Comments on: In Defense of Bush’s Gaffe on Rising Food Prices http://themoderatevoice.com/19461/in-defense-of-bushs-gaffe-on-rising-food-prices/ An Internet hub for moderates, centrists, and independents, with domestic and international news, analysis, original reporting, and popular features from the left, center, and right Mon, 23 Nov 2009 15:50:06 -0500 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.4 hourly 1 By: TomGrey http://themoderatevoice.com/19461/in-defense-of-bushs-gaffe-on-rising-food-prices/comment-page-1/#comment-148431 TomGrey Sat, 10 May 2008 02:49:13 +0000 http://themoderatevoice.com/science/environment/nature/19461/in-defense-of-bushs-gaffe-on-rising-food-prices/#comment-148431 The way to convince consumers to consume less is clear ... higher prices. But voters, neither in the US nor in states having food riots, are happy with higher food prices.<br><br>Farmers are often not so unhappy. Indian exported cashews are cheaper than Iranian pistachios in Slovakia. Both India and especially China are exporting tons of food. As well as importing it. The way to convince consumers to consume less is clear … higher prices. But voters, neither in the US nor in states having food riots, are happy with higher food prices.

Farmers are often not so unhappy. Indian exported cashews are cheaper than Iranian pistachios in Slovakia. Both India and especially China are exporting tons of food. As well as importing it.

]]> By: GreenDreams http://themoderatevoice.com/19461/in-defense-of-bushs-gaffe-on-rising-food-prices/comment-page-1/#comment-148430 GreenDreams Fri, 09 May 2008 18:22:30 +0000 http://themoderatevoice.com/science/environment/nature/19461/in-defense-of-bushs-gaffe-on-rising-food-prices/#comment-148430 Kinda sounds like Neocon just woke up to what many have known for many years, especially anyone who has followed the "earth is flat" discussions. Yes, we currently consume more than the earth can produce. If China consumed like we do, it would take 4 planet earths to keep up. We're in deep trouble with an unsustainable future, and WE above others, with our gluttonous hyper-consumption would be well advised to learn to live more sustainably. <br><br>But Neocon, being a hater of Bush haters hardly elevates you above them, eh? Kinda sounds like Neocon just woke up to what many have known for many years, especially anyone who has followed the “earth is flat” discussions. Yes, we currently consume more than the earth can produce. If China consumed like we do, it would take 4 planet earths to keep up. We're in deep trouble with an unsustainable future, and WE above others, with our gluttonous hyper-consumption would be well advised to learn to live more sustainably.

But Neocon, being a hater of Bush haters hardly elevates you above them, eh?

]]> By: CStanley http://themoderatevoice.com/19461/in-defense-of-bushs-gaffe-on-rising-food-prices/comment-page-1/#comment-148429 CStanley Fri, 09 May 2008 11:15:34 +0000 http://themoderatevoice.com/science/environment/nature/19461/in-defense-of-bushs-gaffe-on-rising-food-prices/#comment-148429 He didn't phrase it diplomatically (no surprise there) but he's not incorrect. In terms of the current price increases it doesn't matter that we use more food resources per capita and have more waste here- that's been the case for a long time. The change in the demand is due to rising populations and in particular, rising populations of people who can actually afford to eat. I don't think he meant to say that those people shouldn't eat- that that's a bad development instead of a good one. The point is that we need to find a way to handle the increased demand, and that it's important to understand that the market is responding to that demand which has increased without a concomitant increase in supply.<br><br>To be more clear, I'm not saying that it doesn't matter that we waste food here- that is something we should take stock of. I'm just saying that our waste hasn't changed, and it's not the cause of the current rise in food prices. If distribution can be worked out, it's possible that some changes in our own eating habits could help the global crisis. He didn't phrase it diplomatically (no surprise there) but he's not incorrect. In terms of the current price increases it doesn't matter that we use more food resources per capita and have more waste here- that's been the case for a long time. The change in the demand is due to rising populations and in particular, rising populations of people who can actually afford to eat. I don't think he meant to say that those people shouldn't eat- that that's a bad development instead of a good one. The point is that we need to find a way to handle the increased demand, and that it's important to understand that the market is responding to that demand which has increased without a concomitant increase in supply.

To be more clear, I'm not saying that it doesn't matter that we waste food here- that is something we should take stock of. I'm just saying that our waste hasn't changed, and it's not the cause of the current rise in food prices. If distribution can be worked out, it's possible that some changes in our own eating habits could help the global crisis.

