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	<title>Comments on: Equal Moral Rights For All?</title>
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		<title>By: JeffersonDavis</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/47141/equal-moral-rights-for-all/comment-page-1/#comment-217350</link>
		<dc:creator>JeffersonDavis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 25 Sep 2009 12:54:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/47141/equal-moral-rights-for-all/#comment-217350</guid>
		<description>The common morality of the country is what I was talking about, as you agreed.&lt;br&gt;Once upon a time, both democrat and republican adhered to the same set of moral truths - they just disagreed on how to govern.  Would you agree with that?&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;If so, then consider this concerning homosexuality and morality:&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Once the common morality was compromised (60&#039;s, free love, etc), it started a trend of downward spiral in the common morality in the nation.  Sex was no longer an act that was private in your own bedroom. Divorce skyrocketed.  Sexually transmitted diseases skyrocketed, teen pregnancy skyrocketed, etc.   It degenerates further as liberals force the acceptance of homosexuality as a normal state of being.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;I do not hate homosexuals as some ultra right wingers do.  They remain my brother and sisters.  But I believe their lifestyle choice is a small part of the big picture, and it is taking our nation and culture down the wrong path morally.  It is one of the reasons our nation is so divided today.  Some of us still attempt to hold the &quot;old&quot; common morality as a good thing.  I&#039;m a conservative democrat, but the &quot;new&quot; morality democrats in DC do not represent me.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Go figure.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The common morality of the country is what I was talking about, as you agreed.<br />Once upon a time, both democrat and republican adhered to the same set of moral truths &#8211; they just disagreed on how to govern.  Would you agree with that?</p>
<p>If so, then consider this concerning homosexuality and morality:</p>
<p>Once the common morality was compromised (60&#39;s, free love, etc), it started a trend of downward spiral in the common morality in the nation.  Sex was no longer an act that was private in your own bedroom. Divorce skyrocketed.  Sexually transmitted diseases skyrocketed, teen pregnancy skyrocketed, etc.   It degenerates further as liberals force the acceptance of homosexuality as a normal state of being.</p>
<p>I do not hate homosexuals as some ultra right wingers do.  They remain my brother and sisters.  But I believe their lifestyle choice is a small part of the big picture, and it is taking our nation and culture down the wrong path morally.  It is one of the reasons our nation is so divided today.  Some of us still attempt to hold the &#8220;old&#8221; common morality as a good thing.  I&#39;m a conservative democrat, but the &#8220;new&#8221; morality democrats in DC do not represent me.</p>
<p>Go figure.</p>
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		<title>By: tidbits</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/47141/equal-moral-rights-for-all/comment-page-1/#comment-216666</link>
		<dc:creator>tidbits</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 23 Sep 2009 16:24:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/47141/equal-moral-rights-for-all/#comment-216666</guid>
		<description>JD -&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;You said &quot;It&#039;s dangerous to pin the word &#039;moral&#039; to anything the government touches...It should be avoided until everyone is on the same page as to what &#039;morality&#039;is.&quot;  I agree, and you you got a &quot;Like&quot; from me as a result.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;My question is: how do you square that philosophy with your agrument yesterday that, based on religious/moral grounds, gay marriage should be outlawed (legislated morality), an issue where everyone is clearly not on the same page?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>JD -</p>
<p>You said &#8220;It&#39;s dangerous to pin the word &#39;moral&#39; to anything the government touches&#8230;It should be avoided until everyone is on the same page as to what &#39;morality&#39;is.&#8221;  I agree, and you you got a &#8220;Like&#8221; from me as a result.</p>
<p>My question is: how do you square that philosophy with your agrument yesterday that, based on religious/moral grounds, gay marriage should be outlawed (legislated morality), an issue where everyone is clearly not on the same page?</p>
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		<title>By: Leonidas</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/47141/equal-moral-rights-for-all/comment-page-1/#comment-216588</link>
		<dc:creator>Leonidas</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 23 Sep 2009 03:32:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/47141/equal-moral-rights-for-all/#comment-216588</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt; I agree with Michael that it&#039;s ridiculous to try to shove your personal morality down someone else&#039;s throat. It&#039;s really the nanny state gone wild. What right does a counter clerk have to tell me I can&#039;t buy a lottery ticket because he doesn&#039;t approve of gambling? I&#039;m not a baby; I can run my own life, thank you very much&lt;/blockquote&gt;&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Ummm....Haven&#039;t you been lobbying for public healthcare?&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Actually the counter clerk has every right not to sell it to you, and you have every right to tell that to his manager or the store owner and get them fired.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p> I agree with Michael that it&#39;s ridiculous to try to shove your personal morality down someone else&#39;s throat. It&#39;s really the nanny state gone wild. What right does a counter clerk have to tell me I can&#39;t buy a lottery ticket because he doesn&#39;t approve of gambling? I&#39;m not a baby; I can run my own life, thank you very much</p></blockquote>
