<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?><rss version="2.0"
	xmlns:content="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/content/"
	xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/"
	xmlns:atom="http://www.w3.org/2005/Atom"
	xmlns:sy="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/syndication/"
		>
<channel>
	<title>Comments on: Health Care: N.J. Democrats Straightjacket Themselves Over A Hospital Closing Crisis</title>
	<atom:link href="http://themoderatevoice.com/19080/health-care-nj-democrats-straightjacket-themselves-over-a-hospital-closing-crisis/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/19080/health-care-nj-democrats-straightjacket-themselves-over-a-hospital-closing-crisis/</link>
	<description>An Internet hub with domestic and international news, analysis, original reporting, and popular features from the left, center, indies, centrists, moderates, and right</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Wed, 15 Feb 2012 18:08:30 +0000</lastBuildDate>
	<sy:updatePeriod>hourly</sy:updatePeriod>
	<sy:updateFrequency>1</sy:updateFrequency>
	<generator>http://wordpress.org/?v=3.1.2</generator>
	<item>
		<title>By: GeorgeSorwell</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/19080/health-care-nj-democrats-straightjacket-themselves-over-a-hospital-closing-crisis/comment-page-1/#comment-141140</link>
		<dc:creator>GeorgeSorwell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Apr 2008 21:28:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/politics/state-politics/19080/health-care-nj-democrats-straightjacket-themselves-over-a-hospital-closing-crisis/#comment-141140</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;What people need to do is to learn that the government cannot supply everything and force political leaders to really determine what is the most cost beneficial and only fund those programs.&lt;/blockquote&gt;&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;That would be the sensible thing. &lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;But the popular thing is to cut taxes while increasing spending and while also loudly complaining that it&#039;s your political opponents who can&#039;t be trusted with the pocketbook.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>What people need to do is to learn that the government cannot supply everything and force political leaders to really determine what is the most cost beneficial and only fund those programs.</p></blockquote>
<p>That would be the sensible thing. </p>
<p>But the popular thing is to cut taxes while increasing spending and while also loudly complaining that it&#39;s your political opponents who can&#39;t be trusted with the pocketbook.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: superdestroyer</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/19080/health-care-nj-democrats-straightjacket-themselves-over-a-hospital-closing-crisis/comment-page-1/#comment-141139</link>
		<dc:creator>superdestroyer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Apr 2008 21:00:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/politics/state-politics/19080/health-care-nj-democrats-straightjacket-themselves-over-a-hospital-closing-crisis/#comment-141139</guid>
		<description>runasim, &lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;If government spending is prioritized  by what politicians can justify as programs that will pay for themselves like education, they will eventually being taxing everyone at 110%.  Politicians will always find ways to justify huge spending increases.  What people need to do is to learn that the government cannot supply everything and force political leaders to really determine what is the most cost beneficial and only fund those programs. &lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;A good example is that virtually every state government has a minority set aside program where certain minorities get contracts without being the lowest bidder.  A minority set aside program is a clear signal that government has more than enough money but choose to spend it in unwise ways.  Alternative schools is another example.  Instead of expelling disruptive, violent students, schools created programs to employ a huge number of teachers, social workers, and program coordinators. &lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Another problem is that politicians get more credit for starting new programs instead of trying to make existing programs work.  Thus, state and local governments increase spending by having multiple programs that do the same thing. &lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;I also wonder if in states like New Jersey, the state government is more of a jobs program and a delivery system for services.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>runasim, </p>
<p>If government spending is prioritized  by what politicians can justify as programs that will pay for themselves like education, they will eventually being taxing everyone at 110%.  Politicians will always find ways to justify huge spending increases.  What people need to do is to learn that the government cannot supply everything and force political leaders to really determine what is the most cost beneficial and only fund those programs. </p>
<p>A good example is that virtually every state government has a minority set aside program where certain minorities get contracts without being the lowest bidder.  A minority set aside program is a clear signal that government has more than enough money but choose to spend it in unwise ways.  Alternative schools is another example.  Instead of expelling disruptive, violent students, schools created programs to employ a huge number of teachers, social workers, and program coordinators. </p>
