Press 1 For English, 2 For Spanish
Jan 1st, 2010 | 22 responses
It seems every time I dial an 800 number, the first response from the automated voice asks if I want their menu in English or Spanish. It is such a frequent request that I press 1 before the recorded voice finishes its instructions.
This ritual doesn’t annoy me. Not even close to the frustration of selecting the menu items in which invariably I press the number to speak to a live operator, which oftentimes is another automated voice.
Now, I recognize that automated phone trees save the company I am calling some administrative costs at the expense of old-fashion good PR. I also recognize it is good business.
The U.S. Census Bureau reports nearly 50 million within our diverse population is Hispanic — about one in six among us.
Not only businesses, but our governments accommodate those who are uncomfortable reading and speaking English as a second language. In California, state and federal ballots are offered in more than a dozen languages.
I have never been an advocate of declaring English the official language of the United States. Until about 50 years ago, it was never a problem. Officially. If you migrated to the U.S. for permanent residency, you either learned English in your neighborhood, schools or from your children. If you didn’t and still survived, more power to you.
Pat Buchanon, the conservative who launched two unsuccessful campaigns for president, has written and expressed on talk shows that no country in history has survived under dual or multiple languages. He may be right to some extent. The closest example I can think of is Canada which has experienced a rocky relationship between French Quebec and the rest of the English speaking provinces.
But why preferential treatment for Hispanics? I suppose we as a nation have grown more tolerant in the past half century and the pursuit of the almighty dollar reigns.
A CNN story in September sheds light on the Hispanic impact on our society.
The quickly expanding Latino population is having a healthy impact on the economy, according to Ken Gronbach, author of “The Age Curve: How to Profit from the Growing Demographic Trend.”
“Latinos have saved our country,” he said. “They represent 14 percent of the population but 25 percent of the live births. The United States is the only western industrialized nation with a fertility rate above the 2.2% replacement rate.”
It is seen in housing.
They will also help to prop up the real-estate market once the economy begins to recover, according to Rakesh Kochhar, associate director of the Pew Hispanic Center. During the housing boom, minorities closed much of the homeownership gap, although the bust has worked to widen that again.
And a windfall for Social Security.
Latinos and other minority workers contribute to keeping the Social Security system solvent, according to Monique Morrissey, an economist for the Economic Policy Institute. The undocumented workers among them often pay more into the Social Security pool than they will take out in benefits. Morrissey said estimates of deficits in the pool’s finances were reduced last year when a Social Security advisory board’s technical panel revised some unrealistically low assumptions it had made about Latino immigration.
“They took into account people without papers [paying into Social Security] but not accessing funds from there,” she said. “That’s bad for workers but very good for Social Security.”
Living close to the Mexican border nearly all my life and where the Hispanic population is nearly a third of California’s 33 million population today, the merging of the Latino and white cultures has its bumps but for the most part is like a duck takes to water. I know it from personal experience. I married a Latina.
Just as their predecessors from other cultures, second generation Latinos speak English. Being fluent in English and Spanish is an economic and sociological benefit.
Whether you move to Mexico, Germany or Japan, you are expected to learn their languages. No special favors offered.
Some of my extended Latino family and the homies I know for the most part are offended when you speak to them in terrible Spanish dialect. They are a proud people yet most are grateful you at least try to communicate with them in their native tongues.
So why Press 2 for Spanish when it involves not one-sixth of our population but only a small percentage of that same group who resettled here?
22 Responses to “Press 1 For English, 2 For Spanish”
If is hard to claim that poor Hispanics have had no adverse effect in California when the state is running billions in the red and the public school system is collapsing. You may want to look up the story about Berkeley High School cutting back on AP lab science classes to fund remedial classes for underperforming Hispanics.
Sorry, but if most of the U.S. is going to become just like El Paso, South-Central LA, or any other barrio, then the U.S. is definitely destined to the dust bin of history.
I'm betting it is part of a marketing strategy designed to appeal not only to those speaking Spanish but to those who feel better if we cater to them.
My Latina wife enjoys playing with Anglos trying to condescend to her by telling them “estas excusado” when they apologize for assuming she knows little English. You'll get the joke.
