What’s Really Behind Hillary Clinton’s Big Battle Over The Michigan And Florida Delegations?
So what’s REALLY behind Senator Hillary Clinton’s big battle to seat the Florida and Michigan delegations and lump the two states’ popular primary votes into hers, even though her own associates had originally backed the DNC’s stand on “punishing” the two states for not obeying party rules — and just one week after many analyists claimed Clinton was toning down her polarizing campaign?
Some websites and analysts now think the motor of action on this could be, to put it bluntly, this: the Clintons want Hillary to be Vice President on Senator Barack Obama’s Democratic Presidential campaign ticket if, as many expect, he gets the nomination.
Here are the key components of this theory.
First, there was this via Time:
What will Clinton’s terms of surrender turn out to be? Her husband, for one, seems to have a pretty clear idea what he thinks she should get as a consolation prize. In Bill Clinton’s view, she has earned nothing short of an offer to be Obama’s running mate, according to some who are close to the former President. Bill “is pushing real hard for this to happen,” says a friend. Hillary is more opaque about what she might want, divulging little even to those who see and talk to her every day. “It’s as plain as the nose on your face that this whole thing has shifted to a different mode,” says a top Clinton strategist. “But I don’t know what she wants. I don’t know what she’s thinking.”
Then The Field’s Al Giordano had this:
The Field can now confirm, based on multiple sources, something that both campaigns publicly deny: that Senator Clinton has directly told Senator Obama that she wants to be his vice presidential nominee, and that Senator Obama politely but straightforwardly and irrevocably said “no.” Obama is going to pick his own running mate based on his own criteria and vetting process.
And that is all that anybody needs to know to understand the childish and wounded behavior of Senator Clinton yesterday, grandstanding hypocritically to senior citizens in Florida..
Popular progressive blogger Kos of the Daily Kos then wrote this:
In matters like these, I won’t put much stock on anyone’s secret sources — whether it’s Time or the always excellent Al Giordano– since there’s so much bullshit, misinformation, and rumors floating around that it would be impossible for anyone to sift between fact and fiction. There are probably only a handful of people who would know whether this is true, and they’re not publicly dishing.
But as a theory, Clinton’s over-the-top outbursts yesterday really would fit the pattern of someone scorned of a prize they felt they had rightfully earned. In the stages of grief, we may have gone from “bargaining” back to “anger”.
Later, as Giordano points out, Talk Left’s always excellent Big Tent Democrat, writing about a Clinton conference call (TMV wasn’t invited but we will break our rule once here about passing on posts about blogger conference calls to which we were not invited) notes that the top Clinton strategists talking to bloggers and newspeople flatly deny the report.
The bottom line? It seems logical that Clinton is pressing this issue in this hot-button, highly polarizing way because (1)she thinks she can win, OR (2) her campaign feels more will come out about Obama or he will seriously stub his political toe OR (3)she is doing a full-court press to accumulate maximum power within the party for some influence on Obama’s campaign or the party’s future course OR (4) she’s doing pressing her case so delegates in effect say to Obama “Oh, please, Daddy, please, make the lady stop — give her the Vice Presidential slot on your ticket!”
It is plausible that this is pressure tactic to get the Vice Presidential nomination. According to reports, Obama is now starting his search for a Veep. And, the New York Times now reports, as the race (supposedly) wants, talk of an Obama-Clinton ticket grows.
But some, including Boston’s Mayor who is a Clinton delegate, say Clinton shouldn’t be on the ticket:
Boston Mayor Thomas Menino said Hillary Clinton shouldn’t run for vice president on a ticket with Barack Obama because her husband, former President Bill Clinton, could cause problems for the new administration.
“If she got back into the White House, she’d bring along Big Daddy, and he would overshadow the president,” Menino said in an interview Thursday.Bill Clinton is “pushing real hard” for his wife to be Obama’s running mate, Time magazine reported this week.
Menino, 65, was reelected to his fourth term as mayor in 2005. He endorsed New York Sen. Clinton in 2007 and is a pledged Clinton delegate to the Democratic convention this August.
Confirmed? No. Possible? Yes.
If it’s true, will the Democratic party, its DNC apparatus — and Obama — be pressured into putting her on the ticket to halt what seems to now be a Democratic party march towards an ugly, election-losing split?
For more viewpoints on this story GO HERE.
Comments to “What’s Really Behind Hillary Clinton’s Big Battle Over The Michigan And Florida Delegations?”
[...] PoliJAM Blog wrote an interesting post today onHere’s a quick excerptWhat’s Really Behind Hillary Clinton’s Big Battle Over The Michigan And Florida Delegations? May 22nd, 2008 by JOE GANDELMAN, Editor-In-Chief So what’s REALLY behind Senator Hillary Clinton’s big battle to seat the Florida and Michigan delegations and lump the two states’ popular primary votes into hers, even though her own associates had originally backed the DNC’s stand on “punishing” the two states for not obeying party rules — and just one week after many analyists claimed Clinton was to [...]
Obama is his own person and won't be pressured into anything. I noticed he gets stubborn when pushed.
After the conduct by the Clintons in the race I do not think he will offer the spot to her. Nor do I think he wants the Clintons around for 4 years. He is basically running against the Clintons and the Bushes.
The behavior of her surrogates would also make them not acceptable to him. Plus they are too connected to the Clintons.
I think he wants to defuse the power they have had over the party for the past 20 years and have stagnated and weakened the party. Putting her on just keeps them in power. It's his party now.
