Comments on: “Right” Convention, Wrong Country? http://themoderatevoice.com/22459/%e2%80%9cright%e2%80%9d-convention-wrong-country/ An Internet hub with domestic and international news, analysis, original reporting, and popular features from the left, center, indies, centrists, moderates, and right Mon, 28 May 2012 21:59:24 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.1.2 By: CStanley http://themoderatevoice.com/22459/%e2%80%9cright%e2%80%9d-convention-wrong-country/comment-page-1/#comment-126057 CStanley Sat, 06 Sep 2008 19:57:00 +0000 http://themoderatevoice.com/politics/republican-party/22459/%e2%80%9cright%e2%80%9d-convention-wrong-country/#comment-126057 Of course, you haven't shown me a single statement from Romney's speech that did the things that you mention. Instead, you quoted one statement from him that gave a positive affirmation of what the GOP will do and from that you infer that he was insulting the Democrats.<br><br>I mean come on...what speech at the GOP convention actually said anything about Democrats being homosexual or hating religion, or even questioned anyone's patriotism? Just as you only hear Dems saying that the GOP has good intentions but bad outcomes, that's exactly what I hear the GOP saying about Democrats.<br><br>And why have you moved the goalposts to just Rudy's speech now? First you were saying Romney's was bad, now it's not so bad but you really want me to defend Rudy. Well, I don't have time to google it right now, but I did hear a bit of it- where he was riffing on Obama for voting present. It was snarky and a bit meanspirited, I'll admit- but why should his voting record not be an issue? The (untrue) claim that McCain voted with Bush 95% of the time certainly got a lot of play at the DNC. Of course, you haven't shown me a single statement from Romney's speech that did the things that you mention. Instead, you quoted one statement from him that gave a positive affirmation of what the GOP will do and from that you infer that he was insulting the Democrats.

I mean come on…what speech at the GOP convention actually said anything about Democrats being homosexual or hating religion, or even questioned anyone's patriotism? Just as you only hear Dems saying that the GOP has good intentions but bad outcomes, that's exactly what I hear the GOP saying about Democrats.

And why have you moved the goalposts to just Rudy's speech now? First you were saying Romney's was bad, now it's not so bad but you really want me to defend Rudy. Well, I don't have time to google it right now, but I did hear a bit of it- where he was riffing on Obama for voting present. It was snarky and a bit meanspirited, I'll admit- but why should his voting record not be an issue? The (untrue) claim that McCain voted with Bush 95% of the time certainly got a lot of play at the DNC.

]]> By: ChrisWWW http://themoderatevoice.com/22459/%e2%80%9cright%e2%80%9d-convention-wrong-country/comment-page-1/#comment-126055 ChrisWWW Sat, 06 Sep 2008 16:58:14 +0000 http://themoderatevoice.com/politics/republican-party/22459/%e2%80%9cright%e2%80%9d-convention-wrong-country/#comment-126055 CStanley,<br>The GOP takes it a step further. Democrats don't just have bad ideas, they want America to lose wars, they aren't patriotic, they're all homosexuals, they hate religion, etc.<br><br>To the contrary, Obama, Biden and Bill Clinton have gone out of their way to say that Republicans want good things for the country, they just aren't going about it the correct way. CStanley,
The GOP takes it a step further. Democrats don't just have bad ideas, they want America to lose wars, they aren't patriotic, they're all homosexuals, they hate religion, etc.

To the contrary, Obama, Biden and Bill Clinton have gone out of their way to say that Republicans want good things for the country, they just aren't going about it the correct way.

]]> By: ChrisWWW http://themoderatevoice.com/22459/%e2%80%9cright%e2%80%9d-convention-wrong-country/comment-page-1/#comment-126052 ChrisWWW Sat, 06 Sep 2008 16:52:34 +0000 http://themoderatevoice.com/politics/republican-party/22459/%e2%80%9cright%e2%80%9d-convention-wrong-country/#comment-126052 And Rudy's speech? You seem to be afraid to talk about that one. And Rudy's speech? You seem to be afraid to talk about that one.