I actually work on the other side of that phone tree, for an inbound call center for a major international bank (specifically, business accounts). Because I work the overnight shift, when our foreign language department (Spanish, Mandarin, Cantonese) does not operate, I have calls from the Spanish phone gate routed to me on occasion. About half the time, I have to get an AT&T interpreter on the line for assistance, but about half the time I discover the people who dial in to the Spanish gate can speak and understand English perfectly fine – it's just that they default to the Spanish option because that is their native language.
>>So why Press 2 for Spanish when it involves not one-sixth of our population but only a small percentage of that same group who resettled here?<<
I have learned that many people will “Press 2 for Spanish” not because they *have* to, but because they *want* to. Don't automatically assume it is done out of necessity, but consider the option that it is done out of choice.
I love the rich diversity of culture within this melting pot of a country, and that includes hearing other languages as well. That said, I strongly believe that when someone chooses to move here there should be an expectation they will either speak the english language, or learn to speak it. There clearly have to be some areas amid our diversity that overlap to create a common identity among all US citizens, and a common language is an obvious first.
thanks mlhradio for facts about this.
I agree with much of what has been said above. Each of my immigrant great-grandparents, whether they came from Ukraine, Poland, or Italy, learned to speak English out of necessity, and out of pride for their newly adopted country.
I firmly believe that when you come here, wherever you come from, you should learn to speak English if you decide to settle in the US. It is what my family did, and it is what countless other immigrants did. I find it disturbing when I hear people demand accommodation rather than assimilate enough to learn sufficient English. The English Language is one of the few things that this country has that is a unifying element, and I don't think that accomodation does anything but damage to that unity.
Very interesting post, Jerry. Thank you.
As one of those who immigrated to this great country who had to finish learning English in a hurry, I understand both the necessity for those who want to be successful in their new country to master the language, and–as has been mentioned–the diversity and richness other languages bring to our melting pot culture.
Just a couple of observations:
According to your citation of Pat Buchanan, “no country in history has survived under dual or multiple languages.” I don't know if that is a very accurate of realistic statement. You mentioned Canada–yes they have had their problems, but I expect they will survive.. There are other examples of countries where two or even three languages are spoken and have survived. Belgium is an example. Yes there have been, and are frictions between the Walloons and the Flemish, but they have historically overcome them, and I am sure will continue to do so.
As to “Whether you move to Mexico, Germany or Japan, you are expected to learn their languages. No special favors offered.” True, to an extent, but because in so many countries, Germany being one of them, such a high percentage of people speak English, Americans could probably survive very well (and do) with English and a sprinkling of the national language.
On the other hand, I find it personally not kosher how many Americans travel/visit overseas and make no effort whatsoever to learn even some rudimentary expressions in the local language, but expect everyone to understand and speak English to them.
Anyway, thank you
Dorian
Interesting article — thanks.
A few comments:
“You may want to look up the story about Berkeley High School cutting back on AP lab science classes to fund remedial classes for underperforming Hispanics.”
I can always count on you, superdestroyer, to assume that others are just as afraid of the brown people as you are. So — are you saying people of Latino descent deserve less education than the already-over-coddled AP kids? Because I don't; and I was one of those over-coddled white AP kids. I was also a bilingual middle school teacher for a while, and I saw very clearly the disparity in resources allocated between the rich white kids and the poor Mexican kids. Your suggestion that widening that disparity would somehow be a good thing is highly offensive. Do you think non-AP kids even GET a science lab these days? They often don't even get books.
“Ihave learned that many people will “Press 2 for Spanish” not because they *have* to, but because they *want* to. Don't automatically assume it is done out of necessity, but consider the option that it is done out of choice.”
Have you ever been bilingual, mlhradio? I was darn close at one point, after living in South America for a great deal of time. People were often impressed to find out that Spanish was not my first language. But you know how often I watched Spanish-language TV, or tried to do anything technical in Spanish, or read a Spanish-language newspaper? Only if absolutely necessary. I could use complex sentence structure and carry on conversations with just about anyone, but I didn't have the lexicon to, say, take instructions on how to fix my computer.
Of course, that's quite besides the point. Companies most certainly wouldn't offer their services in Spanish if it weren't improving their customer service — you know, for their customers, many of whom would rather be served in Spanish. Some companies actually want to make their customers have as easy and positive an experience as possible. That's just good business.
” don't know if that is a very accurate of realistic statement.”
