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	<title>Comments on: The Old Guy vs. The Black Guy</title>
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		<title>By: elrod</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/19501/the-old-guy-vs-the-black-guy/comment-page-1/#comment-135367</link>
		<dc:creator>elrod</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 11 May 2008 04:30:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/at-tmv/newsweek-blogitics/19501/the-old-guy-vs-the-black-guy/#comment-135367</guid>
		<description>Barring any evidence that McCain is in bad health, his age should be irrelevant. Supreme Court justices serve into their high 80s. &lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;I have plenty of reasons to vote against John McCain - notably, the issues. But age is not one of them.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Barring any evidence that McCain is in bad health, his age should be irrelevant. Supreme Court justices serve into their high 80s. </p>
<p>I have plenty of reasons to vote against John McCain &#8211; notably, the issues. But age is not one of them.</p>
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		<title>By: GreenDreams</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/19501/the-old-guy-vs-the-black-guy/comment-page-1/#comment-135366</link>
		<dc:creator>GreenDreams</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 10 May 2008 19:56:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/at-tmv/newsweek-blogitics/19501/the-old-guy-vs-the-black-guy/#comment-135366</guid>
		<description>Voters may be just as inclined to use their own experience, though. Those young voters flocking to Obama for example; it&#039;s not discrimination or ugly evil for them to think &quot;McCain is older than grandpa, and I see him and his friends as old and retired and past their prime.&quot;&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Older voters, in polls, have more bias against older candidates than 30somethings or 40somethings. They (we) see the changes in our own razor sharp edge; can&#039;t pull up the name of that associate&#039;s wife like I used to; that sprain is taking so long to heal, etc. They know from personal experience that fit and lively though they are, there are undeniable effects on mind and body of advancing age.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Voters may be just as inclined to use their own experience, though. Those young voters flocking to Obama for example; it&#39;s not discrimination or ugly evil for them to think &#8220;McCain is older than grandpa, and I see him and his friends as old and retired and past their prime.&#8221;</p>
<p>Older voters, in polls, have more bias against older candidates than 30somethings or 40somethings. They (we) see the changes in our own razor sharp edge; can&#39;t pull up the name of that associate&#39;s wife like I used to; that sprain is taking so long to heal, etc. They know from personal experience that fit and lively though they are, there are undeniable effects on mind and body of advancing age.</p>
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		<title>By: CStanley</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/19501/the-old-guy-vs-the-black-guy/comment-page-1/#comment-135365</link>
		<dc:creator>CStanley</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 10 May 2008 18:05:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/at-tmv/newsweek-blogitics/19501/the-old-guy-vs-the-black-guy/#comment-135365</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;Well, if age matters, Obama is too young and inexperienced compared to McCain.&lt;/blockquote&gt;&lt;br&gt;LOL, a variant on Reagan&#039;s excellent retort during the debates &quot;I will not make my opponent&#039;s youth and inexperience an issue.&quot;&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Stockboy, I agree about reserving judgment. Frankly I wouldn&#039;t be surprised if McCain dumps a huge load of records on May 23, including vigorous mental health screenings, and then stands at the podium and says, &quot;Any questions?&quot; (staying to answer every last one, instead of complaining after eight questions ;-) )&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;It would be just his style, but we&#039;ll see. Meanwhile, any speculations are just hot air and attempts to smear by insinuation.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>Well, if age matters, Obama is too young and inexperienced compared to McCain.</p></blockquote>
<p>LOL, a variant on Reagan&#39;s excellent retort during the debates &#8220;I will not make my opponent&#39;s youth and inexperience an issue.&#8221;</p>
<p>Stockboy, I agree about reserving judgment. Frankly I wouldn&#39;t be surprised if McCain dumps a huge load of records on May 23, including vigorous mental health screenings, and then stands at the podium and says, &#8220;Any questions?&#8221; (staying to answer every last one, instead of complaining after eight questions <img src='http://themoderatevoice.com/wordpress-engine/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';-)' class='wp-smiley' />  )</p>
<p>It would be just his style, but we&#39;ll see. Meanwhile, any speculations are just hot air and attempts to smear by insinuation.</p>
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		<title>By: StockBoySF</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/19501/the-old-guy-vs-the-black-guy/comment-page-1/#comment-135364</link>
		<dc:creator>StockBoySF</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 10 May 2008 17:39:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/at-tmv/newsweek-blogitics/19501/the-old-guy-vs-the-black-guy/#comment-135364</guid>
