem. primaries, and the electoral college is not like Dem delegates.

    Whatever the case about the polular vote results, the rules about delegates were accepted and endorsed by Hillary when the primaries began. In fact, she has been an ardent supporter of the rules.
    If she had an objection, the time to raise it was at the beginning, now now, when the rules failed to result in a finish favorable to her.

    You can't challenge, when you've lost, a game of chess on the grounds that it did not follow the rules for checkers.
  • pacatrue
    Neocon, "fixing" the way the electoral college works would have had no effect on the current primaries. They are entirely different systems. Hillary could have personally re-written the Constitution to detail the exact manner in which the President is chosen and the outcome would have been the same in the Democratic primaries. The Constitution has nothing to do with an individual party's rules.

    Popular vote measures are indeed largely meaningless as caucuses are not good measures of popular vote. Four states don't even report them, so you have to estimate from delegate counts. Even with the ones that do, a caucus by its very nature brings in fewer people than a primary. In a caucus state where 50,000 voters showed up, a primary might have drawn in 200,000. Simply adding a caucus state's tally to a primary state's essentially devalues caucus states. Therefore, naturally, a popular vote tally in the current system is biased against a candidate who wins more caucuses.
  • runasim
    PS to Neocon,
    To the extent that the popular vote was touted by Obama's camp, and I honestly don't remember who said what, it could only have been in the ocntext of gaining delegates from certain states.

    I'm afraid you are mixing apples with oranges while throwing in some avocadoes and potatoes for good measure.
  • SteveK
    "The Party of Losers" (and worse) has long been more like it."

    "This party is in disarray and it will only grow pronounced as the election wears on."

    Our pessimistic 'eeyorians' are back in force.

    I for one have missed their witty negative commentary and am greatly cheered by the fact that it is they, not I, who dwell in negativism... It is their's and their's alone.

    Some day maybe they'll even start talking about their choices for President in the upcoming election.
  • Neocon
    No runasim

    The mantra ALL over the internet was Hillary should QUIT because we are ahead. The perception was massive that Hillary could not pass up Obama and that he was ahead in popular votes so by rule he should be crowned.

    As for the vote. IM looking at numbers right now published on the internet that show the popular vote with the Michigan uncommitted votes going to Barak Obama as being:

    Obama 17,773,626
    Clinton 17,882,125.

    Hillary wins the popular vote.

    Yes I know the rules. The rules are about amassing delegates. You need 2118 to be elected.

    Neither candidate amassed 2118 delegates to win. Thus super delegates came into play. The argument by all Obama supporters was that WE WON THE POPULAR VOTE.....therefore we should be king.

    Now in looking at the numbers he did not win the popular vote and he did not win 2118 delegates but was subsequently crowned king by the DNC party big wigs even though more people voted for Hillary all because he won a few more delegates then she did.

    My contention was you saying the popular vote was bogus when it was a HUGE TALKING point by the Obama faithful right up till he suddenly fell slightly behind and now its a

    BOGUS ISSUE.

    Not only you my friend but every Obama Faithful accross the land has now changed their mind and the popular vote now is no longer an issue.

    Lord have mercy. Anything for a win. And they point to Hillary and her supporters as being win at all costs
  • Neocon
    Pacature

    as to fixing the election process. I was opposed to that. The current system works. However had efforts been made then the democrats might have actually looked at their own process by the natural progression of things and allowed for changes to made to avoid what just happened.

    Had 2000 Florida actually mattered to them rather then just a talking point to use with the masses as an issue to hate GOP'ers and GWB then the DNC might have looked into clarifying their rules to prevent what just happened from happening. So I think Florida is a very important connection to this years primary.

    What just happened is a very close election in which neither candidate won the majority of delegates needed and the popular vote totals are now so close that they are open for debate as well.

    Since this is all a reflection upon the true anger that was Florida in 2000 then you would think the Democrats would have learned a lesson. Instead we are blessed by a bunch of Morons who in 2000 shouted "All votes should count" to "Your vote doesnt count" in 2008.

    How did we get to Denver from Florida in just 8 years?

    DNC leadership. This issue should have been resolved well before anyone ever cast a vote. It was not. That shows poor leadership and poor DNC planning and it should also show Howard Dean the Door and a serious revamping of the primary rules to make allowances for what just happened.

