Fort Hood Warning Signs

Indeed.

The other point I don't see being seriously discussed (big surprise) is that when some whack-job goes on a shooting rampage and any connection can be made to some Christian-oriented group or right-wing fringe group, then we are told how these organizations are breeding grounds for hatred and violence.

But when someone goes off the way Hasan did, with connections to mosques know for advocating violence towards the West, we are told not to jump to conclusions or make connections to Islam that are not there, and that it was just a misguided, unstable individual.

That political correctness and double standard need to be eliminated.

Be careful what you wish for AR. Obama has justifiably ordered a full report and all documents related to Hasan, the warnings about whom were ignored by the Bush Administration. Now, clearly, we need to look at how information is gathered, shared and acted upon, or not acted upon. In other words, because of Hasan, and sentiments like yours, there will finally be a review of how the Pentagon, CIA and FBI handle intelligence gathering and action deriving from it. It's about time.

ignored by the Bush Administration

Oh, get real. That is really stretching it to provide yourself another slam at Bush.

You can say the same thing about the Obama administration, that they ignored it for the past 10 months while the concerns over his rhetoric got more strident, but that would not be true either.

You can't lay at the feet of an administration low-level personal reviews and investigations that no high-level member was aware of, not for Bush nor for Obama.

And the credit you want to give Obama is after the fact of the shooting. If he had started this review prior, then indeed you would have a leg to stand on.

No AR, you're wrong. Hasan started attending the radical mosque in 2001 (though before 9-11). He started trying to get out of the army in 2004. He gave a presentation in 2007 that was deeply worrying. His communication with the radical cleric in Yemen was last year, under the Bush administration. For heaven's sake, his business card said SOA (Soldiers of Allah).

My point is not that Bush personally ignored it, nor did Obama, but that there is a pattern of missing warning signs that we have to ferret out and eliminate. I would differ with your assertion that either concerns or rhetoric "got more strident". His 2007 speech should have been enough. The Army had both request to leave the service and serious reports of potential trouble for years. Did they pass it on to FBI, CIA or DOD? Who made the decisions to ignore the warnings? What changes in policy or personnel are needed to prevent a recurrence?

As for what Bush DID ignore, he ignored Clinton's warnings about Al Qaeda specifically, and the NIE in which EVERY ONE of our intelligence agencies warned about Al Qaeda, bin Laden and terrorist attacks on domestic soil, SPECIFICALLY. He replied, "OK, you've covered your asses." So yes, I want to see an investigation of exactly what went wrong and how to prevent it. I don't care whose heads roll, including Obama's (though I doubt he'd ever be so callously dismissive). You want to protect Bush. I want to protect America.

Nope, your original post called out the Bush administration directly for Hasan personally, not the generalities you now fall back on.

Either both administrations missed him, or neither did. I say the latter. I say the Army screwed the pooch on this one, at their mid-level officer review level.

AR, everyone in the DOD during the Bush Administration was a part of that administration. I did not assert that Bush himself knew. My point is that an investigation of officials in the intelligence agencies, EVEN IF it ONLY focused on current staff, will get into areas uncomfortable for you, because most of those positions are still held by Bush hires or career personnel. If you start investigating someone, you sure as hell can't say, "but don't look back more than 10 months for a pattern." BTW, you're probably right that concerns about Hasan never even got out of the Army mid-level hierarchy. So I'd say THAT needs correcting. But we'll see, as Obama has ordered records of not only the army, but CIA and FBI turned over to Congress.

I'm afraid it is the Social Liberal's fault that this was allowed to continue even though people could clearly see that the man was unstable.

PC has gone to far.

Slap whatever label you want on it (I happen to think it was 21st century garden variety ineptitude) in the end it was unforgivably negligent.

Yes, FT, the social liberals who run the Army and all those social liberals in the Bush administration. They're to blame. Look, Hasan asked repeatedly during the Bush administration to be allowed to quit the Army. How in the world can you assert that social liberals DENIED his request because he was Muslim? HUH?