		<description>As long as there is a reasonable expectation that McCain can perform the job as president, both mentally and physically, for the next four years then his health shouldn&#039;t be an issue.  In four years we get to reevaluate his health and determine if he can continue.  (The same is true of all candidates.)  &lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Having said that, being president is a demanding mental challenge and coupled with the impact of his decisions, the bar for being &quot;mentally fit&quot; should be higher than just being &quot;competent&quot;.  I would hope that the American people want a president who can exercise good judgement and be able to make sound decisions at 3 am.  Obviously the president has to take many considerations into factor when making decisions- whether during a crises or filling empty posts (I&#039;m tired of Bush&#039;s incompetent appointees screwing things up) which require a nimble mind.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;So I reserve any judgement about McCain&#039;s mental and physical health until a full release of his medical records, including a complete mental evaluation, is done.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As long as there is a reasonable expectation that McCain can perform the job as president, both mentally and physically, for the next four years then his health shouldn&#39;t be an issue.  In four years we get to reevaluate his health and determine if he can continue.  (The same is true of all candidates.)  </p>
<p>Having said that, being president is a demanding mental challenge and coupled with the impact of his decisions, the bar for being &#8220;mentally fit&#8221; should be higher than just being &#8220;competent&#8221;.  I would hope that the American people want a president who can exercise good judgement and be able to make sound decisions at 3 am.  Obviously the president has to take many considerations into factor when making decisions- whether during a crises or filling empty posts (I&#39;m tired of Bush&#39;s incompetent appointees screwing things up) which require a nimble mind.</p>
<p>So I reserve any judgement about McCain&#39;s mental and physical health until a full release of his medical records, including a complete mental evaluation, is done.</p>
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		<title>By: StockBoySF</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/19501/the-old-guy-vs-the-black-guy/comment-page-1/#comment-135363</link>
		<dc:creator>StockBoySF</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 10 May 2008 17:28:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/at-tmv/newsweek-blogitics/19501/the-old-guy-vs-the-black-guy/#comment-135363</guid>
		<description>&quot;Anything to bash McCain now that Obama looks likely to be the Dem nominee, right? Well, if age matters, Obama is too young and inexperienced compared to McCain.&quot;&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Well, if McCain has memory or other mental issues which prevent him from remembering or applying his experience to the decisions he makes as president then what good IS his experience?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Anything to bash McCain now that Obama looks likely to be the Dem nominee, right? Well, if age matters, Obama is too young and inexperienced compared to McCain.&#8221;</p>
<p>Well, if McCain has memory or other mental issues which prevent him from remembering or applying his experience to the decisions he makes as president then what good IS his experience?</p>
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		<title>By: DLS</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/19501/the-old-guy-vs-the-black-guy/comment-page-1/#comment-135362</link>
		<dc:creator>DLS</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 10 May 2008 17:19:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/at-tmv/newsweek-blogitics/19501/the-old-guy-vs-the-black-guy/#comment-135362</guid>
		<description>&quot;Many factors were fair game as to whether Hillary was qualified to be president, but not her gender.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Many factors are fair game as to whether Obama is qualified to be president, but not his race.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Age, however, is an entirely different matter when combined with McCain’s refusal to share his health records, and these factors demand to be discussed.&quot;&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Anything to bash McCain now that Obama looks likely to be the Dem nominee, right?  Well, if age matters, Obama is too young and inexperienced compared to McCain.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Many factors were fair game as to whether Hillary was qualified to be president, but not her gender.</p>
<p>Many factors are fair game as to whether Obama is qualified to be president, but not his race.</p>
<p>Age, however, is an entirely different matter when combined with McCain’s refusal to share his health records, and these factors demand to be discussed.&#8221;</p>
<p>Anything to bash McCain now that Obama looks likely to be the Dem nominee, right?  Well, if age matters, Obama is too young and inexperienced compared to McCain.</p>
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		<title>By: CStanley</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/19501/the-old-guy-vs-the-black-guy/comment-page-1/#comment-135360</link>