<p>Ummm&#8230;.Haven&#39;t you been lobbying for public healthcare?</p>
<p>Actually the counter clerk has every right not to sell it to you, and you have every right to tell that to his manager or the store owner and get them fired.</p>
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		<title>By: Gegenschattenbild</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/47141/equal-moral-rights-for-all/comment-page-1/#comment-216576</link>
		<dc:creator>Gegenschattenbild</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 23 Sep 2009 02:42:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/47141/equal-moral-rights-for-all/#comment-216576</guid>
		<description>I have no idea what world some of you folks live in. Well, I guess it&#039;s obvious that some of you live in cities where you can get almost anything they need, and others live in suburbs or small towns. But let me assure you, there are counties in my state where there is neither a doctor nor a pharmacy. The folks in these impoverished counties have to travel to even visit a county health department. In situations like this, I see it as intolerable that a pharmacist would be unwilling to sell legal items that s/he has some &quot;issue&quot; with, or that a doctor would deny some treatment that his morality doesn&#039;t agree with. &lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Plus, most &quot;pharmacists&quot; these days (those that I encounter, anyway) are basically pill dispensers!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have no idea what world some of you folks live in. Well, I guess it&#39;s obvious that some of you live in cities where you can get almost anything they need, and others live in suburbs or small towns. But let me assure you, there are counties in my state where there is neither a doctor nor a pharmacy. The folks in these impoverished counties have to travel to even visit a county health department. In situations like this, I see it as intolerable that a pharmacist would be unwilling to sell legal items that s/he has some &#8220;issue&#8221; with, or that a doctor would deny some treatment that his morality doesn&#39;t agree with. </p>
<p>Plus, most &#8220;pharmacists&#8221; these days (those that I encounter, anyway) are basically pill dispensers!</p>
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		<title>By: JeffersonDavis</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/47141/equal-moral-rights-for-all/comment-page-1/#comment-216572</link>
		<dc:creator>JeffersonDavis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 23 Sep 2009 02:29:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/47141/equal-moral-rights-for-all/#comment-216572</guid>
		<description>It&#039;s dangerous to pin the word &quot;moral&quot; to anything that the government touches, much less businesses.  It should be avoided until everyone is on the same page as to what &quot;morality&quot; is.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;You cannot have a successful civilization or society when everyone has a different morality.&lt;br&gt;It just doesn&#039;t work.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;As far as article goes, it is correct that doctors and pharmacists should not get into that game if they don&#039;t want to play.  However, when a pharmacist sees plainly that a doctor that is bought and paid for by a pharmaceutical company has prescribed a frivolous drug that doesn&#039;t cure or treat the illness, I wouldn&#039;t expect him to &quot;play along&quot;, and he/she should say no.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#39;s dangerous to pin the word &#8220;moral&#8221; to anything that the government touches, much less businesses.  It should be avoided until everyone is on the same page as to what &#8220;morality&#8221; is.</p>
<p>You cannot have a successful civilization or society when everyone has a different morality.<br />It just doesn&#39;t work.</p>
<p>As far as article goes, it is correct that doctors and pharmacists should not get into that game if they don&#39;t want to play.  However, when a pharmacist sees plainly that a doctor that is bought and paid for by a pharmaceutical company has prescribed a frivolous drug that doesn&#39;t cure or treat the illness, I wouldn&#39;t expect him to &#8220;play along&#8221;, and he/she should say no.</p>
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		<title>By: jeff_pickens</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/47141/equal-moral-rights-for-all/comment-page-1/#comment-216562</link>
		<dc:creator>jeff_pickens</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 23 Sep 2009 01:49:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/47141/equal-moral-rights-for-all/#comment-216562</guid>
		<description>Michael, good points, all.  Morality can&#039;t and shouldn&#039;t necessarily be legislated.  This kind of &quot;moral rights&quot; terminology really can morph into all kinds of mischief.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Michael, good points, all.  Morality can&#39;t and shouldn&#39;t necessarily be legislated.  This kind of &#8220;moral rights&#8221; terminology really can morph into all kinds of mischief.</p>
