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	<title>Comments on: Iran&#8217;s Position Unchanged Despite Offered Incentives Package</title>
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		<title>By: ff11</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/20848/iran-says-no-to-incentives-package/comment-page-1/#comment-141954</link>
		<dc:creator>ff11</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 06 Jul 2008 14:45:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/politics/foreign/20848/iran-says-no-to-incentives-package/#comment-141954</guid>
		<description>Andy,&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Also, once Iran has halted enrichment, what sign of good faith does IT get that the US/EU won&#039;t simply drag out negotiations?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Andy,</p>
<p>Also, once Iran has halted enrichment, what sign of good faith does IT get that the US/EU won&#39;t simply drag out negotiations?</p>
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		<title>By: runasim</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/20848/iran-says-no-to-incentives-package/comment-page-1/#comment-141953</link>
		<dc:creator>runasim</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 06 Jul 2008 14:21:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/politics/foreign/20848/iran-says-no-to-incentives-package/#comment-141953</guid>
		<description>Andy,&lt;br&gt;You are  right for the EU about halting  during negotiations.&lt;br&gt;It was my understanding that the US wouldn&#039;t partcipate in negotiations until after halting. &lt;br&gt;Perhaps I&#039;m wrong.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Andy,<br />You are  right for the EU about halting  during negotiations.<br />It was my understanding that the US wouldn&#39;t partcipate in negotiations until after halting. <br />Perhaps I&#39;m wrong.</p>
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		<title>By: Andy</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/20848/iran-says-no-to-incentives-package/comment-page-1/#comment-141952</link>
		<dc:creator>Andy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 06 Jul 2008 05:23:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/politics/foreign/20848/iran-says-no-to-incentives-package/#comment-141952</guid>
		<description>f11,&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;No, the US/EU precondition is that Iran HALT it&#039;s enrichment activities during negotiation as a sign of good faith.  They wouldn&#039;t have to dismantle anything.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;The US/EU reasoning for this condition is to prevent Iran from simply dragging negotiations out until it had a fait accompli.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>f11,</p>
<p>No, the US/EU precondition is that Iran HALT it&#39;s enrichment activities during negotiation as a sign of good faith.  They wouldn&#39;t have to dismantle anything.</p>
<p>The US/EU reasoning for this condition is to prevent Iran from simply dragging negotiations out until it had a fait accompli.</p>
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		<title>By: runasim</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/20848/iran-says-no-to-incentives-package/comment-page-1/#comment-141951</link>
		<dc:creator>runasim</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 06 Jul 2008 02:58:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/politics/foreign/20848/iran-says-no-to-incentives-package/#comment-141951</guid>
		<description>There is a great deal of posturing going on, by both Bush and Iran.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;For Iran, an important element is gaining  recognition as a legitimate power and face-saving.   Also, I think they don&#039;t want to deal with the EU without US presence at the negotiations table.  It&#039;s a power play between the US and Iran, and the EU is just the messenger. &lt;br&gt; For Bush, it&#039;s also a matter of ego and face-saving.  He can&#039;t join the negotiations without preconditions without losing face, but that&#039;s what Iran wants, I think.&lt;br&gt;Stalemate.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;I&#039;m very nervous, particularly because I&#039;m not sure what Bush is capable of as a surrprise farewell gesture.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There is a great deal of posturing going on, by both Bush and Iran.</p>
<p>For Iran, an important element is gaining  recognition as a legitimate power and face-saving.   Also, I think they don&#39;t want to deal with the EU without US presence at the negotiations table.  It&#39;s a power play between the US and Iran, and the EU is just the messenger. <br /> For Bush, it&#39;s also a matter of ego and face-saving.  He can&#39;t join the negotiations without preconditions without losing face, but that&#39;s what Iran wants, I think.<br />Stalemate.</p>
<p>I&#39;m very nervous, particularly because I&#39;m not sure what Bush is capable of as a surrprise farewell gesture.</p>
<p>.</p>
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		<title>By: DLS</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/20848/iran-says-no-to-incentives-package/comment-page-1/#comment-141950</link>
		<dc:creator>DLS</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 05 Jul 2008 22:21:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/politics/foreign/20848/iran-says-no-to-incentives-package/#comment-141950</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m surprised at least some of the Usual Suspects haven&#039;t said they were afraid of a July 4 US attack on Iran, While America and Iran Slept.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#39;m surprised at least some of the Usual Suspects haven&#39;t said they were afraid of a July 4 US attack on Iran, While America and Iran Slept.</p>