Agreed, Dorian. Switzerland seems to be doing quite well. The Netherlands — don't they have like 4 languages that they manage to keep straight despite all the toking and prostitution? Of course, if it comes out of Pat Buchanan's mouth, you can pretty much guarantee it's exactly wrong in every way, so saying that you “don't know” if it's an accurate statement is far, far too forgiving.
Aren't we forgetting Switzerland? French, Swiss-German, Italian and English. China, Mandarin, Cantonese and others. Portuguese and Spanish in Brazil. Hindi and Punjab in India, French and Swahili, or Woloff, or Bambara. Most Europeans are multilingual. And for businesses, the ability to serve persons speaking different languages is a good thing. I don't know of a single country that has failed in any way because its residents didn't all speak the same language.
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Roro
According to Wikipedia, Dutch is the official language of the Netherlands. I doubt if they print their ballots in a dozen languages.
I love how you are ready to take a crap on the smart kids in public school who are trying to compete with the private schools for places in tier one universitieis. You are a good advertisement for vouchers and getting every middle class and upper middle class white kid out of the public schools as fast as possible.
The schools would have enough money for lab science for everyone if they were not spending money on illegal aliens, trouble makers, and children to just do not want to learn. Every alternative school,, special education program, or bilingual program (that were shown to be failures) is less money for academic learning for the middle of the road kids. However, since such special program create a huge number of jobs for bad teachers, they will continue to expand while real academic learning will continue to decrease.
When the longterm benefits of special education programs (that are hardly limited to any particular ethnicity) are weighed I should think it would be obvious the cost of prevention is always less than the cost of cures. The suggestion that such programs (which have been a part of education for many decades – and again, are hardly limited to any particular ethnicity) are detrimental to mainstream programs or are populated by bad teachers is one I haven't seen any supporting documentation for, although opinions and anecdotes (as usual) abound.
I'm confused by this post. You quote a bunch of people saying how Hispanic immigration has been great for America, but then you “But why preferential treatment for Hispanics?”, as if speaking too Hispanics in their own language is preferential treatment. I think I'm just not understanding your point, so I'm not trying to be critical–just express my confusion.
In any case, I see no problem with a private business providing Hispanic language service for their customers. I also don't see a problem with a private business denying that service due to the cost involved, although doing so in a way such as “We live in America so order in English” is unnecessarily arrogant.
But public policy is a different matter. Certainly it is to our benefit to encourage those who move here to learn English, and secondarily it is important to emphasize Spanish as a second language classes in schools. (I say “secondarily” because of course it is more cost effective to focus on the former.) Ideally we can all meet in the middle somewhere, where many people are bilingual but for those who aren't, they can still function at a basic level in our society because there are a reasonable number of people that understand them.
“I love how you are ready to take a crap on the smart kids in public school who are trying to compete with the private schools for places in tier one universitieis. You are a good advertisement for vouchers and getting every middle class and upper middle class white kid out of the public schools as fast as possible.”
Take a crap on the smart kids? I was one of the smart kids. In fact, I'm practically an advertisement for how awesome public schools can be.
“The schools would have enough money for lab science for everyone if they were not spending money on illegal aliens, trouble makers, and children to just do not want to learn.”
No dear, because instead of educating thsse kids who perhaps weren't born into families where mom n dad spent hours going over homework with their kids and spanking them when they acted up in class, we'd be keeping them stupid, and not having school deal with them for 8 hours a day. So now instead of having a few underacheivers taking up a little extra teacher time than you think they deserve, we've got a bunch of illiterate hoodlums roaming the streets looking for something to do while you're at work all day. Hope you locked your door! Great plan, sd. We decided a long time ago in this country that letting poor kids go uneducated was good for absolutely nobody.
“However, since such special program create a huge number of jobs for bad teachers”
Let's see, these programs require more education and generally see less reward, not to mention having know-nothings like yourself constantly thinking they've got any clue whatsoever what they do. Hmmm…I wonder why it's harder to get good teachers in those areas. I'm assuming this statement was also meant to be a personal dig at me, since I have already stated that I was a bilingual teacher. Whatever — it's so blatantly obvious that you have absolutely no idea what you're talking about. Every comment you make on threads having to do with immigration also shows you to be fearful of or comtemptuous of Mexicans as well. It's kind of sad.
