Comments on: From the Party of “No” to the Party of “Go” http://themoderatevoice.com/26680/from-the-party-of-no-to-the-party-of-go/ An Internet hub with domestic and international news, analysis, original reporting, and popular features from the left, center, indies, centrists, moderates, and right Wed, 15 Feb 2012 10:08:52 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.1.2 By: DaGoat http://themoderatevoice.com/26680/from-the-party-of-no-to-the-party-of-go/comment-page-1/#comment-173982 DaGoat Tue, 24 Feb 2009 02:11:57 +0000 http://themoderatevoice.com/26680/from-the-party-of-no-to-the-party-of-go/#comment-173982 Medicare is going to be more critical than Social Security as it will go bankrupt by 2019 at the current pace. The best way to save money in health care is to limit access and treatment options a la Canada but I really doubt the US consumer or either party is ready for that. The talk of computerized records saving money is really so much BS - both McCain and Obama espoused that approach but both are wrong. They can talk about cutting payments to physicians, nursing homes, hospitals, etc but frankly Medicare reimbursements already barely cover costs and cutting payments will mean less participating physicians and more hospitals shutting down. I doubt Obama or any other politician has the stomach for that.<br><br>I hate to say it as a free market guy but either a radical change in the health care system is needed or Medicare taxes will have to be raised. Neither of these options is attractive. Medicare is going to be more critical than Social Security as it will go bankrupt by 2019 at the current pace. The best way to save money in health care is to limit access and treatment options a la Canada but I really doubt the US consumer or either party is ready for that. The talk of computerized records saving money is really so much BS – both McCain and Obama espoused that approach but both are wrong. They can talk about cutting payments to physicians, nursing homes, hospitals, etc but frankly Medicare reimbursements already barely cover costs and cutting payments will mean less participating physicians and more hospitals shutting down. I doubt Obama or any other politician has the stomach for that.

I hate to say it as a free market guy but either a radical change in the health care system is needed or Medicare taxes will have to be raised. Neither of these options is attractive.

]]> By: Jazz http://themoderatevoice.com/26680/from-the-party-of-no-to-the-party-of-go/comment-page-1/#comment-173980 Jazz Tue, 24 Feb 2009 02:06:47 +0000 http://themoderatevoice.com/26680/from-the-party-of-no-to-the-party-of-go/#comment-173980 "<i>It's worked well for Canada and they aren't suffering the same degree of economic warp that we are here. I don't think they've even had any banks fail either.</i>"<br><br>Sure. It's easier to have things working well when NAFTA has us pumping an 87B trade deficit in their favor up that way and we're buying all the oil they can pump. That's not an argument against your basis premise, but Canada is in better shape than us in the respects you mention, at least in part, because of so called "fair trade." “It's worked well for Canada and they aren't suffering the same degree of economic warp that we are here. I don't think they've even had any banks fail either.“

Sure. It's easier to have things working well when NAFTA has us pumping an 87B trade deficit in their favor up that way and we're buying all the oil they can pump. That's not an argument against your basis premise, but Canada is in better shape than us in the respects you mention, at least in part, because of so called “fair trade.”

]]> By: CStanley http://themoderatevoice.com/26680/from-the-party-of-no-to-the-party-of-go/comment-page-1/#comment-173979 CStanley Tue, 24 Feb 2009 02:03:55 +0000 http://themoderatevoice.com/26680/from-the-party-of-no-to-the-party-of-go/#comment-173979 Right, Jim, because pointing out that the system will be bankrupt soon if we don't make adjustments is EXACTLY the same as distorting and misrepresenting everything in the name of discrediting the programs. Right, Jim, because pointing out that the system will be bankrupt soon if we don't make adjustments is EXACTLY the same as distorting and misrepresenting everything in the name of discrediting the programs.

]]> By: Jim_Satterfield http://themoderatevoice.com/26680/from-the-party-of-no-to-the-party-of-go/comment-page-1/#comment-173975 Jim_Satterfield Tue, 24 Feb 2009 01:33:16 +0000 http://themoderatevoice.com/26680/from-the-party-of-no-to-the-party-of-go/#comment-173975 That's odd. The pattern I see is a party so conservative that the only ideas they have date back to the 1920s. If only we could eliminate all those nasty social programs everything would be paradise because the free market will fix it all, is what they seem to claim. Thus, they distort and misrepresent everything in the name of discrediting those programs. That's odd. The pattern I see is a party so conservative that the only ideas they have date back to the 1920s. If only we could eliminate all those nasty social programs everything would be paradise because the free market will fix it all, is what they seem to claim. Thus, they distort and misrepresent everything in the name of discrediting those programs.