<p>Another problem is that politicians get more credit for starting new programs instead of trying to make existing programs work.  Thus, state and local governments increase spending by having multiple programs that do the same thing. </p>
<p>I also wonder if in states like New Jersey, the state government is more of a jobs program and a delivery system for services.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: runasim</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/19080/health-care-nj-democrats-straightjacket-themselves-over-a-hospital-closing-crisis/comment-page-1/#comment-141136</link>
		<dc:creator>runasim</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Apr 2008 19:17:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/politics/state-politics/19080/health-care-nj-democrats-straightjacket-themselves-over-a-hospital-closing-crisis/#comment-141136</guid>
		<description>SD -&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;I don&#039;t think you can analyze fiscal matters with simplistic formulas.&lt;br&gt;There is wasteful spending and wise spending.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Part of spending is investment in the future.  Just like you can&#039;t make money in the stock market without investing in it, you can&#039;t create a healthy economy without investing in it.  That means investing in education to provide  the necessary personnel (scientists, doctors, etc.), in infrastucture to make business possible, and in health care to make sure  we have a healthy, productive work force. &lt;br&gt;It makes not sense to talk about spending as if  it was all one thing.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;When we incur a cost, however, we have to face  paying  -the bill.  It&#039;s no use hiding the cost of the war in supplementals and deferrals.  The cost is real and so should be  paying the  bill.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;The same fs true for taxes.  &lt;br&gt;A landlord needs to collect enough revenues to cover the costs of owning and operating a building. .    How much he should charge as rent  depends on  his costs and the profit factor.  The profit margin can be varied, but the cost can not.  Repairs cost what they cost.  &lt;br&gt;The landlord can not lower rents &#039;on principle&#039; , he has to be reality based.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Cutting  taxes, similarly, makes no sense, if  the cuts are not reality based.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;What we need, therefore is a wise balance, not abstract formulas that have no &lt;br&gt;bearing on conditions as we find them.   &quot;Taxing&#039; and &quot;spending&#039;  are just empty words and meaningless political slogans,  unless you are disussing a specific case in a specific circumstnace.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>SD -</p>
<p>I don&#39;t think you can analyze fiscal matters with simplistic formulas.<br />There is wasteful spending and wise spending.</p>
<p>Part of spending is investment in the future.  Just like you can&#39;t make money in the stock market without investing in it, you can&#39;t create a healthy economy without investing in it.  That means investing in education to provide  the necessary personnel (scientists, doctors, etc.), in infrastucture to make business possible, and in health care to make sure  we have a healthy, productive work force. <br />It makes not sense to talk about spending as if  it was all one thing.</p>
<p>When we incur a cost, however, we have to face  paying  -the bill.  It&#39;s no use hiding the cost of the war in supplementals and deferrals.  The cost is real and so should be  paying the  bill.</p>
<p>The same fs true for taxes.  <br />A landlord needs to collect enough revenues to cover the costs of owning and operating a building. .    How much he should charge as rent  depends on  his costs and the profit factor.  The profit margin can be varied, but the cost can not.  Repairs cost what they cost.  <br />The landlord can not lower rents &#39;on principle&#39; , he has to be reality based.</p>
<p>Cutting  taxes, similarly, makes no sense, if  the cuts are not reality based.</p>
<p>What we need, therefore is a wise balance, not abstract formulas that have no <br />bearing on conditions as we find them.   &#8220;Taxing&#39; and &#8220;spending&#39;  are just empty words and meaningless political slogans,  unless you are disussing a specific case in a specific circumstnace.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: runasim</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/19080/health-care-nj-democrats-straightjacket-themselves-over-a-hospital-closing-crisis/comment-page-1/#comment-141135</link>
		<dc:creator>runasim</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Apr 2008 18:42:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/politics/state-politics/19080/health-care-nj-democrats-straightjacket-themselves-over-a-hospital-closing-crisis/#comment-141135</guid>
		<description>NJ is a mess.&lt;br&gt;Corizine is trying to make people face up to realities, but they beat him up for his efforts.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Just one factor.   Towns and townships insist on having their own fire and police departments, creating duplication of overhead costs many times over.&lt;br&gt;Real estate taxes are sky high, but  no one wants to give up their wasteful ;rights; to justify lowering them.   They want the state to cover their red ink, instead.  no matter what causes the ink to be red.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Closing hispitals is just  the beginning of NJ&#039;s looming troubles.  .</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>NJ is a mess.<br />Corizine is trying to make people face up to realities, but they beat him up for his efforts.</p>
