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	<title>Comments on: Student Response to Anti-Gay Human Rights Prof&#8217;s NYU Invitation</title>
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		<title>By: superduper</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/38714/student-response-to-anti-gay-human-rights-prof/comment-page-1/#comment-196023</link>
		<dc:creator>superduper</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 24 Jul 2009 05:38:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/?p=38714#comment-196023</guid>
		<description>@beyondbigotry&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;A bit of education here (which google can also provide you with should you bother).&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Incest is against the law because it has been scientifically proven that children born out of incestuous relationships are very much more likely to suffer from birth defects. One could say outlawing incest is not so much based on moral arguments but economic ones, where insurance companies and the public health sector face a higher economic cost should incestuous relationships be legalized.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Coming to sex with underage individuals - children are deemed less able to make wise, logical choices of their own until they reach a legal age. As such, setting a minimum legal age for sex would ensure that the act is carried out with full awareness of possible consequences and of course, consent from the individual under the condition that he/she is wise enough to make his/her own choices. If you would like to go further and argue about what the age set by the law should be, you can decide to educate yourself with the help of a search engine.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;The reason why many feel that gay rights (i.e the right to have consensual sex with another individual of the same sex, provided both are of legal age) are basic human rights is because heterosexual &#039;straight rights&#039; (term coined by self) are deemed basic human rights as well and gays are no different from heterosexual people, except for their sexual orientation, much like skin colour. Or if you&#039;d like to argue that it is a choice, much like religion.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@beyondbigotry</p>
<p>A bit of education here (which google can also provide you with should you bother).</p>
<p>Incest is against the law because it has been scientifically proven that children born out of incestuous relationships are very much more likely to suffer from birth defects. One could say outlawing incest is not so much based on moral arguments but economic ones, where insurance companies and the public health sector face a higher economic cost should incestuous relationships be legalized.</p>
<p>Coming to sex with underage individuals &#8211; children are deemed less able to make wise, logical choices of their own until they reach a legal age. As such, setting a minimum legal age for sex would ensure that the act is carried out with full awareness of possible consequences and of course, consent from the individual under the condition that he/she is wise enough to make his/her own choices. If you would like to go further and argue about what the age set by the law should be, you can decide to educate yourself with the help of a search engine.</p>
<p>The reason why many feel that gay rights (i.e the right to have consensual sex with another individual of the same sex, provided both are of legal age) are basic human rights is because heterosexual &#39;straight rights&#39; (term coined by self) are deemed basic human rights as well and gays are no different from heterosexual people, except for their sexual orientation, much like skin colour. Or if you&#39;d like to argue that it is a choice, much like religion.</p>
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		<title>By: johnnya2</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/38714/student-response-to-anti-gay-human-rights-prof/comment-page-1/#comment-195643</link>
		<dc:creator>johnnya2</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 22 Jul 2009 20:52:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/?p=38714#comment-195643</guid>
		<description>Who you marry is a choice, so we could say it isnt a human right to marry a black man if you are a white woman. I could also tell you that your RELIGION is a choice, and based on your argument, I can now discriminate against Jews, Catholics or ANY religion.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Who you marry is a choice, so we could say it isnt a human right to marry a black man if you are a white woman. I could also tell you that your RELIGION is a choice, and based on your argument, I can now discriminate against Jews, Catholics or ANY religion.</p>
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		<title>By: MotherofFather_Time</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/38714/student-response-to-anti-gay-human-rights-prof/comment-page-1/#comment-194163</link>
		<dc:creator>MotherofFather_Time</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 14 Jul 2009 15:07:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/?p=38714#comment-194163</guid>
		<description>I want to hear how would Father_time reply all the comments above!!!&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Erm...if FT doesnt turn out, no problem, coward or not it s his CHOICE in the end. :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I want to hear how would Father_time reply all the comments above!!!</p>
<p>Erm&#8230;if FT doesnt turn out, no problem, coward or not it s his CHOICE in the end. <img src='http://themoderatevoice.com/wordpress-engine/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: beyondbigotry</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/38714/student-response-to-anti-gay-human-rights-prof/comment-page-1/#comment-194062</link>
		<dc:creator>beyondbigotry</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 13 Jul 2009 20:12:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/?p=38714#comment-194062</guid>
