Oh, Those Silly, Frivolous Community Organizers!
Isn’t it time to say it? As noted here, I supported John McCain in 2000 and even today my own views on the war (unlike some who write here on TMV) are probably closer to his than to Barack Obama’s. When I vote, I take a deep breath and often surprise myself by my own vote on Election Day as I make one final calculation.
But I’m finding out in emails and conversations — and reading a host of web blogs — that not a few number of people were turned off like me by a characteristic of last night’s Republican convention: the sudden suggestion that community organizers are somehow subjects of derision who indulge in worthless activity.
Not since I worked as a stringer in the Newsweek Madrid news bureau in September 1975 and heard then Spanish dictator Gen. Francisco Franco warn about a vast masonic conspiracy (he died shortly after, most likely before he could warn of the Rotary Club and Elk conspiracy) has there been such a jarring definition of a group. (Franco actually had banned Freemasonry in 1940..)
It’s a theme that lingers from the convention. Perhaps it’s because as a journalist working on newspapers in Wichita, KS and San Diego, CA I interviewed MANY community organizers over the years. And despite their political views or group, I had great respect for the long hours they worked, the skills required to do what they needed to do effectively, their direct contact in working with people who couldn’t afford lobbyists, and their dedication to helping people when political parties and/or government failed or were shockingly deficient.
It’s no secret why suddenly here in 2008 — out of the blue — it’s now being implied that community organizers are silly, ineffectual people, wasting their time in thumb-twiddling activities that have no productive meaning or responsibilities:
It’s a way to turn an Obama positive into a negative by couching it in negative terms. That sends out the signal to supporters that it’s a negative and will be picked up by supporters, and repeated verbally and in writing. Turning a positive into a negative is a standard late 20th century political ploy perfected by Karl Rove, who is famous for it.
Forget your political affiliation for a second. Look at this diary on Daily Kos (sent to me by a reader) that recaps some of these people who wasted their time in such a trivial activity. It’s not about Democrats and Republicans but about who some of these people were.
It’s likely you know quite a few of them and respect them for what they did.
But respect for that kind of activity is suddenly out the window because it’s political season and our campaigns are increasingly about showing less and less respect in an effort to divide, define and rule.
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DLS, are you denying that rascism will be a factor in this election? If you believe that then you may as well be living on Mars.
DLS, are you denying that rascism will be a factor in this election? If you believe that then you may as well be living on Mars.
I can't wait to focus on Palin's ethics and policies, believe me.
I can't wait to focus on Palin's ethics and policies, believe me.
LOL Rudi and Jspencer. I expect to see more and more accusations of racism too between now and November, because so far that's exactly what happens every time Obama's polling numbers go down. There couldn't POSSIBLY be any other explanation, of course- there must be waves of racist sentiment that sweep the nation, or the dog whistles bring it out or something.
LOL Rudi and Jspencer. I expect to see more and more accusations of racism too between now and November, because so far that's exactly what happens every time Obama's polling numbers go down. There couldn't POSSIBLY be any other explanation, of course- there must be waves of racist sentiment that sweep the nation, or the dog whistles bring it out or something.
Obama didn't make up the “community organizer” label. The term has been around since the 1880s:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Community_organizing
And most of my community work/organizing has been in rural neighborhoods. But I do understand CStanley's point about the negative connotations. While I was a little bent yesterday about it, I just blew it off as politics as usual.
Austin Roth, who said that community organizer is code for “uppity negro”?? I want to read that. Because in my ENTIRE life of being black and working in the community, the last thing a black community organizer was called was “uppity negro”. In fact, the real “uppity negros” (three times for effect) didn't have nothing to do with us “inner city community folks”. We were looked down upon and pandered to in election cycles (and of course thrown away).
Obama didn't make up the “community organizer” label. The term has been around since the 1880s:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Community_organizing
And most of my community work/organizing has been in rural neighborhoods. But I do understand CStanley's point about the negative connotations. While I was a little bent yesterday about it, I just blew it off as politics as usual.