]]> By: CStanley http://themoderatevoice.com/22459/%e2%80%9cright%e2%80%9d-convention-wrong-country/comment-page-1/#comment-126051 CStanley Sat, 06 Sep 2008 16:49:59 +0000 http://themoderatevoice.com/politics/republican-party/22459/%e2%80%9cright%e2%80%9d-convention-wrong-country/#comment-126051 Oh, and the reason that Nutter clip struck me is that I distinctly remember a lot of complaints from Democrats about Bush and others calling their party the "Democrat party" instead of "Democratic party". Yet it apparently is fine now for elected officials to make public speeches using Kos like namecalling. Oh, and the reason that Nutter clip struck me is that I distinctly remember a lot of complaints from Democrats about Bush and others calling their party the “Democrat party” instead of “Democratic party”. Yet it apparently is fine now for elected officials to make public speeches using Kos like namecalling.

]]> By: CStanley http://themoderatevoice.com/22459/%e2%80%9cright%e2%80%9d-convention-wrong-country/comment-page-1/#comment-126049 CStanley Sat, 06 Sep 2008 16:48:19 +0000 http://themoderatevoice.com/politics/republican-party/22459/%e2%80%9cright%e2%80%9d-convention-wrong-country/#comment-126049 But that's my point, chris- that's VERY standard rhetoric from both sides, and has been for years. If you'd like I can pick out all of the lines from the DNC speeches (and Biden on the stump yesterday) that are the exact mirror image of that line, with the only difference being that the GOP is demonized as the party that wants to abandon the middle class and poor, throw people out of their homes, and deprive them of healthcare. But that's my point, chris- that's VERY standard rhetoric from both sides, and has been for years. If you'd like I can pick out all of the lines from the DNC speeches (and Biden on the stump yesterday) that are the exact mirror image of that line, with the only difference being that the GOP is demonized as the party that wants to abandon the middle class and poor, throw people out of their homes, and deprive them of healthcare.

]]> By: ChrisWWW http://themoderatevoice.com/22459/%e2%80%9cright%e2%80%9d-convention-wrong-country/comment-page-1/#comment-126045 ChrisWWW Sat, 06 Sep 2008 16:39:25 +0000 http://themoderatevoice.com/politics/republican-party/22459/%e2%80%9cright%e2%80%9d-convention-wrong-country/#comment-126045 CStanley,<br>Romney's speech - which contained less vitriol than Rudy's - was a nonsensical rant against "liberals." He somehow managed to blame EVERYTHING that's happened in Washington during the last eight years on liberals. He said: "And we will never allow America to retreat in the face of evil extremism! "<br><br>The implication is clear. CStanley,
Romney's speech – which contained less vitriol than Rudy's – was a nonsensical rant against “liberals.” He somehow managed to blame EVERYTHING that's happened in Washington during the last eight years on liberals. He said: “And we will never allow America to retreat in the face of evil extremism! “

The implication is clear.

]]> By: CStanley http://themoderatevoice.com/22459/%e2%80%9cright%e2%80%9d-convention-wrong-country/comment-page-1/#comment-126044 CStanley Sat, 06 Sep 2008 16:33:12 +0000 http://themoderatevoice.com/politics/republican-party/22459/%e2%80%9cright%e2%80%9d-convention-wrong-country/#comment-126044 chris, I keep hearing everyone hyperventilating about Romney's speech and since I didn't hear it, I did as you suggested and just found the transcript of it. I still don't get it- what is in there besides the standard political rhetoric? For instance,, I see that he had a line about how the speakers at the DNC didn't talk about the threat to America from radical Islamists- how is that different from Biden going off about how the RNC speakers didn't talk about poverty in America, healthcare, etc? Or when the Dems repeatedly said that John McCain just doesn't get it? chris, I keep hearing everyone hyperventilating about Romney's speech and since I didn't hear it, I did as you suggested and just found the transcript of it. I still don't get it- what is in there besides the standard political rhetoric? For instance,, I see that he had a line about how the speakers at the DNC didn't talk about the threat to America from radical Islamists- how is that different from Biden going off about how the RNC speakers didn't talk about poverty in America, healthcare, etc? Or when the Dems repeatedly said that John McCain just doesn't get it?

]]> By: ChrisWWW http://themoderatevoice.com/22459/%e2%80%9cright%e2%80%9d-convention-wrong-country/comment-page-1/#comment-126040 ChrisWWW Sat, 06 Sep 2008 16:23:55 +0000 http://themoderatevoice.com/politics/republican-party/22459/%e2%80%9cright%e2%80%9d-convention-wrong-country/#comment-126040 CStanley,<br>Please go back and watch Romney's speech and then Rudy's speech. That "RNC" joke doesn't even come close to the despicable nonsense being spewed by those two "patriots." CStanley,
Please go back and watch Romney's speech and then Rudy's speech. That “RNC” joke doesn't even come close to the despicable nonsense being spewed by those two “patriots.”

