And I attended the Tea Parties. If this fixes the problem, I don't care how the companies see it.

Neither. (And this is when I start to sound like a democrat)
I support placing a cap on the profit margin of insurance and pharmaceutical companies as part of comprehensive healthcare reform package. I also support limiting bonuses within these companies, and mandate a portion of the un-capped profit to go to the truly needy among us.

As far as unionization, I'm for organized labor and belong to one of the biggest ones in the nation (not SEIU). I just believe that unions do not belong in certain industries – healthcare is among them. Have the government regulate pay in this industry and provide some sort of greivance procedure without the union. Healthcare workers can not and should not be allowed to strike – it's unethical – and without striking power a union isn't really anything but a scam.

And for the last one. Outlaw multiple billing. One bill comes to the patient. Make it law.

Defensive medicine is a cultural problem, and I'm not imagining reforming the tort system makes it go away by itself, or quickly. But we need a system that does a better job of the costs and benefits of treatment X, including the pressures you cite–patients want them, etc. Tort reform is an important piece of the puzzle, but it's only one.

As for competition, well free market is what we've had all along.

Hogwash. The government completely dominates the market. It already pays for half of Americans' care directly and heavily distorts the market for the other half. What exactly are you imagining the market is “free” of?

As for competition, well free market is what we've had all along. It would appear not to work the way you think it should.

As for paying nurses less, yes. The median staff RN hereabouts makes $103K (per salary.com) in total compensation, and nationally they average nearly $90K. Many of them doubtless are driving away in a Lexus.

How to put pressure on their earnings? Or pharma profits? Or executive bonuses? The only way that ever really works: competition.

I'm not sure how you intend to restrict pharma profits or insurance. Government price fixing? Windfall profit tax? The latter won't work either because the poor insurance industry “only” makes 4% profit. But that's after all expenses, including lobbying, all those obnoxious ads and massive executive salaries and perks. If their profit is taxed more, they just “lower” their profit by taking more off the bottom line. I'm sure the CEO and officers will be glad to oblige.

Unionization? You mean pay the nurses, orderlies, cooks and housekeeping staff LESS? You must think they're living large. But you know better. You see a lot of those people driving away in a Lexus?

As for your last item, that's a tough one. You may be surprised to learn that it is ALSO part of the insurance industry problem. The surgeon doesn't bill the patient for anaesthesia so his insurance is not responsible for mistakes by the anaesthesiologist. Same with all the other bits. Everyone bills separately so no one is seen as a “subcontractor”.

Good to see eye to eye on that. But you have to admit that massive restriction on all of those entities would have cost about 3/4 trillion dollars less, right?

Is that really true about the .5% of healthcare costs being from malpractice settlements? I can possibly agree that the actual amount given out is .5%, but that may not reflect the actual amount the insurance companies pass on to their customers because of it.

Regardless, the crap that goes down with fraud and lawsuit abuse is wrong, and should be regulated. Lawyers and Insurance companies are rolling in the dough through other people's misfortunes. I'm not stupid enough to say that businesses should not make lots of money – I'm glad they do. But healthcare is not a commodity and human health should not be thrown into the purely unfettered capitalism ring. I don't give a hoot if someone cannot make money providing healthcare.

That still leaves Pharmaceutical greed, Insurance Greed, Doctor/Healthcare worker issues, and billing dishonesty. I'm convinced, through my research, that those items are at the core of the 1000% cost increase since the 70's. Neither party in Congress has even begun to address those. That's what is so darned frustrating.

As for single payer…. I'd rather have that than the mess they are throwing us in this Baucus/Pelosi mess. It doesn't address the core problems. Either go ahead with single payer, or scrap the poor excuse that is being presented now and atttempt REAL reform.

As for what the Dems are doing, again I point to the Taiwan government. They studied every major health care system and concluded that single payer with 100% enrollment was the way to deliver health care to their citizens for the lowest cost. There is no other way to deal with insurance co and drug co greed, and the GOP has PROTECTED their profits by forcing Medicare to NOT negotiate. JD, would you invest in a company that directed its staff NOT to negotiate because it would be unfair to vendors? What a colossal disconnect with business reality.