		<dc:creator>CStanley</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 10 May 2008 16:33:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/at-tmv/newsweek-blogitics/19501/the-old-guy-vs-the-black-guy/#comment-135360</guid>
		<description>Lit3bolt: The experts don&#039;t agree with your assessment of Reagan. One person who researched it and wrote an acclaimed book was David Shenk, and he had this to say:&lt;br&gt;&lt;blockquote&gt;Wallace, N.C.: Do you think that Ronald Reagan had Alzheimer&#039;s during his term as president? &lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;David Shenk: Everyone wants to know that about Reagan, understandably. The short answer is no -- he did not have diagnosable Alzheimer&#039;s in the White House. &lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Alzheimer&#039;s is a progressive disease that creeps up very very slowly, and it was certainly creeping up on him during the late years of his Presidency. He knew that better than anyone, and joked frequently in speeches and with his White House doctors. But it&#039;s clear from looking at the evidence that his memory troubles in the White House were much too slight to be considered Alzheimer&#039;s. &lt;br&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;&lt;br&gt;I don&#039;t disagree with your basic premise, that it could have been a possibility that memory lapses would have affected his judgment. I don&#039;t think it would be a bad idea for it to either be required or presumptively required (with pressure coming to bear from voters) for all presidents to be screened before and during the presidency- and with extra emphasis on older candidates as determined by the relative risk factors that the medical experts ascertain. We&#039;ve pretty much come to expect the reports on the president&#039;s annual physical, and perhaps it&#039;s time to consider having them get a mental fitness screening too.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Lit3bolt: The experts don&#39;t agree with your assessment of Reagan. One person who researched it and wrote an acclaimed book was David Shenk, and he had this to say:<br />
<blockquote>Wallace, N.C.: Do you think that Ronald Reagan had Alzheimer&#39;s during his term as president? </p>
<p>David Shenk: Everyone wants to know that about Reagan, understandably. The short answer is no &#8212; he did not have diagnosable Alzheimer&#39;s in the White House. </p>
<p>Alzheimer&#39;s is a progressive disease that creeps up very very slowly, and it was certainly creeping up on him during the late years of his Presidency. He knew that better than anyone, and joked frequently in speeches and with his White House doctors. But it&#39;s clear from looking at the evidence that his memory troubles in the White House were much too slight to be considered Alzheimer&#39;s. </p></blockquote>
<p>I don&#39;t disagree with your basic premise, that it could have been a possibility that memory lapses would have affected his judgment. I don&#39;t think it would be a bad idea for it to either be required or presumptively required (with pressure coming to bear from voters) for all presidents to be screened before and during the presidency- and with extra emphasis on older candidates as determined by the relative risk factors that the medical experts ascertain. We&#39;ve pretty much come to expect the reports on the president&#39;s annual physical, and perhaps it&#39;s time to consider having them get a mental fitness screening too.</p>
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		<title>By: runasim</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/19501/the-old-guy-vs-the-black-guy/comment-page-1/#comment-135357</link>
		<dc:creator>runasim</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 10 May 2008 16:12:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/at-tmv/newsweek-blogitics/19501/the-old-guy-vs-the-black-guy/#comment-135357</guid>
		<description>I think the Onion  has the most reasonble take on this.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Just reading some of he comments on TMV makes me realize that there is almost nothing that won&#039;t be spun (and I do mean) spun) out of control.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Language has no more meaning.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;What does &#039;fair game&#039; mean, for example?  That everythng about a candidate should be considered suspect until proven otherwise?&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Besdies, you can adopt any rules you want, and it&#039;s dead certian that every one of them will be broken.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think the Onion  has the most reasonble take on this.</p>
<p>Just reading some of he comments on TMV makes me realize that there is almost nothing that won&#39;t be spun (and I do mean) spun) out of control.</p>
<p>Language has no more meaning.</p>
<p>What does &#39;fair game&#39; mean, for example?  That everythng about a candidate should be considered suspect until proven otherwise?</p>
<p>Besdies, you can adopt any rules you want, and it&#39;s dead certian that every one of them will be broken.</p>
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		<title>By: Lit3Bolt</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/19501/the-old-guy-vs-the-black-guy/comment-page-1/#comment-135356</link>
		<dc:creator>Lit3Bolt</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 10 May 2008 16:08:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/at-tmv/newsweek-blogitics/19501/the-old-guy-vs-the-black-guy/#comment-135356</guid>
