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Why No Universal Health Care
Monte Wolverton, Cagle Cartoons
28 Responses to “Why No Universal Health Care”
But what Senators Obama, Clinton, or Edwards ever bother to explain is how they plan on having single payer while maintaining open borders, while maintaining the current tort system and while having the government decide what technologies should exist or not. Every plan discussed would put everyone back to a fee for service system which would massively increase medical spending just not for those without insurance but for everyone.
For many people all single payer gets them is higher taxes while taking away the insurance they currently use.
Exactly, superdestroyer. The proper answer to the question asked in the cartoon’s title (“Why no universal health care?”) is that we can’t have universal health care, and afford it, without making major changes to our current system. We need to start having the discussion of what we are willing to give up in order to extend coverage to everyone.
I’m sick of it. Nationalize the system. Toss the stock in the dumpster. Tell the investers that I am sick of supporting rich people. Wealth is a privilage not a right and investing is not earning, its risking. You lose.
Then, shoot all the insurance executives.
Besides, the rest of the planet has universal healthcare, why can’t we? (I know: Corrupt bastards want to clean unearned riches off the backs of the sick and suffering).
Tossing out a term like “Universal Health Care� is an invitation to people like White Agent to respond with a typical knee-jerk approval of this ill conceived concept.
If the left would simply stop and think for a moment, they would be able to outline what they would like the operation of a health care system to look like, and from that model the answer as to how to achieve it would flow.
Try calm reasoning and honest assessment for a change.
Try calm reasoning and honest assessment for a change.
Ya think?? They teach doctors to first do no harm. Maybe they need to teach pols the same thing. Implicit in the cartoon above is the idea that universal health care must be superior to the existing system. Is is possible that a poorly-designed universal health care proposal may be worse than no change at all? I’d suggest that it is. We need less rhetoric, and much more detail.
Well kneeJERK jwest-
Oh we WILL have National Universal Healthcare, no doubt about it. All your neocon money, bought propaganda advertising and general BS will NOT stop it. So, really, if you are still holding med stock when it happens, then you are an idiot. Not like you haven’t been warned.
Our healthcare system, (more like anarchy), does NOT work.
White Agent,
That is exactly the type of calm reasoning and honest assessment that will make the dream of universal healthcare a reality.
You have an ability (unique among liberals) to see through my feigned concern for designing a better health system and find the true goal – my quest for unearned wealth while oppressing minorities.
It’s so hard to get our evil schemes past people like you now that Keith Olbermann brings you the truth each night.
Curses…..Foiled again!
“is that we can’t have universal health care, and afford it, without making major changes to our current system.”
Universal heath care costs less. It would save money. A lot of money.
jwest- We don’t need “calm”, we need CHANGE. Its not like the issue hasn’t been festering for decades now.
And yes, you have been “foiled”. You and your ilk have never cared about anything or anyone. You just want money by any means at the expense of anyone or anything. From babies dying in poverty to the end of all life on the planet, nothing phases you in your addict desire for quick a buck.
You will be shoved into a hole and “crapped on” regarding this issue. I have no doubt what-so-ever.
BrotherAlpha- Yeah, at the expense of fewer rich bastards. Fine with me.
Brother Alpha,
I’m sure there are ways to make the system more efficient, but making it a govt bureaucracy doesn’t spring to my mind as the best way to do that. Having everyone insured and able to access preventative care would definitely help, but the numbers aren’t that compelling for major savings there and there’s still the problem of whether or not people will take advantage of wellness checkups even if they’re provided (hint: most people generally don’t do so). So what then, do we make it compulsory to have a physical every year or to take your kid to the pediatrician?
And when healthcare costs rise as they inevitably must (aging population and increased expectations; it’s no longer good enough to make sure everyone can get insulin for their diabetes, it’ll eventually become necessary to pay for whatever stem cell treatment cures their diabetes), the GDP isn’t necessarily going to rise accordingly. So faced with unpopular tax hikes or cutting into services, which choice will our fearless leaders make?
We have a model for govt run medicine here, it’s the VA. Even under the best of circumstances it’s administered in a way that limits choices for doctors and patients. If that’s what we must do, we should at least be willing to say so and debate about it rather than ceding these decisions to Washington DC.