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		<title>By: kathykattenburg</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/47141/equal-moral-rights-for-all/comment-page-1/#comment-216556</link>
		<dc:creator>kathykattenburg</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 23 Sep 2009 01:07:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/47141/equal-moral-rights-for-all/#comment-216556</guid>
		<description>I agree with Michael that it&#039;s ridiculous to try to shove your personal morality down someone else&#039;s throat. It&#039;s really the nanny state gone wild. What right does a counter clerk have to tell me I can&#039;t buy a lottery ticket because he doesn&#039;t approve of gambling? I&#039;m not a baby; I can run my own life, thank you very much.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree with Michael that it&#39;s ridiculous to try to shove your personal morality down someone else&#39;s throat. It&#39;s really the nanny state gone wild. What right does a counter clerk have to tell me I can&#39;t buy a lottery ticket because he doesn&#39;t approve of gambling? I&#39;m not a baby; I can run my own life, thank you very much.</p>
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		<title>By: roro80</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/47141/equal-moral-rights-for-all/comment-page-1/#comment-216552</link>
		<dc:creator>roro80</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 23 Sep 2009 00:36:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/47141/equal-moral-rights-for-all/#comment-216552</guid>
		<description>I agree with the original post on every case brought up.  It also reminds me of the lesbian couple in the San Diego area that were denied access to invetro treatments due the doctor&#039;s religious view that gay people shouldn&#039;t raise children.  In this case, if I remember correctly, the next closest doctor who provided these treatments within the couple&#039;s insurance network was much further away.  &lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;This brings up another point, of course. Most towns, even most small ones, have more than one pharmacy; those that don&#039;t are generally the ones that serve communities that would be least able to just drive on down to the next town.  There are also many types of specialist doctors that are few and far between.  What &quot;moral&quot; reasons are they allowed to use for refusal of treatment? Do those reasons have to be connected to the treatment? Also: what if your insurance is such that only one doctor in the area takes it?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree with the original post on every case brought up.  It also reminds me of the lesbian couple in the San Diego area that were denied access to invetro treatments due the doctor&#39;s religious view that gay people shouldn&#39;t raise children.  In this case, if I remember correctly, the next closest doctor who provided these treatments within the couple&#39;s insurance network was much further away.  </p>
<p>This brings up another point, of course. Most towns, even most small ones, have more than one pharmacy; those that don&#39;t are generally the ones that serve communities that would be least able to just drive on down to the next town.  There are also many types of specialist doctors that are few and far between.  What &#8220;moral&#8221; reasons are they allowed to use for refusal of treatment? Do those reasons have to be connected to the treatment? Also: what if your insurance is such that only one doctor in the area takes it?</p>
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		<title>By: T-Steel</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/47141/equal-moral-rights-for-all/comment-page-1/#comment-216544</link>
		<dc:creator>T-Steel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 23 Sep 2009 00:13:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/47141/equal-moral-rights-for-all/#comment-216544</guid>
		<description>That becomes a problem if that&#039;s the only pharmacy in town.  But with the Internet and &lt;a href=&quot;http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Borg_(Star_Trek)&quot;The Borg, I mean Wal-Mart everywhere, it shouldn&#039;t be a problem to go somewhere else where someone WILL.  In my experience, there&#039;s always someone that WILL.  Even among doctors.  You just got to weigh the pros and cons.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>That becomes a problem if that&#39;s the only pharmacy in town.  But with the Internet and &lt;a href=&#8221;http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Borg_(Star_Trek)&#8221;The Borg, I mean Wal-Mart everywhere, it shouldn&#39;t be a problem to go somewhere else where someone WILL.  In my experience, there&#39;s always someone that WILL.  Even among doctors.  You just got to weigh the pros and cons.</p>
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		<title>By: DLS</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/47141/equal-moral-rights-for-all/comment-page-1/#comment-216540</link>
		<dc:creator>DLS</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Sep 2009 23:50:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/47141/equal-moral-rights-for-all/#comment-216540</guid>
		<description>&quot;Silverstein could simply have walked to the pharmacy across the street&quot;&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Years ago, for the subject is years, decades old.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Silverstein could simply have walked to the pharmacy across the street&#8221;</p>
<p>Years ago, for the subject is years, decades old.</p>