Austin Roth, who said that community organizer is code for “uppity negro”?? I want to read that. Because in my ENTIRE life of being black and working in the community, the last thing a black community organizer was called was “uppity negro”. In fact, the real “uppity negros” (three times for effect) didn't have nothing to do with us “inner city community folks”. We were looked down upon and pandered to in election cycles (and of course thrown away).
If there were waves of racist sentiment flowing across America, Senator Obama wouldn't have gotten this far. 'Nuff said.
While I feel there are people who just won't vote for Obama because he's black, this is HARDLY Jim Crow South days.
If there were waves of racist sentiment flowing across America, Senator Obama wouldn't have gotten this far. 'Nuff said.
While I feel there are people who just won't vote for Obama because he's black, this is HARDLY Jim Crow South days.
Jchem,
So far, it looks like this is what conservatives have got:
–A suggestion that managing a $12 million budget may not be sufficient qualification for the Presidency.
–An argument made by one-time Republican bogeyman Hillary Clinton.
Did I get it all?
Jchem,
So far, it looks like this is what conservatives have got:
–A suggestion that managing a $12 million budget may not be sufficient qualification for the Presidency.
–An argument made by one-time Republican bogeyman Hillary Clinton.
Did I get it all?
T-Steel- a commenter above made the reference to community organizer being a dog whistle racist comment.
T-Steel- a commenter above made the reference to community organizer being a dog whistle racist comment.
Right on time for the conversation about racist code words:
A conservative Southern Republican Congressman who supports John McCain has just called the Obamas “uppity”.
Right on time for the conversation about racist code words:
A conservative Southern Republican Congressman who supports John McCain has just called the Obamas “uppity”.
JSpencer,
I think that Politico piece was brilliant. I'm not referencing piling on with any of the issues mentioned in the article. It is the media's job to ask questions. But trying to attack someone for being a mayor of a small town or governor of a less populated state is just silly. We've got Bush, Romney, and Dukakis, to name a few, to thank for that.
George,
I'm not sure what Repubs got, but I do know that the whole “clinging” issue was big back during the primaries, and I suspect it to come back again. McCain has already used Hillary's words in one ad–how long will it be before he does it again? The fact is that Obama had trouble getting votes from working class people in small towns. I expect the Repubs to drive this point on now with Palin on the ticket whether or not you agree with it. You saw this last night during her speech. After all, it's what they usually do.
JSpencer,
I think that Politico piece was brilliant. I'm not referencing piling on with any of the issues mentioned in the article. It is the media's job to ask questions. But trying to attack someone for being a mayor of a small town or governor of a less populated state is just silly. We've got Bush, Romney, and Dukakis, to name a few, to thank for that.
George,
I'm not sure what Repubs got, but I do know that the whole “clinging” issue was big back during the primaries, and I suspect it to come back again. McCain has already used Hillary's words in one ad–how long will it be before he does it again? The fact is that Obama had trouble getting votes from working class people in small towns. I expect the Repubs to drive this point on now with Palin on the ticket whether or not you agree with it. You saw this last night during her speech. After all, it's what they usually do.
T-steel – I didn't mean to imply at all he made the term up, and thought I was clear on that. I made the point he applied that label to himself first. Again, thought I was pretty clear on that, too.
And the point, obviously, is how are we supposed to take seriously charges it is a code word to use against him if he himself uses the term to describe himself?
T-steel – I didn't mean to imply at all he made the term up, and thought I was clear on that. I made the point he applied that label to himself first. Again, thought I was pretty clear on that, too.
And the point, obviously, is how are we supposed to take seriously charges it is a code word to use against him if he himself uses the term to describe himself?
