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Some thoughts on the depths of idiocy
This excerpt from The Daily Show titled “The Born Identity” illustrates exactly how idiotic the “birther movement” is:
| The Daily Show With Jon Stewart | Mon – Thurs 11p / 10c | |||
| The Born Identity | ||||
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Is it “post-partisan” to say that some political stance is idiotic?
I say it is, because if you cannot call a spade a spade (and before anyone gets upset, “spade” in this aphorism means “shovel“…) then there is no point in trying to have any discussion at all.
There are some so-called “political positions” that are so beyond the pale that they deserve to be ridiculed. The “birther movement” meets all the criteria.
This illustrates the key difference between what in the United States we call “conservative” extremists versus “liberal” extremists (“liberal” and “conservative” mean different things in Europe and the rest of the world… as with measurements, English units versus the metric system, we are unique, and not necessarily in a good way). The “conservative” extremists are exclusive, with their moronic focus on saying how those who don’t think like them “don’t belong” and should be rejected if not outright destroyed. The “liberal” extremists are naive, thinking that this Darwininan world will all come together in harmony if merely shown the rational path to success for all.
A fanatic is one who can’t change his mind and won’t change the subject
-Winston ChurchillFanaticism consists in redoubling your effort when you have forgotten your aim.
-George Santayana
I miss the old definitions of “conservative” and “liberal“, those that held before the words and their meanings were perverted by the politics of fanaticism in the United States.
Which extremist view has the higher moral ground, the “conservative” view of destroying opponents, or the “liberal” view of success for all?
Before you cry “but you have used straw man arguments” take a moment to seriously examine the positions of the extremists and most critically, their motivations, then let your conscience be your judge.
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Cross-posted to Random Fate and The Moderate Voice.
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21 Responses to “Some thoughts on the depths of idiocy”
Sore losers….refusing to accept defeat…reaching for straws.
Look at it this way…
At least they are wasting their time on this issue instead of murdering abortion doctors.
I still don't understand why the White House won't provide a photocopy of the birth certificate made in 1961 rather than an abstract typed up in 2008. Did the Hawaii BVS lose the document or something?
JG -
Thank you for pointing out the perversion of the words liberal and conservative by extremist ideologues. The classical meaning of these words is probably now lost forever. Shall we construct a new vocabulary to replace them with new terms?
The definition of lunacy is liberals thinking George Bush and Dick Cheney lied to start a war to help their friends at Halliburton make money.
Obama screwed up by releasing a photoshopped copy of his birth certificate through the Daily Kos website. If he would simply release the base document, there would be no controversy.
For liberals to claim this question of his place of birth is so far out while most still take as fact the ridiculous ravings about Bush is the height of hypocrisy.
I wouldn't characterize a left-leaning idealistic vision of “success for all” as extreme, any more than I would characterize a right-leaning idealistic vision of “self-regulating markets” as extreme. Idealism and extremism are not the same thing, nor are idealism and irrationality.
An “extreme” position, in my opinion, encompasses a narrow and absolutist “us vs. them” stance linked to a constant call for dramatic and immediate action (i.e. “extreme” actions).
An irrational claim is one that ignores all evidence to the contrary and relies heavily on convenient accusaions of “conspiracy” and “cover up” (thus negating even the possibility of true research and verification).
The equivalent of the irrational “birther” movement on the left would be something like the belief that the Bush Administration engineered 9/11. The equivalent of extremist actions like violence against abortion clinics would be violence against animal researchers and labs.
Idealism has a place in the public discourse. We need some people to take up arguments like “success for all” or “free and self-regulating markets” because competing ideals generate debates that can lead towards practical compromises.
Irrationality and extremism, on the other hand, should have no place. They should not get media airtime, respect from our leaders or a second thought from sane and educated citizens.
Unfortunately, they do. And that's one of the biggest problems with this country right now.
“jwest- Obama screwed up by releasing a photoshopped copy of his birth certificate through the Daily Kos website. If he would simply release the base document, there would be no controversy.”
The copy of his birth certificate wasn't a photoshop. It was just typed up on a computer by some state BVS employee in 2008 certifying that they saw the real birth certificate made in 1961.
“jjjennybean – The equivalent of the irrational “birther” movement on the left would be something like the belief that the Bush Administration engineered 9/11.”
Unlike the “Truther” movement, Obama has the ability to shut up the “Birther” instantaneously if he would just release the 1961 Birth Certificate. Instead, Obama has created another group of people like me who wonder why he doesn't discredit the Birthers by releasing his 1961 Birth Certificate.
There is no need for Obama to produce a copy of his birth certificate, it is tucked safely away in John Kerry's briefcase, wrapped securely in the 'magic hat' that he was given by a green beret officer Christmas Eve deep in the jungles of Cambodia….
jwest,
I suggest you watch the video before making a fool of yourself. The evidence that he was born in Hawaii is about as extensive as it gets.
“The definition of lunacy is liberals thinking George Bush and Dick Cheney lied to start a war to help their friends at Halliburton make money.”
It might not be true to say the war was started to enrich Halliburton. However, Bush & Cheney did lie repeatedly in order to sell the war, and Halliburton did make a lot of money as a result.