		<description>Ok, does nobody remember Reagan?  You just don&#039;t &quot;suddenly&quot; get diagnosed with Alzheimer&#039;s.  There&#039;s a prodrome of symptoms ranging from months to years, until it gets obvious even to family members that Granddaddy&#039;s or Grandmommy&#039;s memory is pretty bad.  People shouldn&#039;t be discrimnated on the mere basis of age, tis true, but we don&#039;t allow blind people to drive a car or allow deaf people to operate a 911 call center for valid reasons.  So if McCain is the president, I don&#039;t want him being controlled by neocon aides.  With Reagan, it got bad enough that he couldn&#039;t even lie effectively lie about the Iran-Contra affair.  It was unmentionable then, but the issue can and should be raised now.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ok, does nobody remember Reagan?  You just don&#39;t &#8220;suddenly&#8221; get diagnosed with Alzheimer&#39;s.  There&#39;s a prodrome of symptoms ranging from months to years, until it gets obvious even to family members that Granddaddy&#39;s or Grandmommy&#39;s memory is pretty bad.  People shouldn&#39;t be discrimnated on the mere basis of age, tis true, but we don&#39;t allow blind people to drive a car or allow deaf people to operate a 911 call center for valid reasons.  So if McCain is the president, I don&#39;t want him being controlled by neocon aides.  With Reagan, it got bad enough that he couldn&#39;t even lie effectively lie about the Iran-Contra affair.  It was unmentionable then, but the issue can and should be raised now.</p>
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		<title>By: CStanley</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/19501/the-old-guy-vs-the-black-guy/comment-page-1/#comment-135355</link>
		<dc:creator>CStanley</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 10 May 2008 15:37:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/at-tmv/newsweek-blogitics/19501/the-old-guy-vs-the-black-guy/#comment-135355</guid>
		<description>I think it&#039;s an interesting point but I really don&#039;t think those rules should apply. In my mind, the anti-discriminatory laws are to prevent an individual or small group of individuals from using illegitimate criteria based on bigotry to select an employee. In the case of voting, the effects of bigotry have to be assumed to be diluted by the number of people who are doing the selecting; I think that any voter who uses a discriminatory mindset to select a candidate is an ass, but I don&#039;t think it is possible for the law to speak to that. Unfortunately people have the right to be asses, and it&#039;s up to the rest of us to try to be the counterbalance to that.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think it&#39;s an interesting point but I really don&#39;t think those rules should apply. In my mind, the anti-discriminatory laws are to prevent an individual or small group of individuals from using illegitimate criteria based on bigotry to select an employee. In the case of voting, the effects of bigotry have to be assumed to be diluted by the number of people who are doing the selecting; I think that any voter who uses a discriminatory mindset to select a candidate is an ass, but I don&#39;t think it is possible for the law to speak to that. Unfortunately people have the right to be asses, and it&#39;s up to the rest of us to try to be the counterbalance to that.</p>
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		<title>By: pabel</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/19501/the-old-guy-vs-the-black-guy/comment-page-1/#comment-135354</link>
		<dc:creator>pabel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 10 May 2008 14:44:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/at-tmv/newsweek-blogitics/19501/the-old-guy-vs-the-black-guy/#comment-135354</guid>
		<description>Sidebar:  in the workplace, federal law prevents discrimination on the basis of race, gender, and (yes) age (40+, specifically).  Not that the workplace rules should be relevant to the search for a new president ... or should they?  I don&#039;t now.  (Not trying to pick a fight, Shaun -- just tossing this in for discussion, in case anyone cares to take it up.)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sidebar:  in the workplace, federal law prevents discrimination on the basis of race, gender, and (yes) age (40+, specifically).  Not that the workplace rules should be relevant to the search for a new president &#8230; or should they?  I don&#39;t now.  (Not trying to pick a fight, Shaun &#8212; just tossing this in for discussion, in case anyone cares to take it up.)</p>
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		<title>By: CStanley</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/19501/the-old-guy-vs-the-black-guy/comment-page-1/#comment-135353</link>
		<dc:creator>CStanley</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 10 May 2008 14:21:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/at-tmv/newsweek-blogitics/19501/the-old-guy-vs-the-black-guy/#comment-135353</guid>
		<description>Well, Shaun, I assume you can discuss the health factors in just a couple of weeks, as even the NYT smear piece which insinuated that McCain might be hiding his health records had to admit that he&#039;s going to release all of the records on May 23.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well, Shaun, I assume you can discuss the health factors in just a couple of weeks, as even the NYT smear piece which insinuated that McCain might be hiding his health records had to admit that he&#39;s going to release all of the records on May 23.</p>
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