About Dutch being the official language of the Netherlands, you read exactly one sentence on the wiki article, and either forgot to read the rest of the blurb, or conveniently left out that sentence two lists a second official language, and that the next sentence lists that most people speak more than one language. Either way, it doesn't matter — if I had been wrong on that one, there are plenty of other very good examples of ways in which this statement by Pat was absolutely incorrect.
roro,
You should look up admissions at tier one universities. They average about 50% private school kids. Such schools demand AP/IB classes, extra-cirriculars, leadership, and achievement. Most public schools fail to sned a single kids to such schools because they spend their time and effort trying to education the worst students instead of trying to educate the best students.
Also, teaching special educaiton is not about having the proper education but about having the proper credentials. There is a massive over supply of such teachers because it pays more and its easier than teaching math and science (two fields where there are a shortage of teachers).
One of reasons the teachers unions support open borders and unlimited immigration is that is creates a demand for more special education/alternative school teachers while reducing the demand for competent science/math/technology instructors.
And last, if the schools were really judged of whether they were producing hoodlums, most educators would have been fired long ago. The urban public schools are massive failures but are rewarded with more resources while they run off anyone actually interested in learning.
I guess you believe the U.S. should give up competing in the world economy if you believe that the children of illegal aliens are more important that middle class white kids who want to learn. That is the kind of message that ever middle class white family need to remember when they are repeating the Democratic Party talking points.
“You should look up admissions at tier one universities.”
I went to one (got into three), as did quite a few kids from my high school, which was, demographically, half Latino. Yes, kids whose parents have the dough to send their kids to private school tend to go to college. Now, there are a thousand reasons that that is the case, and none of them boil down to “private schools are better than public schools”, and none of them even come close to this idea that it's the Mexicans' faults if white kids who went to public school can't get into these places (in case you were wondering, middle class white people tend to do just fine). One of real reasons: if parents can afford pricey high school, they can probably afford pricey college, too.
“There is a massive over supply of such teachers because it pays more and its easier than teaching math and science”
This is just one more statement, each part of which shows your vast and almost unbelievable ignorance of anything related to education. It really is astonishing that you think this is the case.
“One of reasons the teachers unions support open borders and unlimited immigration is that is creates a demand for more special education/alternative school teachers while reducing the demand for competent science/math/technology instructors.”
Same thing: total, utter ignorance. It's baffling that you even have the courage to say anything on these topics — even with the anonymity provided by this forum — while having such absolutely wrong wrongity wrong wrong ideas about the basic subject matter.
“if the schools were really judged of whether they were producing hoodlums”
This shows a basic misunderstanding of the fact that schools do not produce hoodlums; kids who are hoodlums do have to go to school just like other kids. That is not the fault of schools, it is the fault of whatever made those kids hoodlums in the first place.
“I guess you believe the U.S. should give up competing in the world economy if you believe that the children of illegal aliens are more important that middle class white kids who want to learn.”
I believe the US will be better at competing in the world economy if we educate all kids, not just the ones lucky enough to be born in the suburbs to white parents who won't ever have to teach their kids about gangs or hunger or working 2 jobs. Yes, I think brown kids deserve the same education as white kids. If middle class white families have a problem with that message, too friggin bad.
roro,
The teachers unions have always been a maximum employment union. That is why the support open borders and unlimited immigration for high fertility Hispanics. The teachers unions have been against academic advanced. Look at how the teachers union supports busing, hates tracking, and is generally against AP/IB classes. Look how California what no school to have more AP-IB classes than what the lowest achieving schools have.
The problem is that teaching children from poor families with bad parents consumes a hugh amount of resources with little benefits. Japan, China, Korea do not attempt to teach all kids to be college students. Trying to teach the children of bad parents to be college students leads to failure in the long term. Everyone would be better off is schools are for children to want to learn and the disruptive/bad students are shown the door. The average performance would increase, attendance would probably go up, and it would be cheaper with resources used for the greatest benefit.
However, I guess the left just cannot get past its hated of middle class whites and the pandering to minorities who hate whites. Your plan in the road to failure and it something that progressive whites would never ask of their own children.
Hey superdestroyer, I've just got to conclude that you (a) just have never actually met anyone in a teacher's union, and (b) are an elitist who doesn't think poor kids deserve to be educated.
See, my dad was one of the negotiators for his teacher's union for about 15 years. He also got a great deal of praise and accolades for the awesome job he did at teaching AP calculus for 20 years. What you're saying about open borders, “high fertility Hispancis” (most people would cringe just writing that phrase), AP classes, “hating tracking” (I don't even know what that means?) — all of these ideas about what the teacher's unions want are just so out of left field, and just wrong. What kind of crazy conspiracy theorist are you?