<p>Just one factor.   Towns and townships insist on having their own fire and police departments, creating duplication of overhead costs many times over.<br />Real estate taxes are sky high, but  no one wants to give up their wasteful ;rights; to justify lowering them.   They want the state to cover their red ink, instead.  no matter what causes the ink to be red.</p>
<p>Closing hispitals is just  the beginning of NJ&#39;s looming troubles.  .</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: superdestroyer</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/19080/health-care-nj-democrats-straightjacket-themselves-over-a-hospital-closing-crisis/comment-page-1/#comment-141133</link>
		<dc:creator>superdestroyer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Apr 2008 17:50:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/politics/state-politics/19080/health-care-nj-democrats-straightjacket-themselves-over-a-hospital-closing-crisis/#comment-141133</guid>
		<description>GeorgeSorwell  , &lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Yes, The Republicans have been fiscally irresponsible but that is why they will soon be irrelevant to politics in the U.S.  The country really only needs one big spending political party. &lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;However, the Democratic party keeps selling increased spending as a good thing because others (read rich whites) will be the one really paying the taxes.  Then when taxes do go up people get made at the Democrats.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>GeorgeSorwell  , </p>
<p>Yes, The Republicans have been fiscally irresponsible but that is why they will soon be irrelevant to politics in the U.S.  The country really only needs one big spending political party. </p>
<p>However, the Democratic party keeps selling increased spending as a good thing because others (read rich whites) will be the one really paying the taxes.  Then when taxes do go up people get made at the Democrats.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: DLS</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/19080/health-care-nj-democrats-straightjacket-themselves-over-a-hospital-closing-crisis/comment-page-1/#comment-141130</link>
		<dc:creator>DLS</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Apr 2008 17:24:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/politics/state-politics/19080/health-care-nj-democrats-straightjacket-themselves-over-a-hospital-closing-crisis/#comment-141130</guid>
		<description>There is no &quot;crisis&quot; [sic; leftist BS].  Grow up, please.  Thanks in advance.  There is merely dysfunctionality, in this case compounded by government idiocy.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;* * *&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;&quot;People demand low taxes. At the same time, people demand an increasing number of government-paid services.&quot;&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Please be aware that it&#039;s almost never the same &quot;people&quot; doing both at once.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;This is nothing new.  I saw it in California (where I grew up) before I left years ago and it&#039;s not surprising it&#039;s happening in New Jersey (and in less-populous areas such as, say, Maine north of Augusta).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There is no &#8220;crisis&#8221; [sic; leftist BS].  Grow up, please.  Thanks in advance.  There is merely dysfunctionality, in this case compounded by government idiocy.</p>
<p>* * *</p>
<p>&#8220;People demand low taxes. At the same time, people demand an increasing number of government-paid services.&#8221;</p>
<p>Please be aware that it&#39;s almost never the same &#8220;people&#8221; doing both at once.</p>
<p>This is nothing new.  I saw it in California (where I grew up) before I left years ago and it&#39;s not surprising it&#39;s happening in New Jersey (and in less-populous areas such as, say, Maine north of Augusta).</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: GeorgeSorwell</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/19080/health-care-nj-democrats-straightjacket-themselves-over-a-hospital-closing-crisis/comment-page-1/#comment-141129</link>
		<dc:creator>GeorgeSorwell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Apr 2008 15:49:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/politics/state-politics/19080/health-care-nj-democrats-straightjacket-themselves-over-a-hospital-closing-crisis/#comment-141129</guid>
		<description>Superdestroyer--&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Where am I saying that only tax increases can fix the healthcare problem? &lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;My complaint is that Republicans cut taxes (very popular) while also increasing spending (also very popular).  If Republicans were actually cutting spending while cutting taxes, they&#039;d be fiscally responsible. Instead, they are the complete opposite--fiscally irresponsible. &lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;You know what else is popular? Blaming vague unnamed entrenched special interests.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Superdestroyer&#8211;</p>
<p>Where am I saying that only tax increases can fix the healthcare problem? </p>