		<description>Um, isn&#039;t the question of whether sexual orientation is a human right itself controversial in US and the World? The latest push to have a UN declaration on sexual orientation met with substantial oppositions from almost half of the world&#039;s countries. Unless we consider US having weighted say on this matter the way Western countries have at the IMF and World Bank, we should curb our moral imperialism. &lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Sexual orientation is an elusive term - why include or exclude one orientation or sexual behaviour and not the next? Why accept or reject homosexuals, lesbians and not voluntary incest or under age sex? Our laws draw lines at every point, laws embody specific moral values. Let&#039;s not pretend. What is at stake here is whether we like someone else&#039;s sexual moral viewpoints. What&#039;s the difference between the following assertions:-&lt;br&gt;1. It is right for one to engage in sexual activity with another person of the same sex.&lt;br&gt;2. It is wrong for one to believe that marriage should be betweeen people of opposite sex.&lt;br&gt;3. It is right for a law academic to support legalized homosexual sex.&lt;br&gt;4. It is wrong for a man to have sexual relations with a legally under-aged person (why does 1 day or 5 months make a difference?)&lt;br&gt;5. It is illegal for a man to marry his sister or mother.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Are the above not normative assertions? Why should one position be superior to the other? How do we decide this in a democratic country? Or are we no longer interested in what another has to say?&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;If the Asian law universities&#039; communities have warmly received and heard diverse views of their Western counterparts, surely, we can do the same without calling our opponents names and saying that they are not competent to teach?&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Prof Thio has spoken to constitutional and human rights issues. We should examine the merits of her arguments (and she has written on many issues not just sexual orientation) instead of engaging in inaccuracies and name calling so characteristics of American politics.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Let&#039;s be more than &#039;moderate&#039; - let&#039;s be accurate and not engage in slanderous and vindictive personal and professional attacks against the individual. &lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;In the name of freedom of speech and conscience. This should be applied both ways.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Um, isn&#39;t the question of whether sexual orientation is a human right itself controversial in US and the World? The latest push to have a UN declaration on sexual orientation met with substantial oppositions from almost half of the world&#39;s countries. Unless we consider US having weighted say on this matter the way Western countries have at the IMF and World Bank, we should curb our moral imperialism. </p>
<p>Sexual orientation is an elusive term &#8211; why include or exclude one orientation or sexual behaviour and not the next? Why accept or reject homosexuals, lesbians and not voluntary incest or under age sex? Our laws draw lines at every point, laws embody specific moral values. Let&#39;s not pretend. What is at stake here is whether we like someone else&#39;s sexual moral viewpoints. What&#39;s the difference between the following assertions:-<br />1. It is right for one to engage in sexual activity with another person of the same sex.<br />2. It is wrong for one to believe that marriage should be betweeen people of opposite sex.<br />3. It is right for a law academic to support legalized homosexual sex.<br />4. It is wrong for a man to have sexual relations with a legally under-aged person (why does 1 day or 5 months make a difference?)<br />5. It is illegal for a man to marry his sister or mother.</p>
<p>Are the above not normative assertions? Why should one position be superior to the other? How do we decide this in a democratic country? Or are we no longer interested in what another has to say?</p>
<p>If the Asian law universities&#39; communities have warmly received and heard diverse views of their Western counterparts, surely, we can do the same without calling our opponents names and saying that they are not competent to teach?</p>
<p>Prof Thio has spoken to constitutional and human rights issues. We should examine the merits of her arguments (and she has written on many issues not just sexual orientation) instead of engaging in inaccuracies and name calling so characteristics of American politics.</p>
<p>Let&#39;s be more than &#39;moderate&#39; &#8211; let&#39;s be accurate and not engage in slanderous and vindictive personal and professional attacks against the individual. </p>
<p>In the name of freedom of speech and conscience. This should be applied both ways.</p>
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		<title>By: grayzip</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/38714/student-response-to-anti-gay-human-rights-prof/comment-page-1/#comment-193968</link>
		<dc:creator>grayzip</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 13 Jul 2009 04:32:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/?p=38714#comment-193968</guid>
		<description>By Thio Li-Ann&#039;s own reasoning, such as it is, the human rights of (straight) minorities, for which she works so hard, are and should remain completely elective everywhere until and unless there is ever unanimity on the subject of granting them.  What an odd thing to have made her life&#039;s work, given her laissez-faire attitude on the subject.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>By Thio Li-Ann&#39;s own reasoning, such as it is, the human rights of (straight) minorities, for which she works so hard, are and should remain completely elective everywhere until and unless there is ever unanimity on the subject of granting them.  What an odd thing to have made her life&#39;s work, given her laissez-faire attitude on the subject.</p>
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		<title>By: grayzip</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/38714/student-response-to-anti-gay-human-rights-prof/comment-page-1/#comment-193965</link>
		<dc:creator>grayzip</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 13 Jul 2009 04:19:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/?p=38714#comment-193965</guid>