I think her actions the past day is of two reasons.
1 – A temper tantrum for being turned down and blocking hers and Bill's return to the spotlight.
2. – Power play. As I said, Obama wants to free the party of the Clintons iron grip and since it is his, he wants the freedom of the leadership. Without Clinton backstabbing and power plays. So, they are doing the power plays now. They want to retain control and Obama wants them out.
She wants to stir things up for May 31 to try to overturn the nomination and this is her way of doing it with threats and disruptions.
But, I do think Pelosi, et. al. will fight her as well. They have not come out in order to have leverage on May 31. They will push back at the Clintons.
The DNC needs to resolve the election problems we face due to the caucus/popular vote nomination process, potential election fraud in states without easily audited paper ballots, and the current and future effect of Republican-led state legislatures disrupting the Democratic primaries by changing their states’ primary dates.
This FL & MI mess is a great opportunity to tackle all three of the above problems. If we re-vote by mail in MI & FL in June or July, we automatically bring both states back into compliance with DNC rules on timing of elections. This prevents any future Republican attempts to disrupt the Dem nomination process by moving up the primary dates. A precedent would be established requiring states not in compliance to utilize a future mail-in process. It also helps prevent election fraud because paper ballots are physically available for recounts or audits. Finally, it would create a route for Hillary to establish that she really is more electable without Obama’s side claiming she manipulated the party pledged or Superdelegates.
The DNC should coordinate the mail-in for FL and MI based on Oregon’s successful 100% mail-in model. We have enough money to pay for these two states if we utilize equipment we already have, especially since it’s much cheaper to do a mail-in than try to repeat the vote through the two states’ election process.
This is the DNC’s chance to enfranchising voters in MI and FL while mitigating the problems caused by those states’ Republican-led legislatures.
Could the writing on the wall be any more plain? Sen. Clinton needs to do the right thing here, which is to get off the playing field… and that includes taking her husband and any VP aspirations with her.
Newt, I would add another item to the wish list: all voting software should be open source. Recording and tallying is not some super secret proprietary task that no one has figured out how to do. It's preposterous to let the details of how our vote is counted be a secret. If Diebold can't do it with open source software, that can be inspected by outside experts, I'm confident some other company can. It should be a requirement for getting and keeping the contract.
I was on the National Staff in three campaigns, McCarthy 68; Anderson 80; Mondale 84. During the first two I watched the Dems destroy themselves. Teddy K. took the campaign to the Convention in '80 being 700 delegates behind. Why should Hillary listen to the MSM which is so in-the-tank for Obama? The Dems need her as much or more than she needs them.
If Obama actually did turn her down [and I say "if,"] then she's perfectly within her rights to go to the Convention Floor and have those SuperDelegates demonstrate again that there is nothing Democratic about the Democrat Party. Especially when you have a crazed maniac like DeanScreamMachine arbitrarily denying FL & MI any votes. Even the Repubs only penalize half for an infraction.
The circular firing squad in action. Always think they'll win because the MSM supports the most lib candidate and then, as if by magic, they lose. And then they claim it was stolen because they're so delusional, they don't have a scintilla of self-knowledge. It used to be called “other-directed people,” but now it's a generalized psychosis on the left. Or governing by tantrum.
Even the Repubs only penalize half for an infraction.
And the DNC 2008 rules [pdf] specified a 50% penalty. The DNC Rules Committee changed the rule on a voice vote to apply selectively at 100% against FL and MI as retaliation against the rebellious state parties. They also allowed three of the four early states (IA, NH, and SC) to move their dates up earlier than the dates allowed without any penalty, which move violated the same rule that got FL and MI stripped of their delegations. See 11.A and 20.C.1.a in the linked document.
This prevents any future Republican attempts to disrupt the Dem nomination process by moving up the primary dates.
The GOP did not create this mess. The DNC and the state Democratic parties in FL and MI did. Self-inflicted wound. The candidates have all demogogued it, but that's what candidates do.
Tully, going back to the 50% penalty is probably what the compromise will be for FL, but imposing the 100% penalty was almost unanimous, including the 12 Clinton supporters on the Rules Committee. The sole dissenting vote? An Obama supporter from FL.
Dave, here's what Clinton campaign chair Terry McAuliffe said about breaking the rules (when he ran the DNC):
“I’m going outside the primary window,” [Michigan Sen. Carl Levin] told me definitively.
“If I allow you to do that, the whole system collapses,” I [McAuliffe] said. “We will have chaos. I let you make your case to the DNC, and we voted unanimously and you lost.”
He kept insisting that they were going to move up Michigan on their own, even though if they did that, they would lose half their delegates. By that point Carl and I were leaning toward each other over a table in the middle of the room, shouting and dropping the occasional expletive.
“You won’t deny us seats at the convention,” he said.
“Carl, take it to the bank,” I said. “They will not get a credential. The closest they’ll get to Boston will be watching it on television. I will not let you break this entire nominating process for one state. The rules are the rules. If you want to call my bluff, Carl, you go ahead and do it.”
We glared at each other some more, but there was nothing much left to say. I was holding all the cards and Levin knew it. [Source: McAuliffe, Terry. What A Party!, p. 325.]
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[...] Joseph A. Palermo wrote an interesting post today onHere’s a quick excerptBoston Mayor Thomas Menino said Hillary Clinton shouldn’t run for vice president on a ticket with Barack Obama because her husband, former President Bill Clinton, could cause problems for the new administration. … [...]