“Bush & Cheney did lie repeatedly in order to sell the war”
Chris,
Only in the lunatic world of left wing crazies did Bush and Cheney “lie”. There has not been any evidence whatsoever that Bush or Cheney said anything that wasn’t supported by the best intelligence at the time.
You’re basing you assumption that there is a valid birth certificate somewhere for Obama on hearsay. If there is such a document, why doesn’t he release it? Is it top secret?
Obama was born in the US. A coverup of this size spanning all levels of government would be too expansive to exist. The reason why Obama won't release his 1961 Birth Certificate is that there must be something embarrassing on it. Maybe something awesome like he was born a 'she'. Far fetched? Did you see the first pitch at the All-Star game?
Quert,
I think you’re on to something.
Not only does he throw like a girl, he whines like one too. Has he ever completed a sentence without saying he “inherited” a deficit?
jwest,
Let's fly you down to Hawaii asap! Your verification will certainly seal the deal for me. I mean come on, as Jon Stewart said, these two birth announcements in Hawaii newspapers could have certainly been faked in a grand scheme to get Obama elected a mere FOUR DECADES later.
As for lies to get us to go to war:
“Simply stated, there is no doubt that Saddam Hussein now has weapons of mass destruction.”
Dick Cheney August 26, 2002
“Right now, Iraq is expanding and improving facilities that were used for the production of biological weapons.”
George W. Bush September 12, 2002
“Intelligence gathered by this and other governments leaves no doubt that the Iraq regime continues to possess and conceal some of the most lethal weapons ever devised.”
George Bush March 18, 2003
And that's just from Bush and Cheney themselves, there are many more from their lackeys. And you know your “best intelligence” line is a bunch of garbage debunked by scores of ex-government sources and documents like the “Downing Street Memo.”
It was a lie to assert as unquestionable fact that Iraq had weapons of mass destruction.
Chris,
It’s just no use trying to discuss something with you when you’re hysterical like this.
Once you calm down, you’ll realize that the crazy things you’ve been saying are just the rantings of the lunatic left that you mistakenly have accepted as fact.
As far as Obama is concerned, of course his grandparents would place birth announcements in the paper at the time just incase there was a problem with a custody battle over little Barack.
I don’t dispute that Obama is a citizen. But don’t you find it strange that a matter that could be cleared up so simply is still in doubt because Obama will not allow the ’61 document to be published? Isn’t that “intellectually incurious”?
“Not only does he throw like a girl, he whines like one too.”
Not only idiotic, but also mysogynist. My, but you do get around.
The Watergate-infamy J. Gordon Liddy just “appeared” on Harball.
I say “appeared” because the idiot was totally tongue-tied when shown birth certificates and other evidence by Chris Matthews proving the citizenship of the President.
Completely embarassed and befuddled, the Watergate plumber looked downward and mumbled a few things. Priceless!
It will probably be shown tonight on the talk shows…watch it.
>>>say “appeared” because the idiot was totally tongue-tied when shown birth certificates <<<<
Again, people want the 1961 Birth Certificate, not the 2008 Abstract. Why is that so hard to understand?
Obama is foreign born unless you consider Hawaii an American state. – IMAO
OK- How many presidents were required to show their original birth certificate after being elected???
This a non-issue that is being manufactured to detract from Obama's personal popularity and to foil his attempts to unite the country. I would respect the right wing more if they would concentrate on pretending once more that they represent the average voter and not corporate America and the gun lobby.:-)
jwest– Chris nailed it. The facts were created to justify the policy instead of the policy being created on the basis of the facts. There is overwhelming evidence that they lied. Only the diehards still believe otherwise.
I've heard rumors that Sarah Palin is in reality the scion of a Cthulu worshiping death cult and would like to examine her DNA to make sure she is completely human and not some demon spawned by Shub Noggoth. A hair or perhaps and blood sample will do, or a mouth swab. Until I have this material and will not believe any denials to my far fetched and fabricated claim whatsoever. After all, if Sarah Palin is human, she has nothing to hide, right?
qwert321 wrote:
“Unlike the “Truther” movement, Obama has the ability to shut up the “Birther” instantaneously if he would just release the 1961 Birth Certificate.”
I highly doubt that. When this whole thing started back before the election, it was said if Obama would just produce his birth certificate, everyone would be happy. Then he puts his birth certificate out there (the certificate that FactCheck says looks identical to a random, Hawaiian-born person's they checked) and no, that's not sufficient. Now a *different* birth certificate is what's needed (despite the fact that the state of Hawaii says they don't have long and short-form birth certificates and that what Obama released *is* a Hawaiian birth certificate). But still, if such a document could be found and released, then we'd hear it was a forgery or belonged to some other person or whatever. It would go on and on.
Similarly, no matter what overwhelming evidence you provide “Truthers” that 9/11 was planned by Osama Bin Laden without assistance from the U.S. government, they will come back with some reason why your evidence is suspect or corrupt or manufactured. They will never believe you, and you will never make your case to them.
Because all these people–right and left–are *irrational*. And yet, bizarrely, when they repeat their irrational claims enough times, seemingly rational people start saying “maybe there's something to all this…” It's a strange and sad phenomenon.
Anyway, my prior point was just that there is no “better” brand of political nuttiness. Loonies are loonies on both ends of the spectrum.