		<description>&quot;Whom you have sex with IS a choice!&quot;&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;If only the wanton use of capitalization and exclamation points could get that thought airborne you might have a point; unfortunately, every credible study done on the subject begs to differ.  &lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Unless you mean homosexuals could force themselves to have sex with someone to whom they are not attracted.  Even if you would wish that kind of loveless and sexless marriage on me, though, why would you wish it on your daughter?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Whom you have sex with IS a choice!&#8221;</p>
<p>If only the wanton use of capitalization and exclamation points could get that thought airborne you might have a point; unfortunately, every credible study done on the subject begs to differ.  </p>
<p>Unless you mean homosexuals could force themselves to have sex with someone to whom they are not attracted.  Even if you would wish that kind of loveless and sexless marriage on me, though, why would you wish it on your daughter?</p>
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		<title>By: DLS</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/38714/student-response-to-anti-gay-human-rights-prof/comment-page-1/#comment-193643</link>
		<dc:creator>DLS</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 10 Jul 2009 17:48:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/?p=38714#comment-193643</guid>
		<description>If the opponents have any decency and normality they will not attack or disrupt the professor or the classes (nor harass the students, obviously*) --  but simply boycott the classes.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;* Which would be typical hypocrisy and worse if they did -- shooting the professor not required...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If the opponents have any decency and normality they will not attack or disrupt the professor or the classes (nor harass the students, obviously*) &#8212;  but simply boycott the classes.</p>
<p>* Which would be typical hypocrisy and worse if they did &#8212; shooting the professor not required&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: DLS</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/38714/student-response-to-anti-gay-human-rights-prof/comment-page-1/#comment-193638</link>
		<dc:creator>DLS</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 10 Jul 2009 17:43:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/?p=38714#comment-193638</guid>
		<description>Yes, the PC campus brownshirts predictably are out in force.  (In a kinder, gentler, way, such as not wanting a book banned at a book store, or engaging in the typical leftist campus stunt of seizing and destroying un-PC publications on campus, but rather &quot;merely&quot; insisting the bookstore officially post a sign next to the book saying &quot;THIS BOOK IS WRONG&quot;)&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;It&#039;s still PC campus brownshirt stuff, and entirely predictable.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yes, the PC campus brownshirts predictably are out in force.  (In a kinder, gentler, way, such as not wanting a book banned at a book store, or engaging in the typical leftist campus stunt of seizing and destroying un-PC publications on campus, but rather &#8220;merely&#8221; insisting the bookstore officially post a sign next to the book saying &#8220;THIS BOOK IS WRONG&#8221;)</p>
<p>It&#39;s still PC campus brownshirt stuff, and entirely predictable.</p>
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		<title>By: StockBoySF</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/38714/student-response-to-anti-gay-human-rights-prof/comment-page-1/#comment-193511</link>
		<dc:creator>StockBoySF</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 10 Jul 2009 02:17:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/?p=38714#comment-193511</guid>
		<description>Father_Time, &quot;Whom you have sex with IS a choice!&quot;&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Hahaha....  that&#039;s obvious.  Some people prefer to have sex with women and some people prefer to have sex with men.  Why do you have sex (assuming you do) with the people (or person) you do?  And why should you care who someone you don&#039;t even know is having sex with?  What difference does it make?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Father_Time, &#8220;Whom you have sex with IS a choice!&#8221;</p>
<p>Hahaha&#8230;.  that&#39;s obvious.  Some people prefer to have sex with women and some people prefer to have sex with men.  Why do you have sex (assuming you do) with the people (or person) you do?  And why should you care who someone you don&#39;t even know is having sex with?  What difference does it make?</p>
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		<title>By: Ryan</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/38714/student-response-to-anti-gay-human-rights-prof/comment-page-1/#comment-193507</link>
		<dc:creator>Ryan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 10 Jul 2009 02:02:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/?p=38714#comment-193507</guid>
		<description>Good. I&#039;m glad you&#039;re ok with banning interracial marriage, too, since it is after all a choice.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Good. I&#39;m glad you&#39;re ok with banning interracial marriage, too, since it is after all a choice.</p>
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		<title>By: StockBoySF</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/38714/student-response-to-anti-gay-human-rights-prof/comment-page-1/#comment-193504</link>
		<dc:creator>StockBoySF</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 10 Jul 2009 01:57:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/?p=38714#comment-193504</guid>
		<description>The student response is great!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The student response is great!</p>
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		<title>By: pacatrue</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/38714/student-response-to-anti-gay-human-rights-prof/comment-page-1/#comment-193496</link>
