Rather than a veil, it (crowding out the private sector; getting everyone used to paying “charges”) has effectively been transparent and accompanied by blazing neon signs or beacons and alarms or horns.

[shrug] The most susceptible will continue to believe it is all innocuous, instead.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G4TsaHmtgfA

Watch other at http://www.sickforprofit.com

Just a different viewpoint. You be the judge

Take out tithing to churches and rerun those numbers. I think you'll be suprised

Why? You realize all the services for the poor that churches run? Just look at catholic hospitals and clinics for starters.

No whats surprising is the audacity of liberals to to claim conservatives don't care about the poor while they themselves are tightwads and only want to spend the money of others. Of course individuals liberals may be quite generous but on average they make scrouge look like Carnegie. 1.2% indeed. *scoff*

Stop your whining and dig deeper in your own pocket if you want to be taken seriously and not as hypocrites.

[chuckle] AmFlight (health care) Heavy, the jumbo jet the Dems can't design yet to get it to fly…

Yes, you correctly, if unwittingly annunciated your posting…

“a vital part of our infrastructure”

Public ownership and operation of clinics and hospitals would make you correct. Extending federal control and provision to health care itself obviously is not “infrastructure” [sic], just as the extremists who call in to NPR talk shows and nitwit extremist left AM shows are wrong when they refer to banks (or Julienne Malveaux merely to ATMs) as “public utilities” [sic]. It's a myth that everything is or should be public, “infrastructure” [sic], or “utilities” [sic], etc..

“need propping by a Central Unit”

Risible — government is so often the worst case of Too Big to Succeed. Decentralization is superior.

Take out tithing to churches and rerun those numbers. I think you'll be suprised

Public health care, fire care, police care are all parts of our INFRASTRUCTURE that need propping by a Central Unit that is fiscally solvent during good times and bad. The GOP asking us to forego the public option is like them asking us to deregulate the police departments! Yes, the crumbling of our tax base due to health bankruptcies has risen to that level of alarm…We're talking a NATIONAL SECURITY ISSUE here folks…

Reduction to absurdity (actually, not, but impracticality, in fact) doesn't require being fancy; “just end Medicare and Medicaid and all other government health programs, and cost savings for government will be at their greatest, immediately” is all one has to say.

But of course, the real problem is excess and misconduct and other problems related to doing too much of the wrong things, not “not enough” [sic].

When we face an impending debt trap, or some time before that, is when there will be a temptation to monetize it by inflation, or default effectively on the debt (including playing games with inflation indexed bonds). Aside from that, the temptation by Santa Claus Demmies is likely already present, and waiting until it's a more propitious time, for them to supply the real opiate of the masses, a deliberate policy of inflation. (They will revive the “just enough to be a lubricant” rhetoric to accompany lib-Dem “ignore the deficit and debt myths and fake scares” mantras, and will claim their excess inflation levels are “within reason,” even if they resort to price controls and other devices as well to curb the worst consequences.)

Oh, yes. I remarked as well that it's, ahem, ironic (hypocritical) given so many wanting things like this want lavish, comprehensive, all-preventive-care-included minimum health care “packages” for everyone at the same time. They say people “overuse” the expensive plans, but insist on generous packages at the same time. (I guess they are once more exploiting those who cannot manage to notice such obvious things. [sigh])

“What I see coming down the pike is Part 'D' Heavy.”

Naturally! While Obama and others lied about the need and the intent to reform entitlements, including Medicare, eliminating the “doughnut hole” at the very least will be part of some future “reform” measure (which will be accompanied by hosannahs and worshipful gestures of various kinds by the exploitable).

Right now, we are at about ~80% of GDP to Public Debt (including Social Security obligations). That's about where we were when Reagan left office. No one knows how high it can go without crashing, but the UK hit over 250% during WWII and suffered badly for many years afterward.

Or what they must drive, or what they must eat, or what they must think…

But that's only the part of the iceberg that's visible, above the water.

For after all, we're writing about more controls on how people will be _allowed_ to spend money.

As if it's the government's, and we should be viewed as children given an allowance by parental government, the way so many people creepily view government and how we “should” relate to it.

That's if you can still keep it at all — that you aren't dropped from the plan or that it is out of business.

The same is obviously true with keeping your current doctor, of course.

But things like this are neglected as we see many people stooping to ever lower lows out of desperation, frustration, rage at seeing the health care silliness get interrupted. (No wonder we still are seeing a sign of pathology that I suspected we'd see, new threads even today, here and now, about Joe Wilson, etc.)

Meanwhile, a voice of reason in the Detroit metro media notes that paying for the new health care plan is going to involve — surprise — taxes — obviously. [sigh]

“He did offer one useful insight. Sachs said there's no way Obama can pay for his health care plan by cutting waste from the system. Won't happen, he said. The only way to fund universal health care is with a tax hike, he said.

Sachs chided Obama for promising not to raise middle-class taxes, saying that has to happen if America is going to combat global warming and provide everyone with a health care card.”

http://apps.detnews.com/apps/blogs/nolanfinleyb…

Talk about rose-colored-glasses.

I'm sure taking our health care system back to leeches and bleedings would be a sure cost saver! Talk about a job creator, with the increase mortality rates you'd need to replace workers more often

What you and your ilk are proposing is like a death sentence to this country..and ultimately to yourselves. Since your greed has blinded you to the point of insanity, The People are stepping in to lend you a hand. There, there's my alms for the poor right there…

lol..

You die first.