J. Spencer, do you ever review what you write before you post it these days? Does Palin's and the GOP's success this week really have you that agitated? [sigh]
J. Spencer, do you ever review what you write before you post it these days? Does Palin's and the GOP's success this week really have you that agitated? [sigh]
“who said that community organizer is code for “uppity negro”?? “
Among those who should know and behave better, one example is leftist talk show host Thom Hartmann. I heard him say this today — that criticism of Obama's being a community organizer in the past is racist. Again, someone like Hartmann (one of the better leftist talk-show hosts) should know better. But for whatever reasons he doesn't.
“who said that community organizer is code for “uppity negro”?? “
Among those who should know and behave better, one example is leftist talk show host Thom Hartmann. I heard him say this today — that criticism of Obama's being a community organizer in the past is racist. Again, someone like Hartmann (one of the better leftist talk-show hosts) should know better. But for whatever reasons he doesn't.
Jchem–
Saying Republicans will try to argue he's a basher is much different from him actually being a basher.
Republicans have ruled our country for eight years. During that time they have poorly managed two wars. Even though we were fighting two wars, they cut taxes. Even though they were cutting taxes, they still started up the largest entitlement program since the 60's, the Medicare drug benefit. To accomplish all this, they borrowed money (from, by the way, China, Russia and Saudi Arabia, among others) and have left someone else to cover the bills.
Eight years of Republican rule have been a disaster.
I think people in small-town America get that.
Jchem–
Saying Republicans will try to argue he's a basher is much different from him actually being a basher.
Republicans have ruled our country for eight years. During that time they have poorly managed two wars. Even though we were fighting two wars, they cut taxes. Even though they were cutting taxes, they still started up the largest entitlement program since the 60's, the Medicare drug benefit. To accomplish all this, they borrowed money (from, by the way, China, Russia and Saudi Arabia, among others) and have left someone else to cover the bills.
Eight years of Republican rule have been a disaster.
I think people in small-town America get that.
“Eight is enough” in Obama's speech, when referring to _Republicans_ (as opposed to the lame claim of “McSame” and Bush Continued) had weight.
The 2006 elections were not just about Bush and Iraq, but about the GOP in Congress. (Of course, part of this was that the GOP was acting Dem-like…)
“Eight is enough” in Obama's speech, when referring to _Republicans_ (as opposed to the lame claim of “McSame” and Bush Continued) had weight.
The 2006 elections were not just about Bush and Iraq, but about the GOP in Congress. (Of course, part of this was that the GOP was acting Dem-like…)
This comment thread went crazy here.
First: “Community organizer” is not a term of derision, and has nothing to do with “uppity negros”. It's something that requires a huge investment of time and very little personal gain, except helping the community and those who live in it.
Second: Yes, Palin was dissing community organizers — it's extremely obvious, and she did it in a snarky, condescending way. It was ugly. Of course, I doubt the problems she encountered as mayor or governor in any way resembled life on south side Chicago (ooo! those gang-bangers in Juneux sure are crazy! All two of them!), so maybe she doesn't realize how vital community planners are to the people they help.
Third: sure, maybe being a community planner was less experience than being a small town mayor. MAYBE. But it built a foundation for 8 years in state government and 4 in national government.
This comment thread went crazy here.
First: “Community organizer” is not a term of derision, and has nothing to do with “uppity negros”. It's something that requires a huge investment of time and very little personal gain, except helping the community and those who live in it.
Second: Yes, Palin was dissing community organizers — it's extremely obvious, and she did it in a snarky, condescending way. It was ugly. Of course, I doubt the problems she encountered as mayor or governor in any way resembled life on south side Chicago (ooo! those gang-bangers in Juneux sure are crazy! All two of them!), so maybe she doesn't realize how vital community planners are to the people they help.
Third: sure, maybe being a community planner was less experience than being a small town mayor. MAYBE. But it built a foundation for 8 years in state government and 4 in national government.
The real issue here is the depth to which the Palin-bashers have descended (complete with bogus racism charges) largely because her speech was good.
Obama-Biden remains on the ballot and in fact is still in the lead this week.