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		<title>By: mikkel</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/47141/equal-moral-rights-for-all/comment-page-1/#comment-216539</link>
		<dc:creator>mikkel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Sep 2009 23:28:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/47141/equal-moral-rights-for-all/#comment-216539</guid>
		<description>The majority of proposed (and enacted) laws don&#039;t force someone to do anything, merely shield them from being fired if they refuse.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The majority of proposed (and enacted) laws don&#39;t force someone to do anything, merely shield them from being fired if they refuse.</p>
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		<title>By: TheMagicalSkyFather</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/47141/equal-moral-rights-for-all/comment-page-1/#comment-216533</link>
		<dc:creator>TheMagicalSkyFather</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Sep 2009 23:27:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/47141/equal-moral-rights-for-all/#comment-216533</guid>
		<description>Its kinda funny, in Europe they are making special exception laws for the muslim fundies and we here in the US look with horror as we mock them all while making special exception laws for our very own fundies and acting like they are two different animals.  Ladies and gents, fundies are fundies and they are all batsh*t, if you can deny me birth control I should also be able to deny giving you meat if I ama vegan or a whole host of other things.  No law is needed, if they want to refuse for moral reasons then their employer needs to figure out whether or not they wish to fire them because they cant serve their job function, its just that simple.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Its kinda funny, in Europe they are making special exception laws for the muslim fundies and we here in the US look with horror as we mock them all while making special exception laws for our very own fundies and acting like they are two different animals.  Ladies and gents, fundies are fundies and they are all batsh*t, if you can deny me birth control I should also be able to deny giving you meat if I ama vegan or a whole host of other things.  No law is needed, if they want to refuse for moral reasons then their employer needs to figure out whether or not they wish to fire them because they cant serve their job function, its just that simple.</p>
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		<title>By: casualobserver</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/47141/equal-moral-rights-for-all/comment-page-1/#comment-216508</link>
		<dc:creator>casualobserver</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Sep 2009 22:01:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/47141/equal-moral-rights-for-all/#comment-216508</guid>
		<description>Not to mention the fact Silverstein could simply have walked to the pharmacy across the street and saved the bandwidth.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Not to mention the fact Silverstein could simply have walked to the pharmacy across the street and saved the bandwidth.</p>
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		<title>By: Leonidas</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/47141/equal-moral-rights-for-all/comment-page-1/#comment-216487</link>
		<dc:creator>Leonidas</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Sep 2009 21:32:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/47141/equal-moral-rights-for-all/#comment-216487</guid>
		<description>It all depends, if your an employee you have the right to refuse to sell someone a product but your boss has the right to fire you.  If your an owner you have the right to conduct business anyway you see fit and only have to anwer to the customer, assuming no laws are broken.  People are not slaves, you cannot require them to provide services they are not obligated by law to provide.  If we start requiring people to do so, we have in effect made those people slaves.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It all depends, if your an employee you have the right to refuse to sell someone a product but your boss has the right to fire you.  If your an owner you have the right to conduct business anyway you see fit and only have to anwer to the customer, assuming no laws are broken.  People are not slaves, you cannot require them to provide services they are not obligated by law to provide.  If we start requiring people to do so, we have in effect made those people slaves.</p>
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		<title>By: You have the right to be moral &#171; Dating Jesus</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/47141/equal-moral-rights-for-all/comment-page-1/#comment-216512</link>
		<dc:creator>You have the right to be moral &#171; Dating Jesus</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Sep 2009 21:10:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/47141/equal-moral-rights-for-all/#comment-216512</guid>
		<description>[...] Michael Silverstein at The Moderate Voice asks: If you&#8217;re going to be a doctor, then shouldn&#8217;t you be prepared to provide all the services expected of a doctor? Along those same lines: If you&#8217;re a pacifist, why join the military? [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Michael Silverstein at The Moderate Voice asks: If you&#8217;re going to be a doctor, then shouldn&#8217;t you be prepared to provide all the services expected of a doctor? Along those same lines: If you&#8217;re a pacifist, why join the military? [...]</p>
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