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		<title>By: DLS</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/20848/iran-says-no-to-incentives-package/comment-page-1/#comment-141947</link>
		<dc:creator>DLS</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 05 Jul 2008 21:15:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/politics/foreign/20848/iran-says-no-to-incentives-package/#comment-141947</guid>
		<description>Who would expect or even hope the Iranians would say &quot;yes&quot;?&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Who would believe the Iranians if the Iranians said &quot;yes&quot;?&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;The Iranians are counting on Western weakness and misjudgment.  They&#039;re also likely stalling for time until after the US elections and a likely weaker-appearing new President Obama.  (This is cause for concern among intelligent Americans, but it remains to be seen what Obama and others with whom Obama would have to work in Washington would actually do.  So far Obama has indicated less than a truly loony approach to Iraq, even if the anti-war-and-US-success far lefties hate him for not planning a 100% removal and retreat and effective surrender -- and loud announcement of this and apology to the terrorists, too? -- on Day One of his new administration.)  &lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;The Iranians probably are also waiting and HOPE-ing (pun clearly intended) to get a better deal from a new USA and weaker West next year than they could get now, a deal that could even surpass North Korea&#039;s, while they would proceed anyway to continue working on nuclear weapons (and don&#039;t forget other WMDs in addition to their already-demonstrated ballistic missile activities).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Who would expect or even hope the Iranians would say &#8220;yes&#8221;?</p>
<p>Who would believe the Iranians if the Iranians said &#8220;yes&#8221;?</p>
<p>The Iranians are counting on Western weakness and misjudgment.  They&#39;re also likely stalling for time until after the US elections and a likely weaker-appearing new President Obama.  (This is cause for concern among intelligent Americans, but it remains to be seen what Obama and others with whom Obama would have to work in Washington would actually do.  So far Obama has indicated less than a truly loony approach to Iraq, even if the anti-war-and-US-success far lefties hate him for not planning a 100% removal and retreat and effective surrender &#8212; and loud announcement of this and apology to the terrorists, too? &#8212; on Day One of his new administration.)  </p>
<p>The Iranians probably are also waiting and HOPE-ing (pun clearly intended) to get a better deal from a new USA and weaker West next year than they could get now, a deal that could even surpass North Korea&#39;s, while they would proceed anyway to continue working on nuclear weapons (and don&#39;t forget other WMDs in addition to their already-demonstrated ballistic missile activities).</p>
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		<title>By: The &#8220;Moderate&#8221; Voice is threatened by US, Israel, not Iran [Karl]</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/20848/iran-says-no-to-incentives-package/comment-page-1/#comment-113226</link>
		<dc:creator>The &#8220;Moderate&#8221; Voice is threatened by US, Israel, not Iran [Karl]</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 05 Jul 2008 18:52:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/politics/foreign/20848/iran-says-no-to-incentives-package/#comment-113226</guid>
		<description>[...] &#8220;Moderate&#8221; (but reliably Lefty) Voice has a new post up from &#8220;Damozel&#8221; noting that Iran has rejected the latest truckload of carrots offered to get the Islamic [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] &#8220;Moderate&#8221; (but reliably Lefty) Voice has a new post up from &#8220;Damozel&#8221; noting that Iran has rejected the latest truckload of carrots offered to get the Islamic [...]</p>
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		<title>By: ff11</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/20848/iran-says-no-to-incentives-package/comment-page-1/#comment-141945</link>
		<dc:creator>ff11</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 05 Jul 2008 18:37:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/politics/foreign/20848/iran-says-no-to-incentives-package/#comment-141945</guid>
		<description>So let me get this straight.  All they have to do is to immediately and verifiably dismantle their own purification program, and in exchange they would get to START talks about POSSIBLE lifting of sanctions and they didn&#039;t jump at the opportunity?&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;I&#039;m shocked.  SHOCKED!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>So let me get this straight.  All they have to do is to immediately and verifiably dismantle their own purification program, and in exchange they would get to START talks about POSSIBLE lifting of sanctions and they didn&#39;t jump at the opportunity?</p>
<p>I&#39;m shocked.  SHOCKED!</p>
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		<title>By: Silhouette</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/20848/iran-says-no-to-incentives-package/comment-page-1/#comment-141944</link>