]]> By: CStanley http://themoderatevoice.com/22459/%e2%80%9cright%e2%80%9d-convention-wrong-country/comment-page-1/#comment-126036 CStanley Sat, 06 Sep 2008 14:14:53 +0000 http://themoderatevoice.com/politics/republican-party/22459/%e2%80%9cright%e2%80%9d-convention-wrong-country/#comment-126036 For those who still claim 'the Republican party is mean, nasty, and divisive', try this on for size:<br><a href="http://williamamos.wordpress.com/2008/09/06/philadelphia-mayor-nutter-im-apalled-at-what-i-heard-at-the-repulsive-national-convention/">http://williamamos.wordpress.com/2008/09/06/phi...</a> For those who still claim 'the Republican party is mean, nasty, and divisive', try this on for size:
http://williamamos.wordpress.com/2008/09/06/phi…

]]> By: Ricorun http://themoderatevoice.com/22459/%e2%80%9cright%e2%80%9d-convention-wrong-country/comment-page-1/#comment-126035 Ricorun Fri, 05 Sep 2008 23:28:45 +0000 http://themoderatevoice.com/politics/republican-party/22459/%e2%80%9cright%e2%80%9d-convention-wrong-country/#comment-126035 CStanley: <i>making a joke about how people in San Francisco look down on people from small towns in rural USA is not demonizing San Francisco by anyone's standards outside of TMVille. It's called brushing off someone else's demonization (or condescension) with humor.</i><br><br>Ooooh, now I get it. But seriously... have you really thought that thought through?<br><br>(Boy, that was hard to type -- it was the keyboard equivalent of Peter Piper) CStanley: making a joke about how people in San Francisco look down on people from small towns in rural USA is not demonizing San Francisco by anyone's standards outside of TMVille. It's called brushing off someone else's demonization (or condescension) with humor.

Ooooh, now I get it. But seriously… have you really thought that thought through?

(Boy, that was hard to type — it was the keyboard equivalent of Peter Piper)

]]> By: CStanley http://themoderatevoice.com/22459/%e2%80%9cright%e2%80%9d-convention-wrong-country/comment-page-1/#comment-126031 CStanley Fri, 05 Sep 2008 23:06:25 +0000 http://themoderatevoice.com/politics/republican-party/22459/%e2%80%9cright%e2%80%9d-convention-wrong-country/#comment-126031 JSpencer: I didn't actually suggest that any comparison between the parties be done (my own opinion is that both would be lacking.) What I was saying is that I don't see Christianity as espousing any particular political ideology- Christians are to help those who are less fortunate, but how they see fit to do that can take many forms and many (or most) times that has nothing to do with government. JSpencer: I didn't actually suggest that any comparison between the parties be done (my own opinion is that both would be lacking.) What I was saying is that I don't see Christianity as espousing any particular political ideology- Christians are to help those who are less fortunate, but how they see fit to do that can take many forms and many (or most) times that has nothing to do with government.

]]> By: CStanley http://themoderatevoice.com/22459/%e2%80%9cright%e2%80%9d-convention-wrong-country/comment-page-1/#comment-126027 CStanley Fri, 05 Sep 2008 23:04:16 +0000 http://themoderatevoice.com/politics/republican-party/22459/%e2%80%9cright%e2%80%9d-convention-wrong-country/#comment-126027 pacatrue: making a joke about how people in San Francisco look down on people from small towns in rural USA is not demonizing San Francisco by anyone's standards outside of TMVille. It's called brushing off someone else's demonization (or condescension) with humor. pacatrue: making a joke about how people in San Francisco look down on people from small towns in rural USA is not demonizing San Francisco by anyone's standards outside of TMVille. It's called brushing off someone else's demonization (or condescension) with humor.

]]> By: JSpencer http://themoderatevoice.com/22459/%e2%80%9cright%e2%80%9d-convention-wrong-country/comment-page-1/#comment-126026 JSpencer Fri, 05 Sep 2008 22:49:33 +0000 http://themoderatevoice.com/politics/republican-party/22459/%e2%80%9cright%e2%80%9d-convention-wrong-country/#comment-126026 CStanley, I don't think you want to get into a discussion about the relative merits of political parties vis a vis christian behavior. Better let that one go. CStanley, I don't think you want to get into a discussion about the relative merits of political parties vis a vis christian behavior. Better let that one go.