    2008 should NEVER happen again in the Democratic party. 1968 proved that and 2008 reinforced it.
  • Neocon
    Our pessimistic 'eeyorians' are back in force.

    Once again when someone says something you don't agree with and are unable to mount a logical discussion you cannot refrain from name calling. At least now you are more subtle about it. I guess that is a step in the right direction.
  • pacatrue
    Neocon, the exact popular tally seems to fluctuate depending on how you estimate things, such as 1) what do you do with Texas that has both a caucus and a primary; 2) how precisely do you estimate the 4 caucus states that don't report popular vote tallies; and 3) how exactly do you estimate popular vote in Michigan, a place where Obama wasn't on the ballot. And all of this ignores the simple fact again that caucuses underestimate popular support for candidates. Since Obama won many caucus states, it therefore systematically undercounts his support in those states.

    RealClearPolitics here has a popular vote tally, which after estimating this and that puts Obama still ahead by about 60,000 votes.

    Wikipedia has a nice summary of some of the issues with the popular vote count.

    I'm sure you can find differing numbers on different sites; those are just the first couple places I came across.

    More importantly I think to your main argument, while I am sure you can find some Obama supporter who has said anything you want, the main tack on this site and others from many Obama supporters, including myself, is that pledged delegates are far more important than superdelegates, as pledged delegates are elected in the individual primaries and caucuses by voters, while superdelegates are free to choose as they please ignoring the will of the 36 million people who voted. And by all counts Obama did win the pledged delegate count, taking either 51 or 52% of the pledged delegates (the change is due to the fact that some places are still assigning delegates). So Obama supporters were arguing that pledged delegates are the most important measure and everyone agrees that Obama won the majority of pledged delegates. Arguing that pledged delegates are most important is very different from arguing that the popular vote tally is most imporant -- because there's no reliable way to get a representative popular vote that both parties can agree to.

    Of course, you aren't using the number of pledged delegates, but the number of total delegates post the Florida/Michigan ruling. But that's putting two different things in the numerator and denominator. Obama won the majority of pledged delegates flat out. He has also won the majority of superdelegates, but they aren't the measure of popular support according to the rules, the pledged delegates are. As for popular vote, we simply don't know the "real numbers" as there are no real numbers. You have to estimate this and not count that and minimize the support of caucuses.... It's all completely ad hoc.
  • DLS
    "it is they, not I, who dwell in negativism"

    It's a cheap shot that really doesn't go anywhere against any non-liberal, because while you obvious libbies claim the mantle of positivism (not merely the specific definition of an old conceit and "movement" from long ago, but the more general sense of the word as the antonym of "negativism") and even more broadly, optimism (casting your opponents as swamped or submerged [note] in pessimism), I've been more positive than many, much of the time, while being free to criticize that which merits cricism -- sorry to burst people's not only highly optimistic and idealistic and naive, but less than sensible bubbles many a time.

    Meanwhile, I've been well on a higher plane than so many on the Left, notably on the far Left, including on this site, whose hatred and venom and viciousness has little limits (because they have chosen to be deranged and engaged in little reasoning or more importantly, restraint [a negative no-no to conservative hating kids]). We see it even to this day among the many farther left in the Obama camp who have been more vicious and vile toward Hillary Clinton than any of us non-libs and even those on the far right (where we ordinarily non-lib standard Americans are dishonestly place by some even on this site), particularly among those who were the most loony anti-war before any evidence was presented for it or subject to question, and whose rabid rantings seem frequently tied to vile hatred of Bush.

    It's your side that features that hatred and derangement. Good going. [salute]

    "Change" is not the same as "improvement" to those of us who are grown up, and are not naive, idealist, or otherwise Hopelessly Liberal, All Liberal, All the Time. And there is such a thing as good versus bad, right versus wrong, and what deserves a negative reaction and response gets that from us.

    OK, go ahead and retain your Optimist crown now.

    "We should change! It's progress! Go, go! Do it, now!"

    "Why? The last time it was done that way, we had problems. We need to think about this."

    "You're a negativist."

    In that situation, yes, indeed.

    Incidentally, Steve K., I haven't made up my mind yet. Obama has lefty baggage and more importantly Dem machine baggage but McCain is a DC fixture and is not always trustworthy. It may be lesser-of-two-evils for me. (shake up DC even pitifully versus avoid the threat of worse, like 1992-4)
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