White Agent,
Now that you know I’m a rich, bigoted, evil conservative, and I know you’re a poor, unbiased, kind-hearted liberal we have an opportunity to work together to solve the healthcare crisis.
Let’s outline how we want the delivery system to work. I’ll start.
When I feel sick, I want to see the doctor of my choice immediately. No gatekeeper, bureaucrat, insurance company approval, nothing. My choice, who and when I want.
What would you like for your side?
“When I feel sick, I want to see the doctor of my choice immediately.�
Wait a minute. I take this back.
Speaking for the rich conservative side of universal healthcare negotiations, I revise my position to the following:
When I feel sick, I want an advanced degree nurse to come to my home, listen intently to my symptoms and complaints, evaluate my living conditions, diet, etc. I then want the nurse to take my blood pressure, blood & urine sample, temperature and anything else that would normally be done in the doctor’s office that can be accomplished while I’m still at home.
Based on this initial assessment, I would like the nurse to present me with a number of options as to the physician I should see. The nurse could recommend various doctors in the specialties that would pertain to the symptoms I displayed. The nurse could make the appointment for the most convenient time based on necessity and schedule. The doctor I am trying to see will prioritize the appointment based on the information he is receiving from the advance degree nurse plus the vital signs from the tests he gains immediately.
OK, your turn. How do the poor brown people want the initial contact to work?
After careful and considerable deliberations I have decided that the last reason cited is actually the only one with validity.
In the wild the gene pool actually determines only the strongest should survive.
Applying that here would most certainly get rid of the sickly and unproductive and allow for a healthier America. Then throw in the Non Transfat Freedom Fries along with lots and lots of Lipitor and Prosac and we have a healthy nation.
Why continue to pay for the weak. They should be done away with and their gene pool removed from the breeding grounds. It is after all the democratic way. I propose we put it to a vote.
All in favor of doing away with the weak, sniveling sick people vote Aye. Those Opposed please note that in my plans sick people will be denied the right to vote as well. Now those opposed??
Nobody,
Interesting concept you’ve got there and it has a good basis in statistics.
Over 70% of total healthcare dollars are spent on people in their last year of life. Extraordinary methods (extraordinarily expensive methods) are used to keep people alive for a few additional months.
However, there may be a bit of resistance to this portion of the plan by certain sectors. Perhaps we could keep bits of this in a softened presentation.
The problem with Universal health care is that once put into place the quality of healthcare goes way down.
Now here is my plan for doing away with the sick and the weak.
Now what I propose is that the sickess people or those with no health care coverage which is about 47 million people, be allowed to volunteer for the war in Iraq and afghanistan. Where upon we will force them to breed with the Iraqis and the Afghanis.
Now I realize that this plan is slow but over a period of the next 1 to 200 years we will see a steady decline in the general health of the Iraqis and Afghanis to such a point that they will no longer want to pick up guns but will in fact be demanding health care.
So you see my plan ends both Terrorism and the looming healthcare crisis in America in one brilliant stroke of genius.
We could call it a “SURGE.”
Ah, a Modest Proposal, eh, Nobody?
jwest: your comments here have provided great comic relief. Thanks for responding to attacks with grace and good humor.
At least you’re thinking outside the box.
> If the left would simply stop and think for a moment,
It doesn’t, as a rule, and has been particuarly bad around here these days.
> We have a model for govt run medicine here, it’s the VA.
Exactly, and the phrase “VA horror stories” is a cliche from heavy use. That should be a warning, provide those badly in need to would stop and think for a change.
I’m sorry but it’s really the right that hasn’t thought this one through.
We already have nationalized health care.
It’s called emergency rooms. They cannot turn anyone away, regardless of their ability to pay.
Health care is already free for the poor, they just happen to get very very expensive care at the worst possible time. And those costs get passed onto everyone else.
I don’t think this is a zero sum game, I think that by giving prevenative care (which is sill much different than “gold-plated” health care) we can actually save money for everyone.
You know, I keep asking the question and no one seems to answer.