“Japan, China, Korea do not attempt to teach all kids to be college students.”
They also don't believe in a lot of ideals we have here in the US. Your ideas are pretty much antithetical to any sort of meritocracy system, the American Dream, and this country's way of life. I mean, if a society striated and averse to class mobility is what you're going for, at least you're admitting it, but I think your ideas would do better on different continents. I lived in South America for quite a long time — the rich kids of European descent get great educations and the poor kids (dark skinned due to more indigenous blood, in general) don't. Is that what you're going for?
“However, I guess the left just cannot get past its hated of middle class whites and the pandering to minorities who hate whites. Your plan in the road to failure and it something that progressive whites would never ask of their own children.”
You kind of make my stomach turn with this white supremacy bull. Has it ever occured to you that the majority of progressives actually ARE middle class white people? That *I* am a middle class white person? The only real difference here is that I think those who are not middle class or white are also people. Being middle class and white are not that important in my life, to me at least (although they most certainly confer a great deal of privilege on me). I don't consider the group called “middle class white people” something important to preserve, just because I'm one of them. I consider a healthy, big-as-possible middle class to be extremely important, and it would be not only fine but actually far preferrable if that large middle class weren't exclusively white. Again — big as possible. Having a large underclass full of brown people is not something I consider a plus. It's gross that that seems to be what you're looking for.
roro,
Unlike progressives who actually believe that minorities are inferior and need to be babied and protected from their own bad decisions, I believe that everyone individual is responsbile for their own decisions. Thus, I resent it when the government wants to punish middle class whites for being middle class whites. The State of Michigan punished Jennifer Gratz for being white by holding her to a separate and unequal admission standard for college versus whites. You are one of those excuse makers to keep talking about helping everyone while using the government to create jobs for elite progressives and enabling the bad behaviors of the underclass.
And yes, I have meet teachers and unionized teachers. Every labor economics textbook discusses teachers unions and how they are maximum employment unions (the maximum number of jobs) instead of being a maximum wage union. Look at how the teachers unions have use seniority over ability, refuse to support incentive pay, and really do harm poor children by making the entry level of teachng a bad experience.
Why do you think the teachers unions support Democratic boiler plate positions such as open borders and unlimited immigration from the third world, increased entitlement spedning, and bigger government. It creates more jobs for unionized teachers. it is the same reason that the teachers unions support the creation of alternative high schools, the main streaming of severely handicapped students, forced busing, and no testing. Why do you think the teachers unions oppose charter schools, ability tracking, magnet schools, and exist exams. The teachers unions are very consistent is opposing anything that improves academic learning but support many invasive forms of social engineering. Every minute spent on diversity training is a minute lost to academic teaching.
If you look up the make up of the teachers unions they are heavily female, heavily minority, and hate white males with a passion. The problem is that no one stands up to the hatred of white males and thus, their performance has been going down for decades.
And actually, the majorty of progressives are upper class whites who attended private schools and private universities. Progressive never have to pay the diversity tax that the middle class whites in Berkely are paying. My guess is that there is no politician who represents Berkely at any level who has a child in public schools because they know how bad they are and how pathetic public schools teachers have become.
If you want their to be a big middle class, they you should be supporting closed borders, improved academic education, and an end to social engineering. If you want a country of a few elite rich and a massive underclass, keep supporting the current path of government policy.
And you are a fool if you believe that blacks and Hispanic want anything that benefits whites. YOur support of a big middle class would make for sense if the government did not have a policy of separate and unequal treatment of whites. Remember, blacks and Hispanic get into college, get government contracts, and get hired because of their ethnicity. If you eliminate all of the race based government, then you would be correct about not caring about whites. But as long as the govenrment treats whites differently than blacks and Hispanics, then you are unilaterally disarming in a competition for assets.
Well, I guess a whining cry about the oppression of white males was the logical conclusion here, so I'm not sure why I'm surprised to see it so blatant and so pathetic. It's obvious now that that was your agenda all along. Anyway, I can't argue with the twisted logic of someone who thinks white males are the downtrodden in this country. (Well, I can, but why bother?) So good day to you, superdestroyer.
“I believe that everyone individual is responsbile for their own decisions.”
Even a grade-schooler?