Totally agree.

I have lived in Europe (including England) for over ten years and have had nothing but good experiences with the various “national” health systems.

Thank you for pointing it out.

Dorian

The NHS is not a “single-payer disaster”.

Brits over 65 who go to Florida are more attracted by the year round sun than anything else – think about the UK's reputation for dull, rainy weather. Healthcare is not an issue in their decision.

Sure, we in the UK moan about the NHS. It isn't perfect. But it does deliver care to those who need it, when they need it, with only nominal cost at point of treatment.

For example, my mother in law had a heart attack recently. She was collected by ambulance and taken to hospital for emergency treatment inside 20 minutes. She received intensive care treatment and, thankfully, has now returned home to complete her recovery with regular checkups from her doctor. Her medication is free because she is a pensioner on low income. There was no charge for all the hospital care she received.

So, the NHS does work. But, as I say, not perfectly.

For example, my father in law spent a whole day last week sitting waiting for an operation to enable him to have kidney dialysis. In the end it was cancelled. He had to go back again this Tuesday when the procedure was carried out. Cost of the operation to him – free except for the hassle of turning up and wasting a day in a waiting room.

I realise this is merely anecdotal evidence. And I know that there is so much more the NHS could do if it had more money/was saddled with less-bureaucracy etc. But it seems to work for both emergencies like that of my mother in law, and chronic situations, like that of my father in law. So it can't be that bad.

There are multiple bills being considered, not just one, so it's hard to know which one to respond to. But here are some relevant facts:

health costs are rising and will continue to rise if we do nothing

we, as a society, have decided that we are not going to force poor people requireing emergency care to die in the streets. Therefore, people who can't afford insurance and can't afford $150 per doctor visit wait until they get really sick and must go to the ER. As a result, the cost for people with insurance goes up.
Not to mention that preventative care might have kept some of these people in the ER from suffering as much as they did because they wouldn't have gotten that sick.

Some people with insurance have died because care or tests they should have gotten was denied by the insurance company.

Some people, even though they have the money to pay the premiums, cannot get insurance because of pre-existing conditions.

There is no longer any such thing as job stability. People change jobs frequently. They also tend to move about the country, often crossing state lines to do so. Either of these actions – changing jobs or moving out of state – can cause a person to have to change insurance plans. Where is the choice in that? Why can't we choose to stay with the same plan for as long as we want?

The US has a lower life expectancy, higher infant morality and is listed lower on lists rating quality of healthcare compared to a lot of other countries that DO have universal healthcare. It's not a far leap to suppose that the reason could be all the Americans who are avoiding the doctor because they can't pay.

In spite of all these problems, the insurance companies have failed to reform themselves.

I can understand people disagreeing over which changes we need to make, but I don't see how the status quo is justifyable. When people are dying and others are relying exclusively on ER treatment instead of preventative care it's time to say we need to fix it cause it IS broke!

I am a dissenter…meaning: do not agree with current health care reform. The “clown” I spoke of was ironically not Obama, but “Daveinboca” who some in this chat referred to as a clown (even though he actually listed good points). Some on this forum who would so willingly go along with the current proposition, haven't been able to give any valid reasons for supporting it except to just agree for the sake of agreeing. I'll still wait for anyone who agrees with this bill to speak up with some solid facts they stand behind.

The Democrats' health plan will pull the plug on grandma

It will provide health insurance to illegal immigrants

It willf use taxpayers' dollars to provide free abortion for women

Oh, I dunno. I think every forum needs a clown we can all laugh at.

Those who believe that the only poll that mattered was the last general election may find that the next general election poll, and the next one, will matter a great deal.

The Democrats claim they will not take over healthcare but then every progressive blogger talks about how a tax subsidized public option will put all of the insurance companies out of business and live the U.S. with a single payer system.

The Democrats talk about eliminating waste and cost control but then cliam that the government controlled insurance comapneis will ever deny claims. Both cannot happen.

Listening to the the Democrats is like listening to an individual with multiple personalities. If you listen long enough they will contradict themselves.