		<dc:creator>Silhouette</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 05 Jul 2008 18:07:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/politics/foreign/20848/iran-says-no-to-incentives-package/#comment-141944</guid>
		<description>Now I wonder...just wondering here...&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;GOP needs an October scare once it&#039;s played &quot;bird with the broken wing&quot; long enough to get easily-defeatable Obama formally nominated.  Check.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;We predicted it would be Iran...OK...on schedule...gearing up for just after the August Convention where they will formally trounce their feared opponent, Clinton, with the help of rightwing &quot;democrat&quot; Governor Ritter of Co presiding.....check...good...&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Now, we know that Dubya started a business with Salem Bin Laden (Osama&#039;s brother) and is friends with the Bin Ladens.  So we know there is a connection between American BigOil execs and Middle Eastern ones...check...&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;I wonder if, via the GOP&#039;s influence and some good old boy network they&#039;ve got going with their arab buddies, that they could pursuade Iranian officials to amp up threats of terror just in time to sway enough Middle-ground American voters to push McCain (BigOil-as-usual) to power?&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Hmmm...  &lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;If you think about it from a practical political standpoint, Iran has nothing to gain whatsoever by any funny business in this critical election time that would result in a McCain victory.  Yet strangely, with all their intelligence operatives in full mental sobriety, they&#039;re seeming to do just that.  Weird?&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;If I was in charge of Iran&#039;s welfare, my political card I&#039;d play would be to be as placid calm and complacent, within reason, to GOP provocative language and wait until the neophyte Obama takes the Oval Office to begin to throw my weight around.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;But then maybe they&#039;re afraid, like the GOP, that Clinton will come into the nomination and represent real and actual change vs the kind Obama espouses to beat back opponents to do as he pleases in the final lap around the track?  Maybe Iranian officials, but not necessarily their people, stand to gain by a McCain victory.  Or maybe, like that CIA operative of 20-something years who was fired for not doctoring his findings to reflect that Iran was mounting WOMDs, we are being fed a line of total BS hoping to scare us in McCain&#039;s direction?&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;All these possiblities.  I say: trust your instincts and go with the candidate who will actually bring our country back from the brink of destruction BigOil has placed us squarely in.  And no, her name isn&#039;t Obama.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Now I wonder&#8230;just wondering here&#8230;</p>
<p>GOP needs an October scare once it&#39;s played &#8220;bird with the broken wing&#8221; long enough to get easily-defeatable Obama formally nominated.  Check.</p>
<p>We predicted it would be Iran&#8230;OK&#8230;on schedule&#8230;gearing up for just after the August Convention where they will formally trounce their feared opponent, Clinton, with the help of rightwing &#8220;democrat&#8221; Governor Ritter of Co presiding&#8230;..check&#8230;good&#8230;</p>
<p>Now, we know that Dubya started a business with Salem Bin Laden (Osama&#39;s brother) and is friends with the Bin Ladens.  So we know there is a connection between American BigOil execs and Middle Eastern ones&#8230;check&#8230;</p>
<p>I wonder if, via the GOP&#39;s influence and some good old boy network they&#39;ve got going with their arab buddies, that they could pursuade Iranian officials to amp up threats of terror just in time to sway enough Middle-ground American voters to push McCain (BigOil-as-usual) to power?</p>
<p>Hmmm&#8230;  </p>
<p>If you think about it from a practical political standpoint, Iran has nothing to gain whatsoever by any funny business in this critical election time that would result in a McCain victory.  Yet strangely, with all their intelligence operatives in full mental sobriety, they&#39;re seeming to do just that.  Weird?</p>
<p>If I was in charge of Iran&#39;s welfare, my political card I&#39;d play would be to be as placid calm and complacent, within reason, to GOP provocative language and wait until the neophyte Obama takes the Oval Office to begin to throw my weight around.</p>
<p>But then maybe they&#39;re afraid, like the GOP, that Clinton will come into the nomination and represent real and actual change vs the kind Obama espouses to beat back opponents to do as he pleases in the final lap around the track?  Maybe Iranian officials, but not necessarily their people, stand to gain by a McCain victory.  Or maybe, like that CIA operative of 20-something years who was fired for not doctoring his findings to reflect that Iran was mounting WOMDs, we are being fed a line of total BS hoping to scare us in McCain&#39;s direction?</p>
<p>All these possiblities.  I say: trust your instincts and go with the candidate who will actually bring our country back from the brink of destruction BigOil has placed us squarely in.  And no, her name isn&#39;t Obama.</p>
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