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Posted by on Nov 3, 2016 in 2016 Presidential Election | 38 comments

Trump Victory Still Possible

It is still theoretically possible for Donald Trump to be victorious on November 8th.

That is the news coming from Nate Silver, editor in chief of FiveThirtyEight. He states, “In fact, Clinton would probably lose the Electoral College in the event of a very close national popular vote.”

If Trump did pull off an upset and win, then I certainly wouldn’t cry about it. Although I have spoken negatively about Trump, I have never been a member of the Never-Trump gang. I would prefer that he win instead of Clinton, because I believe Clinton to be crooked.

Yes, America will survive if Trump wins.

Whether or not the Republican Party survives is an altogether different issue.

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Copyright 2016 The Moderate Voice
  • Robert P. Coutinho

    Allow me to inform you that if you believe Clinton is crooked, then you need an entirely new word to describe Trump.

    1) Uses courts to force people to accept less then he contracted for (due to litigation expenses).
    2) Has shown an absolute contempt of court rulings–lying and cheating is his basic M.O.
    3) Has about a 75% lying rate at Politifact.com. This puts him in a league of his own.
    4) Has bribed officials (he said so himself, on national television, during the debates)
    5) Has (likely) sexually assaulted women–and then bragged about it!
    6) Is on record as insisting that Obama was not born in the US, in spite of Obama’s release of his birth certificate from Hawaii
    7) Uses bankruptcy laws in order to stiff creditors and investors
    8) Committed fraud with his so-called University
    9) Used charity money to settle law suits
    10) Used charity money to buy paintings of himself!
    11) Uses money donated for his campaign to pay HIMSELF four and five times the normal rate for use of his own properties

    I could go on, but why bother?

    • dduck

      Trump is worse: So

  • dduck

    DR, Crooked HC is still better.

  • Slamfu

    With Robert on this one. You think Hillary is crooked but you Donald Trump doesn’t raise such concerns with you? He has done nothing but hide everything from us. His tax returns, his business dealings, everything, and there are a LOT of questionable things he’s done, and a LOT of lies he’s been caught in. He’s screwed so many people on deals he’s had over 3500 fraud lawsuits filed against him. He even stiffed the “Freedom Girls” who played at one of his gigs

    http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2016/09/06/usa-freedom-girls-sue-trump-campaign-for-stiffing-them.html

    Clinton meanwhile has released just about everything possible, been investigated and cleared by just about everyone who you can name, and the Clinton Foundation has been vetted and opened it’s books and remains one of the highest rated charities in the world. Meanwhile Donald Trump does nothing but obfuscate and mislead at every turn. And you’re worried about Clinton being crooked? That is just nuts. I wonder what it’s like playing poker with Trump. If it’s anything like how he campaigns, I bet he just tells everyone he’s got the best hand then scoops up the pot without showing his cards. And if you were playing with him you’d let him.

    • dduck

      “You think Hillary is crooked but you Donald Trump doesn’t raise such concerns with you?” Many

    • KP

      Clinton meanwhile has released just about everything possible

      Released to WikiLeaks?(!)

      the Clinton Foundation has been vetted and opened it’s books and remains one of the highest rated charities in the world.

      This one of those comments we can revisit in a couple years.

      Lance Armstrong also started a great Foundation. My gut told me Lance was dirty and the Foundation enriched him. My gut tells me Hillary is _far_ dirtier than Lance.

      Long live the good Foundations absent Lance and Hillary/Bill.

      • Brownies girl

        My gut tells me Hillary is _far_ dirtier than Lance.

        Just what the US needs. People making decisions on their gastro-intestinal feelings. I think GWB was the last Prez who ruled that way. Am sure most Americans are happy with THAT outcome. (sigh)

        • KP

          You are silly 🙂

          My comment was about the Foundation.

          I am a never Hillary and a never Trump voter and have been for eighteen months. Stated here for eighteen months.

          I am saddened for those in contested states who feel they must make the binary choice between the two.

          I know my compassion for those voters doesn’t take you into consideration, but like the lad (Ger) from Ireland, good to hear additional opinions.

      • Bob Munck

        My gut tells me Hillary is _far_ dirtier than Lance.

        It’s really strange the way that people try to borrow authority from their “gut.” Are you hoping that we will give more credence to your opinion if you tell us it originates in your gastrointestinal tract?

        Wouldn’t it be more honest for you to say “My hatred tells me Hillary is _far_ dirtier than Lance.”

        • KP

          I don’t hate Hillary and I am not “worried” about a Hillary Presidency (in the way Trump concerns me). If elected I will support her and wish her well. I think she will do fine. I just won’t vote for her.