]]> By: pacatrue http://themoderatevoice.com/22459/%e2%80%9cright%e2%80%9d-convention-wrong-country/comment-page-1/#comment-126021 pacatrue Fri, 05 Sep 2008 22:36:16 +0000 http://themoderatevoice.com/politics/republican-party/22459/%e2%80%9cright%e2%80%9d-convention-wrong-country/#comment-126021 I accept that both parties (to varying degrees that I'm not going to take the time to do an empirical study of) need to cool it. That said, I agree with the overall sentiment of the post. How many times does the Republican party need to demonize San Francisco, a very successful American city with the greater Bay Area driving much of the nation' technological advancement? It's attacking other Americans so that some Americans feel better about themselves. And, yes, I get equally upset when people from the North knock the South (I used to take David Shraub to task for this a lot) or people from urban areas knock rural ones (with people in urban areas often being Democrats), and even when people get all upset about evil corporate execs. I accept that both parties (to varying degrees that I'm not going to take the time to do an empirical study of) need to cool it. That said, I agree with the overall sentiment of the post. How many times does the Republican party need to demonize San Francisco, a very successful American city with the greater Bay Area driving much of the nation' technological advancement? It's attacking other Americans so that some Americans feel better about themselves. And, yes, I get equally upset when people from the North knock the South (I used to take David Shraub to task for this a lot) or people from urban areas knock rural ones (with people in urban areas often being Democrats), and even when people get all upset about evil corporate execs.

]]> By: D. E.Rodriguez http://themoderatevoice.com/22459/%e2%80%9cright%e2%80%9d-convention-wrong-country/comment-page-1/#comment-126016 D. E.Rodriguez Fri, 05 Sep 2008 22:35:21 +0000 http://themoderatevoice.com/politics/republican-party/22459/%e2%80%9cright%e2%80%9d-convention-wrong-country/#comment-126016 casualobserver says:<br><br>"DE Rodriguez.....read Shaun Mullen's and Michael Stickings posts for the last couple of weeks and report back with your apologies."<br><br>For your information, casualobserver, I have done my time in the military (have you?), so I don' take orders anymore. So, can you please, if you wish, summarize "Shaun Mullen's amd Michael Stickings posts" for me, and then I, not you, will decide if I will "report back with apologies."<br><br>Thank you casualobserver says:

“DE Rodriguez…..read Shaun Mullen's and Michael Stickings posts for the last couple of weeks and report back with your apologies.”

For your information, casualobserver, I have done my time in the military (have you?), so I don' take orders anymore. So, can you please, if you wish, summarize “Shaun Mullen's amd Michael Stickings posts” for me, and then I, not you, will decide if I will “report back with apologies.”

Thank you

]]> By: CStanley http://themoderatevoice.com/22459/%e2%80%9cright%e2%80%9d-convention-wrong-country/comment-page-1/#comment-126015 CStanley Fri, 05 Sep 2008 22:35:15 +0000 http://themoderatevoice.com/politics/republican-party/22459/%e2%80%9cright%e2%80%9d-convention-wrong-country/#comment-126015 My Bible doesn't mention allying oneself with government to help the poor, JSpencer, does yours?<br><br>Is there a lost gospel of Saul Alinsky that's been uncovered? My Bible doesn't mention allying oneself with government to help the poor, JSpencer, does yours?

Is there a lost gospel of Saul Alinsky that's been uncovered?

]]> By: CStanley http://themoderatevoice.com/22459/%e2%80%9cright%e2%80%9d-convention-wrong-country/comment-page-1/#comment-126010 CStanley Fri, 05 Sep 2008 22:33:45 +0000 http://themoderatevoice.com/politics/republican-party/22459/%e2%80%9cright%e2%80%9d-convention-wrong-country/#comment-126010 JSpencer- the chants were to drown out some idiot protesters.<br><br>Silhouette: apparently the irony is lost on you, that in a post criticizing the GOP for being divisive you repeatedly tell us all about the mythical "they" of the conservative side of the aisle. You do realize that "they" are just fellow Americans? You know, the ones that the Dems are all inclusive of? JSpencer- the chants were to drown out some idiot protesters.

Silhouette: apparently the irony is lost on you, that in a post criticizing the GOP for being divisive you repeatedly tell us all about the mythical “they” of the conservative side of the aisle. You do realize that “they” are just fellow Americans? You know, the ones that the Dems are all inclusive of?