The real issue here is the depth to which the Palin-bashers have descended (complete with bogus racism charges) largely because her speech was good.
Obama-Biden remains on the ballot and in fact is still in the lead this week.
CStanley,
You do realize that Obama's community organizing was done THROUGH churches. I'm quite certain they would be considered evangelical, theologically (this wasn't TUCC). So your point actually applies to this instance.
CStanley,
You do realize that Obama's community organizing was done THROUGH churches. I'm quite certain they would be considered evangelical, theologically (this wasn't TUCC). So your point actually applies to this instance.
jwest,
You're confusing “community organizer” with precinct captain or machine pol. If you read “Dreams from my Father,” where Obama talks about exactly what community organizing is, it's stepping into the breach left by the broken political machine. If there is a political effect in Chcago, it's to CHALLENGE the city machine, not sustain it.
Note that it was Giuliani who ringed with such derision over it. Community organizers were his worst enemy because they called him out on things like police brutality. Of course, Giuliani figured that the GOP crowd would see it as “ghetto poverty pimps,” and not as people helping other people.
jwest,
You're confusing “community organizer” with precinct captain or machine pol. If you read “Dreams from my Father,” where Obama talks about exactly what community organizing is, it's stepping into the breach left by the broken political machine. If there is a political effect in Chcago, it's to CHALLENGE the city machine, not sustain it.
Note that it was Giuliani who ringed with such derision over it. Community organizers were his worst enemy because they called him out on things like police brutality. Of course, Giuliani figured that the GOP crowd would see it as “ghetto poverty pimps,” and not as people helping other people.
Yes, elrod, I do know that and thought about it as I was typing but couldn't figure out how to express the point exactly- I guess it's that there's a different connotation of liberal black churches among conservatives and liberals, and of conservative churches among conservatives and liberals, and each reaction is the flip side of the other. So I just don't see why any of the more liberal posters here would be surprised that a conservative's reaction to the ties between the liberal faith based community and government is often similar to the reaction that you guys have to the conservative faith based community being politically active.
Yes, elrod, I do know that and thought about it as I was typing but couldn't figure out how to express the point exactly- I guess it's that there's a different connotation of liberal black churches among conservatives and liberals, and of conservative churches among conservatives and liberals, and each reaction is the flip side of the other. So I just don't see why any of the more liberal posters here would be surprised that a conservative's reaction to the ties between the liberal faith based community and government is often similar to the reaction that you guys have to the conservative faith based community being politically active.
Like I said before, this is just another example of conservatives trying to redefine something as bad, even if they previously supported it.
Obama is good at giving speeches (so was Reagan) but somehow that's a bad sign for an Obama presidency.
Obama was a faith-based community organizer (the kind Bush praised in 2000) but now that's a bad thing, it would have been better had he been a power-abusing mayor.
Obama gets big crowds to show up for his speeches (he gets people who didn't care about politics to get involved, a great thing for representative democracy) but that's bad because they must just be mindless hero worshipers.
Obama came from a poor background and became a powerful US Senator and successful author, but somehow he's an elitist that doesn't understand the average American, unlike a guy who was born and then married into privilege and wealth.
Obama is a smart guy, who performed well in premiere American institutions of higher learning (like just about every president that came before him, Rep. or Dem.) but that must be bad because Americans want their leaders to be intellectually incurious people who get mediocre grades and finish at the bottom of their classes.
Need I go on?
Like I said before, this is just another example of conservatives trying to redefine something as bad, even if they previously supported it.
Obama is good at giving speeches (so was Reagan) but somehow that's a bad sign for an Obama presidency.
Obama was a faith-based community organizer (the kind Bush praised in 2000) but now that's a bad thing, it would have been better had he been a power-abusing mayor.
Obama gets big crowds to show up for his speeches (he gets people who didn't care about politics to get involved, a great thing for representative democracy) but that's bad because they must just be mindless hero worshipers.