]]> By: runasim http://themoderatevoice.com/19461/in-defense-of-bushs-gaffe-on-rising-food-prices/comment-page-1/#comment-148428 runasim Fri, 09 May 2008 07:41:58 +0000 http://themoderatevoice.com/science/environment/nature/19461/in-defense-of-bushs-gaffe-on-rising-food-prices/#comment-148428 I have to agree with Neocon about population growth being a problem in relation to food supplies. It's also a factor in water supplies and so much else.<br><br>There is one factor about population growth that is very uncomfortable to talk about, and that is the inecreasing life expectncies. Birth rates at one end, with technologies increasing survival rates among premies, and decreasing death rates at the other, with technologies prolonging life spans, makes population explosion inevitable.<br>I have no idea what that means in the larger scale of things, but it is a factor.<br><br>As far as the anger at Bush's speech goes. I don't see any reason to get excited over it. That's the way the US reacts to oher nations, and that's the way other nations react to the Us.<br>In the face of tension over food shortages, outbursts are to be expected. I have to agree with Neocon about population growth being a problem in relation to food supplies. It's also a factor in water supplies and so much else.

There is one factor about population growth that is very uncomfortable to talk about, and that is the inecreasing life expectncies. Birth rates at one end, with technologies increasing survival rates among premies, and decreasing death rates at the other, with technologies prolonging life spans, makes population explosion inevitable.
I have no idea what that means in the larger scale of things, but it is a factor.

As far as the anger at Bush's speech goes. I don't see any reason to get excited over it. That's the way the US reacts to oher nations, and that's the way other nations react to the Us.
In the face of tension over food shortages, outbursts are to be expected.

]]> By: Neocon http://themoderatevoice.com/19461/in-defense-of-bushs-gaffe-on-rising-food-prices/comment-page-1/#comment-148427 Neocon Fri, 09 May 2008 03:37:55 +0000 http://themoderatevoice.com/science/environment/nature/19461/in-defense-of-bushs-gaffe-on-rising-food-prices/#comment-148427 Well I know people can't wait for the next apparent gaffe by GWB to start punching him in the face but the fact of the matter is that India and China are the reasons that this world will be in chaos in the next 25 years.<br><br>These two nations suddenly woke up and two nations of close to 2 billion people suddenly WANT stuff. They want fuel. Oil. Gasoline. FOOD. <br><br>GWB pointed out the glaringly obvious. Anyone with a brain that is not full of delusional hate for anything Bush might say can only shake their head and agree with a politically unsensitive remark yet a true remark in all phases of its virtue.<br><br>Model studies suggest that the world is incapable with modern day technologies to support more then 8.56 billion people. China is already talking about lifting the restrictions on birthing to 2 children per family. That will double China's poplulation in roughly 18 years.<br><br>Currently we have roughly 6.808 Billion people in the world. In the next 25 years we will reach 8.56 billion people.<br><br>There are legitimate reasons why people are starting to riot over food. Well I know people can't wait for the next apparent gaffe by GWB to start punching him in the face but the fact of the matter is that India and China are the reasons that this world will be in chaos in the next 25 years.

These two nations suddenly woke up and two nations of close to 2 billion people suddenly WANT stuff. They want fuel. Oil. Gasoline. FOOD.

GWB pointed out the glaringly obvious. Anyone with a brain that is not full of delusional hate for anything Bush might say can only shake their head and agree with a politically unsensitive remark yet a true remark in all phases of its virtue.

Model studies suggest that the world is incapable with modern day technologies to support more then 8.56 billion people. China is already talking about lifting the restrictions on birthing to 2 children per family. That will double China's poplulation in roughly 18 years.

Currently we have roughly 6.808 Billion people in the world. In the next 25 years we will reach 8.56 billion people.

There are legitimate reasons why people are starting to riot over food.

]]> By: ChrisWWW http://themoderatevoice.com/19461/in-defense-of-bushs-gaffe-on-rising-food-prices/comment-page-1/#comment-148426 ChrisWWW Fri, 09 May 2008 02:39:18 +0000 http://themoderatevoice.com/science/environment/nature/19461/in-defense-of-bushs-gaffe-on-rising-food-prices/#comment-148426 That's definitely not a generous parsing of his words. Definitely not worth getting pissy over. That's definitely not a generous parsing of his words. Definitely not worth getting pissy over.

]]> By: Slamfu http://themoderatevoice.com/19461/in-defense-of-bushs-gaffe-on-rising-food-prices/comment-page-1/#comment-148425 Slamfu Fri, 09 May 2008 01:36:17 +0000 http://themoderatevoice.com/science/environment/nature/19461/in-defense-of-bushs-gaffe-on-rising-food-prices/#comment-148425 "Being well-informed or choosing words carefully are not his specialty. … Let’s be forgiving to the U.S. President. … Let us stop pointing fingers at one another and receive Bush’s remark with a pinch of salt and a hearty laugh."<br><br>Ouch. But totally true. Also, our middle class probably threw away more food last year than India's middle class ate. Unless TGI Friday's has started opening up in India. “Being well-informed or choosing words carefully are not his specialty. … Let’s be forgiving to the U.S. President. … Let us stop pointing fingers at one another and receive Bush’s remark with a pinch of salt and a hearty laugh.”

Ouch. But totally true. Also, our middle class probably threw away more food last year than India's middle class ate. Unless TGI Friday's has started opening up in India.

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