<p>My complaint is that Republicans cut taxes (very popular) while also increasing spending (also very popular).  If Republicans were actually cutting spending while cutting taxes, they&#39;d be fiscally responsible. Instead, they are the complete opposite&#8211;fiscally irresponsible. </p>
<p>You know what else is popular? Blaming vague unnamed entrenched special interests.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: superdestroyer</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/19080/health-care-nj-democrats-straightjacket-themselves-over-a-hospital-closing-crisis/comment-page-1/#comment-141127</link>
		<dc:creator>superdestroyer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Apr 2008 15:04:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/politics/state-politics/19080/health-care-nj-democrats-straightjacket-themselves-over-a-hospital-closing-crisis/#comment-141127</guid>
		<description>georgeSorwell, &lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;To take the position that only tax increases can fix the healthcare problem, you are operating under the premise that every government program in New Jersey is more important that helping health care.  I propose that government should look through their own programs first and find additional funds.  However, the special interest are probably too entrench to give up unnecessary programs to give more funds for healthcare.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>georgeSorwell, </p>
<p>To take the position that only tax increases can fix the healthcare problem, you are operating under the premise that every government program in New Jersey is more important that helping health care.  I propose that government should look through their own programs first and find additional funds.  However, the special interest are probably too entrench to give up unnecessary programs to give more funds for healthcare.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: GeorgeSorwell</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/19080/health-care-nj-democrats-straightjacket-themselves-over-a-hospital-closing-crisis/comment-page-1/#comment-141124</link>
		<dc:creator>GeorgeSorwell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Apr 2008 14:35:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/politics/state-politics/19080/health-care-nj-democrats-straightjacket-themselves-over-a-hospital-closing-crisis/#comment-141124</guid>
		<description>I never thought I&#039;d say this, but Superdestroyer has a good point: Programs have to be paid for, somehow. &lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;People demand low taxes. At the same time, people demand an increasing number of government-paid services. &lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Something has to give. &lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;I&#039;m no expert in New Jersey politics or policy. But I do know that at the national level, there&#039;s a party that cuts taxes while at the same time running an endless war and creating the biggest entitlement program since Medicare. &lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Maybe Corzine is just facing reality.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I never thought I&#39;d say this, but Superdestroyer has a good point: Programs have to be paid for, somehow. </p>
<p>People demand low taxes. At the same time, people demand an increasing number of government-paid services. </p>
<p>Something has to give. </p>
<p>I&#39;m no expert in New Jersey politics or policy. But I do know that at the national level, there&#39;s a party that cuts taxes while at the same time running an endless war and creating the biggest entitlement program since Medicare. </p>
<p>Maybe Corzine is just facing reality.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: superdestroyer</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/19080/health-care-nj-democrats-straightjacket-themselves-over-a-hospital-closing-crisis/comment-page-1/#comment-141123</link>
		<dc:creator>superdestroyer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Apr 2008 12:12:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/politics/state-politics/19080/health-care-nj-democrats-straightjacket-themselves-over-a-hospital-closing-crisis/#comment-141123</guid>
		<description>There are 74 hospitals in New Jersey.  How many are not-for-profit and how many are for profit?  Does the 74 count mental health facilities, limited cardiac care facilities, or just places that have emergency rooms?&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;What percentage of the nurses, physicians, and other medical professional in New Jersey work at for-profit companies that have share holders. &lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;If you are going to make a claim for a huge new tax increase instead of moving funds from other state programs, at least you could fact check your own editorial.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There are 74 hospitals in New Jersey.  How many are not-for-profit and how many are for profit?  Does the 74 count mental health facilities, limited cardiac care facilities, or just places that have emergency rooms?</p>
<p>What percentage of the nurses, physicians, and other medical professional in New Jersey work at for-profit companies that have share holders. </p>
<p>If you are going to make a claim for a huge new tax increase instead of moving funds from other state programs, at least you could fact check your own editorial.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
</channel>
</rss>