Oh my.... Now even THIS is Bush's fault!

Give me a break!

This is Nidal Hasan's fault. It is also the extremist/jihadists at the mosque who teach this form of warfare. No different than if the members of the Westboro Baptist Church (the God hate's 'fags' folks) put violence behind their ideals of hatred. That is not freedom of worship - it is inciting treason. The mosque responsible for teaching treasonous acts should be closed.

And Green....
I've been in the military for 22 years. I know how it works.

If the "middle management" had let this get up the chain to the Pentagon, it would apear that their equal-oppornunity scores would suffer, and also appear that they weren't being accomodating to another religion.

This is all about political correctness. For most other threats, the Army assess then removes the threat. With this clown, they had to walk on eggshells as not to offend the ACLU or the Muslim community.

He wanted out of the Army AFTER the Army paid for his undergrad degree AND his medical degree.
How convenient.
Many people try that AFTER they get what the Army promised, but have no intention of holding up their end of the bargain. It's called renegging on a deal. That's another reason behind his being "forced" to stay.

Normally I would be on your side of this issue. I've always believed that conservative’s "PC" complaints were irrationally beaten to death. Unfortunately government policy, protocol, and, regulation regarding PC was made before G.Dubya’s laughable presidency. It was indeed the social liberals that pushed for PC, advocated PC and chastised people for not practicing PC. I was generally in agreement, but I can clearly see the other side of the coin in this circumstance. Please do not take this that I’m blaming the deaths on social liberals, good grief no. It would be unfair to expect them to see this coming. I do see evidence in these media reports that the man was behaving over the top irrational and that PC played a major roll in why he wasn’t forced into a more closer, accountable examination by his superiors.

The military gave the man a free medical degree. He had obligating time to serve remaining I suspect. As well, I’m sure he was fully capable of understanding, on the day he accepted the military’s contractual obligations, that his religion would have to separated from his duties at some point.

Also, in light of this man’s extreme actions, in or out of the military I’m sure he was quite probably on an unavoidable, a head-on collision with some extreme act anyway.

Jefferson, this doesn't make sense. Yes, you could say that being PC is a reason for the Army to APPROVE Hasan's request. You cannot say it was denied repeatedly in order not to offend the ACLU or Muslim community. Everything said in the latter comments here MIGHT make sense if the Army tried to kick him out or prosecute or persecute him for being a Muslim. But NO, and please pay attention to this. HE WANTED OUT! There is no way to claim that REFUSING his request was done to placate Muslims, liberals, ACLU or ANYONE ELSE. Indeed maybe the Army could be criticized for APPROVING his request on some PC basis, while refusing non-Muslim requests for the same thing. Since they did not approve, this line of argument is nonsense.

We can't know what might have happened had he been allowed to leave the Army. But we do know that he would not have had access to Ft. Hood and that THIS particular act would have been avoided.

BTW everyone, calm down. I'm not blaming this on Bush. I'm responding to those, and they are all over the internet and Fox noise and this site, who claim that Obama's Muslim-lovin ways are the reason he was still in the Army. That's bullshit. I mean, really, folks, think about this. Obama had the Army refuse a Muslim's request because he loves Muslims??????

No, he could have still gotten on a base as a visitor. Probably would have been Walter Reed. Especially if he had separated there. He certainly would have known people on that base/Hospital. I think its an error to think that had the military released him, he would have simply lived out his radical Islam life without having some other violent episode. He reached the rank of major. To do that he would have had to have signed another period of service contract. No military contract gives the choice of whom you will agree, or, not agree to go to war against. I am absolutely certain he knew this from the beginning.

Green...
I didn't say that the Army denied him discharge because of PC.... That's why they didn't act upon the "warning signs". The reason he was denied discharge was because he owed tens of thousands of dollars for his Education that the Army paid for.