          My two cents.

          • Bob Munck

            I don’t hate Hillary

            Then why in the wide, wide world of sports would you have written “Hillary is _far_ dirtier than Lance [Armstrong]?” You don’t seem to have any justification for doing so other than that your gastrointestinal microbiota told you to (and, of course, on a cell-for-cell basis, they vastly outnumber you). You cannot logically write such things over and over and then dismiss them with that simple four-word denial.

          • dduck

            Hmmmm.

          • KP

            “You cannot … write such things over and over.”

            Yes, I can 🙂

            I can also use quotation marks the way you do; meaning out of context and/or inaccurate.

          • Bob Munck

            Yes, I can

            Sadly true. You could also proclaim with gut-level authority that the Moon is made of Moody Blue Cheese.

  • JSpencer

    Thanks DR for proving you haven’t been paying attention. This is exactly the sort of nonsense that drives rational voters nuts. You’d better hope your guy doesn’t win, unless you actually want our country to be the laughing stock of the civilized world.

  • Brownies girl

    DR writes:

    Yes, America will survive if Trump wins.

    No, it won’t. That’s the only thing I know for sure! I’ve read that Republicans have already got plans to start up trying to impeach Hillary – before she’s even elected. My bet is they’d ALL be putting plans in place to impeach Trump within a couple of months of his election — (please God don’t let his election happen!) – and they’ll be sorrier than ANYONE can imagine should that moron gain access to the Oval Office.

    • Slamfu

      While usually I think any claim of “Destroying America” is wild hyperbole, at worst Presidents can cause economic collapses and foolish conventional wars that gets hundreds of thousands killed, there is one thing that Trump has talked about during this campaign that sets him apart from any other candidate I’m familiar with and makes him credible to this opinion. He has spoken very casually about the use of nuclear weapons that as President he would have authority to use. For all their warmongering and inept foreign policy even Cheney and Rumsfeld never implied they think nukes are just another tool in the box. Of all the things Trump has said during his campaign to scare me about his fitness for President, this is the worst by far, which is really saying something.

      • KP

        x2

  • Shannon Lee

    and I recall DR being quite the Trump fan when he first started writing for TMV. I will admit that it does take courage to write negative comments about Trump, particularly after he was caught talking about grabbing women by their ….
    HC is no more crooked than most other Senators. The difference being that she has been under the spotlight for decades and the wife of a 2 term President.

    POTUS holds the fate of the planet in their hands. Does DR really trust Trump with that power? Anyone that trusts Trump with the nuclear codes needs to have their head checked.

    • dduck

      “HC is no more crooked than most other Senators.” Who?

      • JSpencer

        Hard to quantify, very few politicians have been vivisected to the extent HC has. Given that, and what little has come of it, it’s easy to concur with Shannon.

        • dduck

          Thanks.

      • Brownies girl

        I’d love for someone (anyone) on TMV to clearly and concisely and HONESTLY tell this ‘foreigner’ why people HATE Hillary so much. What has she ever done to inspire such bitter hatred? What has she done to affect any regular American’s daily life? This is something so many of we outside your territorial borders will never understand. BG

        • dduck

          Dislike/not hatred for me.

          • Brownies girl

            OK, not hatred for you — but so many other Americans use that term ‘hate’ when referring to her. But honestly dd — why even ‘dislike’? I have relatives up HERE, (all guys, all Canucks!) who say they don’t like her either — but none of them is able to say why. The most they can say is ‘she’s boring’; ‘I hate her voice’; “she’s a crook!” (no specifics are offered on this latter one, no EVIDENCE or anything). I can’t figure it out. So, why do YOU dislike her so much? I just want to understand is all.
            And please don’t tell me it’s a “gut” feeling. 😉
            BG

          • dduck

            If you have to ask………
            “I happen to detest HC personally, but I think she is smarter than BO who I think is a well meaning schmuck, although I like him. IMHO, Machiavelli would be proud of HC, but not her stupid, self- hurting mistakes. I’m 99% sure, just as I was about Dewey, that HC is in and will cut many deals, some to enrich the Clintons, and some to avoid too much gridlock in the country. Of course, much depends on the composition of Congress and the little grey cells in the heads of the Rep leadership (I hope), to move the ball and start improving the Rep party; the old white guys like me are dying.”

          • Brownies girl

            HI dd — you write “if you have to ask”. Yea, I have to because I truly don’t understand it. So bear with me.

            “I happen to detest HC personally, but I think she is smarter than BO who I think is a well meaning schmuck, although I like him.