]]> By: Don Quijote http://themoderatevoice.com/26680/from-the-party-of-no-to-the-party-of-go/comment-page-1/#comment-173971 Don Quijote Tue, 24 Feb 2009 01:16:25 +0000 http://themoderatevoice.com/26680/from-the-party-of-no-to-the-party-of-go/#comment-173971 If Obama wants to be a one termer, all he has to do is mess with Social Security Benefits, the republicans will support him (they have always hated Social Security), a couple of blue dogs might go along and after the Republicans have gotten what they want, they will drop him like a hot potato and find any way they can to f**k him over, and he will have lost his base.<br><br>Comes 2012, If Palin runs, she will win because someone will run to the left of Obama and siphon more than enough votes for any Republican to win. If Obama wants to be a one termer, all he has to do is mess with Social Security Benefits, the republicans will support him (they have always hated Social Security), a couple of blue dogs might go along and after the Republicans have gotten what they want, they will drop him like a hot potato and find any way they can to f**k him over, and he will have lost his base.

Comes 2012, If Palin runs, she will win because someone will run to the left of Obama and siphon more than enough votes for any Republican to win.

]]> By: JSpencer http://themoderatevoice.com/26680/from-the-party-of-no-to-the-party-of-go/comment-page-1/#comment-173970 JSpencer Tue, 24 Feb 2009 01:09:33 +0000 http://themoderatevoice.com/26680/from-the-party-of-no-to-the-party-of-go/#comment-173970 I think there's little doubt we would all be better served if both parties could put a "leash" on their more extreme elements, since it is they who usually screw things up for the rest of us. By the way, I don't see anything mutually exclusive about so-called "universal" healthcare and fiscal responsibility in the long run. It's worked well for Canada and they aren't suffering the same degree of economic warp that we are here. I don't think they've even had any banks fail either. Sure, things may be rough in the beginning, but we need to be looking at the long run, not the short one (which is what has been happening for so long now). No pian, no gain. Gotta break a few eggs to make an omelet, etc.... I think there's little doubt we would all be better served if both parties could put a “leash” on their more extreme elements, since it is they who usually screw things up for the rest of us. By the way, I don't see anything mutually exclusive about so-called “universal” healthcare and fiscal responsibility in the long run. It's worked well for Canada and they aren't suffering the same degree of economic warp that we are here. I don't think they've even had any banks fail either. Sure, things may be rough in the beginning, but we need to be looking at the long run, not the short one (which is what has been happening for so long now). No pian, no gain. Gotta break a few eggs to make an omelet, etc….

]]> By: GeorgeSorwell http://themoderatevoice.com/26680/from-the-party-of-no-to-the-party-of-go/comment-page-1/#comment-173964 GeorgeSorwell Mon, 23 Feb 2009 23:49:42 +0000 http://themoderatevoice.com/26680/from-the-party-of-no-to-the-party-of-go/#comment-173964 And, really, who doesn't believe Ezra Klein? And, really, who doesn't believe Ezra Klein?

]]> By: CStanley http://themoderatevoice.com/26680/from-the-party-of-no-to-the-party-of-go/comment-page-1/#comment-173958 CStanley Mon, 23 Feb 2009 23:06:13 +0000 http://themoderatevoice.com/26680/from-the-party-of-no-to-the-party-of-go/#comment-173958 Well, if Ezra Klein is to be believed, the whole point of Obama's roll out of fiscal responsibility is to convince everyone that entitlement reform means 'healthcare reform', which means he's going to claim that universal healthcare and a few reforms like computerizing medical records is going to magically reduce the costs to make Medicare sustainable.<br><br>So of course the GOP is going to oppose that (a conventional liberal Democratic plan that's been in the works for decades, now dressed up as entitlement reform.) <br><br>I'm seeing a pattern here; Obama puts the old Democratic ideas into these Trojan horse plans and calls for bipartisan support of them; GOP rejects them and gets labelled the 'party of no.' Well, if Ezra Klein is to be believed, the whole point of Obama's roll out of fiscal responsibility is to convince everyone that entitlement reform means 'healthcare reform', which means he's going to claim that universal healthcare and a few reforms like computerizing medical records is going to magically reduce the costs to make Medicare sustainable.

So of course the GOP is going to oppose that (a conventional liberal Democratic plan that's been in the works for decades, now dressed up as entitlement reform.)

I'm seeing a pattern here; Obama puts the old Democratic ideas into these Trojan horse plans and calls for bipartisan support of them; GOP rejects them and gets labelled the 'party of no.'

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