McCarran-Ferguson, which gave the AMA way too much power and created the near monopolies that health insurance companies have in every state. It's purpose was to increase doctors salaries, that is, to drive up medical costs. I think it worked!
ERISA pre-emption, which has been misconstrued to prevent all lawsuits against health insurance companies and employers who have ERISA plans.
Laws against buying medicines from other countries.
Laws that prevent people from forming arbitrary groups for the purpose of purchasing health care and health insurance.
And of course I couldn't leave out the tax “subsidy” for getting insurance through your employer, the one that you have mentioned on several occasions.

And I've seen the charts. When Dems/Dems hold both branches the trend has historically been downward in terms of debt. But only when Repubs hold Congress and Dems hold the Whitehouse, has the trend REVERSE from upward to downward. We are currently in the biggest upward debt swing since WWII.

And I do NOT have government healthcare. I have to pay a monthly fee just like you do for my family. It's approximately the same as Blue Cross elsewhere for family coverage. I am covered, but they are not since they do not live at least 50 miles from a military treatment center (base).

Why the nasty little jab, bro?

And I KNOW all about health plans since I was born. My father had an awesome plan at his job. There was only ONE bill that showed up. His insurance paid 80%, no questions asked. Prescription medicine was cheap, and most doctors cared about CURING you, not just TREATING you. Doctors did not have to worry about being sued for practicing their craft, unless they purposely or neglegibly did something fatal.

Why is healthcare so expensive now?
1. LAWYERS and million/billion dollars lawsuits.
2. Insurance company greed.
3. Pharmaceutical greed.
4. Unionization of healthcare workers.
5. Breakup of payments – doctor bill, x-ray bill, aspirin bill, hospital bill, sheet cleaning bill, etc.

And you know what? Instead of tackling the above problems, the democrats just want to scrap the whole thing and put in place a massively expensive public healthcare plan. All they had to do is address the problems that made it get so expensive in the first place. The republicans have failed to do that as well.
Now all we have to look forward to is a health plan with questionable performance and efficiency (or availability) and high taxes. YAY! I already pay 50% of my pay in taxes of some sort. I've had enough.

BTW, the debt is now >$12 trillion. Our disagreement, the major one, on health care, is that you think the private insurance mess we have now will ultimately cost less (for what reason I cannot fathom). I believe the only way out of our health care cost crisis is to learn from the successful models, as Taiwan did when revamping their system. That means single payer nonprofit medicine. It costs LESS, not more. But you'll see. You're young enough to see private insurance double in 10 years (last doubling was 9 yrs) so it's FOUR times what it was when Bush entered office. Then 10 years later, it will double again, to EIGHT times what it was.

Oh yeah, you already have government health care. Never mind. That's OUR problem, not yours.

That's not necessarily true, Green. The President makes the budget and it is approved by Congress. If the GOP truely opposed Clinton's policies, then the budget would not have passed. I'm just giving credit to both parties here – where it belongs. Clinton was an excellent executive. But, in the GOP's defense, if Clinton would have had his way with Universal Healthcare, do you think he would have kept the surplus he had at the end of his term? Not likely.
Actually, that would have been the BEST time to do something like healthcare reform. But the GOP screwed up and didn't acknowlege it as a problem, and chose the status quo.
Right now, however, when the economy sucks and the debt is already up around 7-9 TRILLION, it is the absolute worst time to do healthcare. I only want Congress to get the deficit down and keep the “popluar programs” that we absolutely cannot do without – doing away with all of the “fluff”.

As far as the difference in parties go. I do not agree.
The GOP benefits from one set of corporate sponsors, and the DEMs benefit from another set of corporate sponsors. Neither give a darn about people.

when it actually meant fiscal responsibility, states rights, individual rights, smaller and less intrusive government. That is not the case any more. At all.

You will get no argument from me on that point.

And as I've pointed out in posts long gone, there aren't any real “credible” economists. They're mostly philosophers, with very little science backing them up, which is why they're close to useless in predicting economic change.

I would think that cutting corporate welfare payments, breaking up the banks, and cutting off the bailout money would help tremendously once the slackers got out of bankruptcy court. They bubbles that are being (re)created right now are rather scary for those who are watching.

As for “big lie,” these numbers are from the white house. You can download the spreadsheets they are based on, and believe me, every detail is backed up. The “big lie” is that Republicans are businesslike and fiscally responsible. They aren't