            That you detest HC *personally*, I assume you’ve met her. Even if you haven’t, what’s so bad about having a Prez who’s smarter than BO. I’d think that might be a PLUS. Am glad you like BO, tho, I like him too. As an aside, IMO, he’ll be remembered as one of the greatest US presidents ever. Your mileage may vary.

            IMHO, Machiavelli would be proud of HC, but not her stupid, self-hurting mistakes.

            According to Wiki, there’s this: “Machiavellianism” is a widely used negative term to characterize unscrupulous politicians of the sort Machiavelli described most famously in The Prince. Machiavelli described immoral behavior, such as dishonesty and killing innocents, as being normal and effective in politics. He even seemed to endorse it in some situations. …. On the other hand, many commentators, such as Baruch Spinoza, Jean-Jacques Rousseau and Denis Diderot, have argued that Machiavelli was actually a republican, even when writing The Prince, and his writings were an inspiration to Enlightenment proponents of modern democratic political philosophy.

            He MAY HAVE BEEN a republican! Oh yay! Anyway, yes, Hillary has made mistakes — no argument from me on that point, but name me any politician who rose high on the ladder who hasn’t. For Hillary, the e-mail fiasco is a huge one. Her closeness to the Wall St guys is another. In your opinion, what are some others? Honest question.

            I’m 99% sure, just as I was about Dewey, that HC is in and will cut many deals, some to enrich the Clintons, and some to avoid too much gridlock in the country.

            You voted in the ’48 election?! Yikes! How OLD are you?! 😉 Anyway, what kind of deals do you have in mind that she would sign, as a sitting President, that would enrich the Clintons? Please name one.

            Of course, much depends on the composition of Congress and the little grey cells in the heads of the Rep leadership (I hope), to move the ball and start improving the Rep party

            A futile hope, IMO. There aren’t enough little grey cells in the heads of the Rep leadership to fill a thimble. I give you their idea of maintaining an 8-member SCOTUS for years, as just one example. Isn’t filling SCOTUS with 9 members just one of their jobs?

            the old white guys like me are dying.

            Lordy lord – I hope not, at least in your case, old man! You add interest here for me. And I appreciate so much your answering my question with words instead of links to other places — none of which I click on. Like a lot of old ladies, I’d rather communicate with a real person! All best!l BG

          • dduck

            “Even if you haven’t, what’s so bad about having a Prez who’s smarter than BO. I’d think that might be a PLUS. Am glad you like BO, tho, I like him too.” Agreed.

            Personally: 2. from someone’s personal standpoint or according to their particular nature; in a subjective rather than an objective way.
            “he had spoken personally and emotionally”

          • Bob Munck

            So, why do YOU dislike her so much?

            The right wing, both their leadership and their media, has seen the Clintons as a major threat to their position and power since the early 1990s. They have done everything in their capability to defeat that threat for almost a quarter century. The constant drumbeat of lies, accusations, innuendo, and half-truths has been sufficient to convince not only the conservative rank-and-file but people of all political persuasions to some degree. It’s a combination of the “big lie” and “where there’s smoke there’s fire” effects.

            Sure, the Clintons have real flaws and make mistakes, at levels that are ignored in others. (Imagine if Bill Clinton had the history of marriage fidelity of a Gingrich, Giuliani, or Trump.) The power of the Big Lie, shouted over decades, is truly fascinating. The right wing may have succeeded in their attempt to destroy the Clintons; unfortunately the collateral damage of that victory may include the destruction of the United States. Of course, that will also destroy their own position and power; right-wingers just aren’t very bright.

            EDIT: I see that Ballard Burgher has published an article saying approximately what I just said, specifically using the term “big lie.” I’m sitting in a hotel in Costa Mesa with very bad WiFi, failing to keep up.

          • dduck

            “Flaws”: gagging

          • Bob Munck

            gagging

            That’s your whole argument?

          • dduck

            And chortling.

  • Slamfu

    I would prefer that he win instead of Clinton, because I believe Clinton to be crooked.

    Although I have already weighed in here, I feel this can’t be said enough. When you find yourself on the same side of the aisle as the American Nazi Party and the Ku Klux Klan, you really might want to take a long hard look in the mirror, a deep breath, and re-evaluate some things.

    • dduck

      Who said that, please.

      • Brownies girl

        DR wrote the quote, in his article above.

        • dduck

          Thanks, and I said: “DR, Crooked HC is still better.”

          • Brownies girl

            Whatever.

  • Slamfu

    Well, that just happened. God help us all.

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