Obama came from a poor background and became a powerful US Senator and successful author, but somehow he's an elitist that doesn't understand the average American, unlike a guy who was born and then married into privilege and wealth.
Obama is a smart guy, who performed well in premiere American institutions of higher learning (like just about every president that came before him, Rep. or Dem.) but that must be bad because Americans want their leaders to be intellectually incurious people who get mediocre grades and finish at the bottom of their classes.
Need I go on?
DLS : “J. Spencer, do you ever review what you write before you post it these days?”
Absolutely. I'm pretty careful about it because I believe in standing by what I say. Of course there will always be some folks who don't like what they read, some who don't understand what they read, and some who even respond without reading at all
but none of us is perfect eh?
DLS : “J. Spencer, do you ever review what you write before you post it these days?”
Absolutely. I'm pretty careful about it because I believe in standing by what I say. Of course there will always be some folks who don't like what they read, some who don't understand what they read, and some who even respond without reading at all
but none of us is perfect eh?
ChrisWWW : “Like I said before, this is just another example of conservatives trying to redefine something as bad, even if they previously supported it.”
Chris, it's a pattern they've returned to often in the past few elections, presumably because they know there is always a portion of the electorate who won't be savvy enough or have time enough to learn the difference between fact and fiction.
Elrod, you mentioned the book, “Dreams from my Father”. After reading this book, one realizes just how absurd and without foundation the comments of Giuliani and Palin were last night.
ChrisWWW : “Like I said before, this is just another example of conservatives trying to redefine something as bad, even if they previously supported it.”
Chris, it's a pattern they've returned to often in the past few elections, presumably because they know there is always a portion of the electorate who won't be savvy enough or have time enough to learn the difference between fact and fiction.
Elrod, you mentioned the book, “Dreams from my Father”. After reading this book, one realizes just how absurd and without foundation the comments of Giuliani and Palin were last night.
Obama's response:
“This is very curious,” Obama said. “So this is work I did [20] years ago. They haven't talked about the fact that I was a civil rights lawyer; they haven't talked about the fact that I taught constitutional law; they haven't talked about my work in the state legislature or in the United States Senate. They're talking about the three years of work that I did right out of college as if I'm making the leap from two or three years out of college into the presidency.
“So, look, I would argue that doing work in the community to try to create jobs, to bring people together, to rejuvenate communities that have fallen on hard times, to set up job training programs in areas that have been hard hit when the steel plants closed. That that's relevant only in understanding where I'm coming from, who I believe in, who I'm fighting for and why I'm in this race. And the question I have for them is that why would that kind of work be ridiculous? Who are they fighting for? What are they are advocating for? They think that the lives of those folks who are struggling each and every day, that working with them to try to improve their lives is somehow not relevant to the presidency?
“I think maybe that's the problem — that's part of why they're out of touch and they don't get it 'cause they haven't spent much time working on behalf of those folks.”
http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/archives/indiv…
Obama's response:
“This is very curious,” Obama said. “So this is work I did [20] years ago. They haven't talked about the fact that I was a civil rights lawyer; they haven't talked about the fact that I taught constitutional law; they haven't talked about my work in the state legislature or in the United States Senate. They're talking about the three years of work that I did right out of college as if I'm making the leap from two or three years out of college into the presidency.
“So, look, I would argue that doing work in the community to try to create jobs, to bring people together, to rejuvenate communities that have fallen on hard times, to set up job training programs in areas that have been hard hit when the steel plants closed. That that's relevant only in understanding where I'm coming from, who I believe in, who I'm fighting for and why I'm in this race. And the question I have for them is that why would that kind of work be ridiculous? Who are they fighting for? What are they are advocating for? They think that the lives of those folks who are struggling each and every day, that working with them to try to improve their lives is somehow not relevant to the presidency?
“I think maybe that's the problem — that's part of why they're out of touch and they don't get it 'cause they haven't spent much time working on behalf of those folks.”
http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/archives/indiv…