		<dc:creator>pacatrue</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 10 Jul 2009 00:23:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/?p=38714#comment-193496</guid>
		<description>When did I say she wasn&#039;t allowed to speak her mal-informed, idiotic stuff? She can have at it. Naturally, you assume I want to suppress her free speech rights because... gays are out to get you, I think.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;My point is that just because people can physically refrain from doing something, it does not give the majority the moral right to outlaw it. Almost everyone now accepts that it is wrong to ban religions you don&#039;t adhere to, or even that you think are wrong, because of the fundamental importance of religion in life. Surely love is something rather fundamental to a person&#039;s identity, life, and happiness as well. But what did Thomas Jefferson know?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>When did I say she wasn&#39;t allowed to speak her mal-informed, idiotic stuff? She can have at it. Naturally, you assume I want to suppress her free speech rights because&#8230; gays are out to get you, I think.</p>
<p>My point is that just because people can physically refrain from doing something, it does not give the majority the moral right to outlaw it. Almost everyone now accepts that it is wrong to ban religions you don&#39;t adhere to, or even that you think are wrong, because of the fundamental importance of religion in life. Surely love is something rather fundamental to a person&#39;s identity, life, and happiness as well. But what did Thomas Jefferson know?</p>
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		<title>By: Father_Time</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/38714/student-response-to-anti-gay-human-rights-prof/comment-page-1/#comment-193494</link>
		<dc:creator>Father_Time</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 10 Jul 2009 00:01:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/?p=38714#comment-193494</guid>
		<description>pacatrue--&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Freedom from religion I have. Freedom to Suppress Dr. Thio, you don’t have.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;...and there she is teaching at NYU. The tip of the sword.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Jews? Oh good grief no they don‘t bother anyone. More like reverend Phelps and his home grown Baptists, but then you would have to agree with me on a point. God Forbid.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>pacatrue&#8211;</p>
<p>Freedom from religion I have. Freedom to Suppress Dr. Thio, you don’t have.</p>
<p>&#8230;and there she is teaching at NYU. The tip of the sword.</p>
<p>Jews? Oh good grief no they don‘t bother anyone. More like reverend Phelps and his home grown Baptists, but then you would have to agree with me on a point. God Forbid.</p>
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		<title>By: pacatrue</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/38714/student-response-to-anti-gay-human-rights-prof/comment-page-1/#comment-193491</link>
		<dc:creator>pacatrue</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 09 Jul 2009 23:39:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/?p=38714#comment-193491</guid>
		<description>&lt;frustrated snark&gt;That&#039;s why Father_time also wishes to push back on freedom of religion, since it&#039;s a choice. I await his comments on why any religious majority has the moral right to ban other religions and denominations. Since Judaism is a choice, then it&#039;s appropriate to push back against the freedoms of Jews if the majority so chooses. Jews demanding the right to practice their religion freely is a horrible imposition on others.&lt;/frustrated snark&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&lt;frustrated snark&gt;That&#39;s why Father_time also wishes to push back on freedom of religion, since it&#39;s a choice. I await his comments on why any religious majority has the moral right to ban other religions and denominations. Since Judaism is a choice, then it&#39;s appropriate to push back against the freedoms of Jews if the majority so chooses. Jews demanding the right to practice their religion freely is a horrible imposition on others.&lt;/frustrated snark&gt;</p>
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		<title>By: Father_Time</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/38714/student-response-to-anti-gay-human-rights-prof/comment-page-1/#comment-193489</link>
		<dc:creator>Father_Time</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 09 Jul 2009 23:27:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/?p=38714#comment-193489</guid>
		<description>Mommy, why are those two men pretending to be mommy and daddy?&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Laws can be reversed. I find Dr. Thio&#039;s remarks remarkably interesting in a field where there don&#039;t seem to be enough educated thought applied to this issue.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;I suggest that its time to start pushing back against the, &quot;Lesbian&quot; &quot;Gay&quot; &lt;br&gt;&quot;Bi-SEXUAL&quot; &quot;TRANSGENDER&quot; extra rights movement.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;I want to know EXACTLY what they want and where it ends. No Generalizations and no Rhetoric attempting to associated LGBT with RACE.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Race has no choice. Whom you have sex with IS a choice!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mommy, why are those two men pretending to be mommy and daddy?</p>
<p>Laws can be reversed. I find Dr. Thio&#39;s remarks remarkably interesting in a field where there don&#39;t seem to be enough educated thought applied to this issue.</p>
<p>I suggest that its time to start pushing back against the, &#8220;Lesbian&#8221; &#8220;Gay&#8221; <br />&#8220;Bi-SEXUAL&#8221; &#8220;TRANSGENDER&#8221; extra rights movement.</p>
<p>I want to know EXACTLY what they want and where it ends. No Generalizations and no Rhetoric attempting to associated LGBT with RACE.</p>
<p>Race has no choice. Whom you have sex with IS a choice!</p>
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