]]> By: JSpencer http://themoderatevoice.com/22459/%e2%80%9cright%e2%80%9d-convention-wrong-country/comment-page-1/#comment-126008 JSpencer Fri, 05 Sep 2008 22:30:26 +0000 http://themoderatevoice.com/politics/republican-party/22459/%e2%80%9cright%e2%80%9d-convention-wrong-country/#comment-126008 Hey Sil, speaking of the bible, did you know that Jesus was a community organizer? Hey Sil, speaking of the bible, did you know that Jesus was a community organizer?

]]> By: CStanley http://themoderatevoice.com/22459/%e2%80%9cright%e2%80%9d-convention-wrong-country/comment-page-1/#comment-126007 CStanley Fri, 05 Sep 2008 22:29:52 +0000 http://themoderatevoice.com/politics/republican-party/22459/%e2%80%9cright%e2%80%9d-convention-wrong-country/#comment-126007 No, Chris, what I was saying yesterday is that the type of negative narrative that the Republicans tend to use comes across as more of a personal attack on the character of the opposing candidate, because the villain in the conservative narrative is government.<br><br>What you are describing that the Dems are currently doing is actually the exact same thing that I was ascribing as the usual GOP line- saying that govt is the enemy. They're doing it this time around because they're trying to run against an unpopular incumbent instead of against the actual opposing candidate.<br><br>But if you think I'm insulted by that or getting bent out of shape, I didn't mean it that way- I was just being sarcastic because D E made a point about the GOP that I feel was very apt in regard to the Democrats at their own convention this year. <br><br>I didn't see Romney but don't dispute your point there. However, Palin didn't demonize SF, she just made reference to Obama's tone deaf remarks at a fundraiser there (that's not to say that SF isn't the butt of a lot of conservative jokes- that just didn't happen to be one of them.) No, Chris, what I was saying yesterday is that the type of negative narrative that the Republicans tend to use comes across as more of a personal attack on the character of the opposing candidate, because the villain in the conservative narrative is government.

What you are describing that the Dems are currently doing is actually the exact same thing that I was ascribing as the usual GOP line- saying that govt is the enemy. They're doing it this time around because they're trying to run against an unpopular incumbent instead of against the actual opposing candidate.

But if you think I'm insulted by that or getting bent out of shape, I didn't mean it that way- I was just being sarcastic because D E made a point about the GOP that I feel was very apt in regard to the Democrats at their own convention this year.

I didn't see Romney but don't dispute your point there. However, Palin didn't demonize SF, she just made reference to Obama's tone deaf remarks at a fundraiser there (that's not to say that SF isn't the butt of a lot of conservative jokes- that just didn't happen to be one of them.)

]]> By: JSpencer http://themoderatevoice.com/22459/%e2%80%9cright%e2%80%9d-convention-wrong-country/comment-page-1/#comment-126005 JSpencer Fri, 05 Sep 2008 22:26:54 +0000 http://themoderatevoice.com/politics/republican-party/22459/%e2%80%9cright%e2%80%9d-convention-wrong-country/#comment-126005 What IS all that chanting USA USA USA stuff anyway? I mean we all KNOW this country belongs to all of us right? Isn't that just assumed? To me it's like the flag pin thingee and the other hyper patriotic themes the GOP latched onto - not to mention the militaristic themes. It's as though they are trying to suggest that one party is somehow more American than the other. I'll tell you, it may be a rallying theme for the GOP, but it gives the impression of division to many other Americans. Btw, military veteran groups have been sending more campaign donations to Obama then they have McCain. Did any of you know that? Maybe all those patriotic surface trappings aren't quite as convincing as they're intended to be. An old saying about actions vs. words comes to mind. What IS all that chanting USA USA USA stuff anyway? I mean we all KNOW this country belongs to all of us right? Isn't that just assumed? To me it's like the flag pin thingee and the other hyper patriotic themes the GOP latched onto – not to mention the militaristic themes. It's as though they are trying to suggest that one party is somehow more American than the other. I'll tell you, it may be a rallying theme for the GOP, but it gives the impression of division to many other Americans. Btw, military veteran groups have been sending more campaign donations to Obama then they have McCain. Did any of you know that? Maybe all those patriotic surface trappings aren't quite as convincing as they're intended to be. An old saying about actions vs. words comes to mind.

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