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The only reflex I see is a hell-bent desire that nothing ever be even hinted at as being anti-Semitic, ever. At the point where you concede that Jazz's argument is a) illogical and b) reminiscent of classic conspiracy mongering that is really dangerous for Jews then I'm not sure why I'm the crazy person for making the extension that illogical conspiratorial arguments which threaten minorities are a bad thing and we should condemn them.

As Jazz is so helpfully demonstrating, anti-Zionist discourse often bleeds into anti-Semitic discourse

Or, as you're demonstrating, anti-Zionist discourse is reflexively labeled as anti-Semitic.

In any event, I highly doubt that Jazz's comment is intentionally or unwittingly laying the groundwork for future pogroms. But before I say anymore, I'd like to know what Jazz thinks of all of this.

what Jazz is saying doesn't make sense unless he believes that Zionists possess too much power in the United States. In which case, the snark is simply exaggerating a position he agrees with, which means he is enforcing the conspiracy talk. Not only is this not difficult, you haven't given a benign alternative interpretation..

You act as if that viewpoint is without any merit, despite strong evidence to the contrary. Also, you're conflating anti-Zionism, or more specifically opposition to Israeli influence over the U.S. government, with anti-Semitism.

I understand that you're saying Jazz's comments come close to classic anti-Semitic remarks about global conspiracies and the like. There's no denying that's true. However, this specific case has enough merit (AIPAC is a powerful lobby, and there was an actual conspiracy) that I think your charge is uncalled for.

And here, really, what Jazz is saying doesn't make sense unless he believes that Zionists possess too much power in the United States. In which case, the snark is simply exaggerating a position he agrees with, which means he is enforcing the conspiracy talk. Not only is this not difficult, you haven't given a benign alternative interpretation.

More generally, charges of anti-Semitism have been thrown about so frequently (and often falsely) by groups like the Anti-Defamation League, that it's losing impact.

No.

You blew this one.

It's not like Jews don't face enough serious conspiracy talk by important political actors (e.g., the first speaker at this week's Geneva conference) so that Jazz's “farcical” (if it was that) version can be dismissed as trivial. We're still dealing with the fallout of this shit — it's not something you joke around about. This type of conspiracy talk isn't exactly uncommon for Jews either.

Completely, totally, utterly.

But Jazz somehow argues that an investigation into such alleged behavior is itself proof that it's impossible to investigate such behavior, and that public reporting on the topic is proof that nobody can talk about it. It's more than “a bit much” — it's an unbelievable logical contortion borne out of paranoia, and it is an extremely poisonous contribution to the public discourse on the subject.

I agree that he's not coming to a logical conclusion. However, — Jazz can certainly chime in here — I think he was being a bit snarky, and more importantly this kind of conspiracy talk is common for other actors in the Middle East. There are plenty of people who think that the Saudi's have a stranglehold on our government and industry that leads to gas guzzlers out of Detroit and clemency for Bin Laden. I have yet to see those types of claims come under attack for being anti-Arab or anti-Muslim.

But Jazz somehow argues that an investigation into such alleged behavior is itself proof that it's impossible to investigate such behavior, and that public reporting on the topic is proof that nobody can talk about it. It's an unbelievable logical contortion borne out of paranoia, and it is an extremely poisonous contribution to the public discourse on the subject.

But if Jazz is right, I should be dead by morning anyway via Mossad bullet. So I guess we'll see.

Under those circumstances, I don't think it's the least bit anti-Semitic to say that our country's relationship with Israel is unhealthy. The same goes for our public debate over that relationship.