I’m really interested to hear how someone on the liberal side wants their healthcare system to work. Not generalities, specifics on what they want when a system is in place.
Piece by piece. One step at a time.
Above, I outlined a scenario were I felt sick and told how I would like the initial phase of my care to proceed. Does everyone agree that this is what we should shoot for? Does someone have a different set of actions that they think would be better?
Let’s hear any additions or changes and we can move on the next step.
Well, I’m not a heath care professional, nor is anyone here that I know of, so detailed plans would be very hard for us to come up with, but I’ll try.
Really, the general can be handled in two words, preventative care.
Again I don’t know the numbers, but there are a handful of diseases that are very expensive to treat if caught late, such as diabetes, heart disease, or other conditions which are very contagious and cause large economic hardship, such as the flu.
So, something like everyone should get a free yearly checkup, and blood work to check for these major drains on our system. You would also need to provide medicine for chronic conditions such as the diabetes first mentioned, or free flu shots to prevent the spread of flu. All of this could be don’t targeting just those diseases which have the biggest cost of going untreated first.
So this would mean that the 47 million or whatever would still be uninsured if they, say got into a car accident or fell out of a tree or something. It’s not perfect from a common good standpoint, but it’s at least a start.
I think that’s a great first step, and that after we got such a system up and running we could think about the next step.
I will speak for the left cause I can.
I want to arrive at the hospital in a Limo. Flashing Lights and shouting crowds.
I want to have the red carpet rolled out to my door and walk hand in hand with two beautiful blond nurses escorting me and messaging my stiff and aching shoulders.
There upon I wish to flash the clerk (A disgruntled former Republican Rich Debutante)my Healthcare platinum card which will immediately sound a loud trumpet and the entire hospital will come running to succor my wounds. To care for my ills, to alleviate my pain and suffering.
Once The card has been shown I will be immediataly ushered in to see the janitor who dropped out of Tech school school so that he could make some real money. Where upon he and the nurse will Google my symptoms. Upon finding matches they will then have to Wiki the results so that they can figure out what in the hell the authors are talking about.
I will then be prescribed medicine where the ex Mcdonalds busboy will prepare my medicine by Yahoo’ing the Janitors prescription and Wiki’ing the damn results so that combined the two of them get it right.
I will then take my medicine confident that the little people are in charge and walk to the (Ex Republican Debutante) who will inform me in her haughty nasal voice that I owe
NOTHING.
And on the way out mumble “Ya get what ya pay for”
Kevin,
I think you’re absolutely right about the preventative care portion of a plan.
This could tie in with the advance degree nurse (ADN) I mentioned in my scenario. Who would be in a better position to recommend and carry out a wide array of preventative care measures than an ADN that knows a person or family’s circumstances and history?
The ADN idea is also a cost savings technique that helps increase the quality of care while reducing costs. An ADN is less expensive than a doctor, would be able to eliminate unnecessary steps in process and would be more willing and able to really listen to a patient’s symptoms and concerns.
By using an ADN as the primary agent for preventive care, the long terms cost could be reduced significantly.
Nobody,
The card you speak of is one of the things I would also like to bring to healthcare. Last time I researched costs in the field, approximately 23% of physicians overhead is spent in the billing and collection of fees.
If one card made direct, immediate payment into the doctor’s account, it would be much more efficient.
Yeah, I’d certainly be happy if people gave the ADNs a try. I’d be a little worried that we’d waste some of the preventive power by using people who would only be able to diagnose the common problems and miss the rare, but equally disastrous cases. But the best way to confirm or rebuke that fear is just a good field test, so bring it on =)
The ADNs are only the first step in the process.
Next, we come to the point that you are actually sick, been referred to a specialist in that area and require care. How does everyone want this step to occur?
Later, we address the follow-up portion of the care and then we discuss how it’s made affordable to everyone.
This discussion is great, but as a conservative I’m obligated to watch “24� tonight.
Our hero, Jack Bauer, tortures with reckless abandon the way Dick Cheney taught us.
Well, “24� just ended.
We were all concerned Jack may have injured his hand beating information out of prisoner, but the episode ended well with him knee deep in dead terrorists.
Boy, does television get any better than this?