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Fair treatment, when did women ever receive fair treatment? You've come a long way baby, yea right! The media has been brutal on Hillary, at everyturn, starting with Chris Matthews
Clicking on the link to the WaPo piece it seems that there are names and hospitals and a real incident.
But I'd like to throw in a couple thoughts….
First, Hillary was relating an anecdote told to her by a Deputy Sheriff. I don't believe it is up to each candidate to independently verify every story that they may use on the campaign trail, as long as there is no reason to doubt that story adn the source seemed reasonably reputable (and this was from a Deputy Sheriff). Now if names were named and if Hillary were going to use those names… then yes, she would have verified more of the details. But she didn't name anyone/any hospital and because the source of the story was reputable then she should feel free to use the story as it was told to her.
Second, the story Hillary told was illustrative of the problems with the healthcare system. I think if politicians tell a story that gets their point across (and does not mislead or misrepresent the underlying issue) then that's fine. The problem Hillary brought up is very real and that is what she was getting across and that's what Americans need to understand (the problems).
I don't have a problem with Hillary (or any politician) telling these sorts of stories- as long as the represent the underlying issues clearly and accurately.
The whole reporting on this seems to be horrible and sloppy and I hope the rest of the press doesn't waste its time on it. Hillary didn't lie, didn't misrepresent anything and was trying to expeditiously get a point across about a true issue… that's exactly what I'd like to see in a candidate…
I hope I never hear anything more about this issue ever again… it's just such a non-issue and distraction of what the real issues are. It also shows that some reporters don't have any judgement and should have their reporter cards taken away and given a “F” on their report cards.
In the meantime, I'd like to know more about McCain's 'gaffes” misstatements, etc. And what about his public financing in the primary- what's the latest on that? And there were questions about whether he was actually considered a natural American citizen and whether he could be president…. anything new on that? It's a real concern and if the Republicans can bash Obama because of his middle name, then I don't see why we can't explore whether McCain can or can not be President for a very real constitutional issue. By the way, I've seen how Bush and his Repub. cronies have subverted the US Constitution to get what they want… and the press giving them a free pass. I'd hate to think that the press continues to give that free pass to McCain… I'm not saying that McCain can't be prez because he was born in Panama, rather I'd like to see more coverage and true discussion on this vital topic.
So yeah, the media is being unfair to Hillary on this hospital story, especially compared with lower hanging and juicier fruit out there.
Its times like this that make me glad I didn't follow my dream into journalism. If I even start to read a story about Hillary's campaign problems, my eyes start glazing over. I wish the election were over already.
I think Clinton was very unfairly labelled a liar. She heard a story from a source she trusted and repeated it. That's not lying.
But I don't agree that it was OK for her to use the story over and over again as part of her stump speech as she did. Yes, she didn't use the woman's name, and the story is illustrative of real problems in the health system, but without her own campaign verifying the details (which hospital(s) were involved? Did the woman have insurance or did she not?) and without getting permission directly from the woman's family, she left herself open for this mess.
If this story had been framed as a hypothetical, or if Clinton had talked about stats, that's one thing. But taking a specific story and talking about it with crucial details left out because the campaign apparently didn't even know these details was foolish. It takes a human tragedy and drops it to the level of an urban legend.
A single source told his version, which he later had to backtrack and correct on the record, then more sources came forward with conflicting details — and the Clinton campaign was left flatfooted because they didn't do the minimum: ask to speak to the family, ask for their permission to either name the woman or use her story anonymously — still risking identification — and, most importantly, getting the details right.
Clinton has been ill-served by many people in the media. We're seeing some damn lazy pack journalism here. But compare this to the way some conservative bloggers and “citizen journalists” went nuts over the boy who advocated for S-CHIP a few months ago. The boy was named, his family stood behind him, and the Democrats knew all the details of his story. Now what would have happened if some member of the party had given a radio speech based on what they had heard of that boy's story from another source, and a similar furor broke out from people who refused to believe this was possible? The core issue would have been lost in squabbling and accusations of bias and lies, and an important story would be forever branded in many citizen's eyes as a fable.
Now the story of this woman is being fleshed out and verified, but it should have been backed up behind the scenes, at the very least, in the first place. How many potential voters are still going to be aware of this story as “another Clinton lie” (which it isn't)? And of course lazy and vicious journalists bear the vast majority of the responsibility for this mess. But Clinton's campaign was sloppy to share the story without being better prepared. If the story was important enough to be used repeatedly in a stump speech, it was important enough to be checked out by them before using it.
And the Bosnia story? That is plainly a bald faced lie. Pure, unadulterated fantasy.
Let's not split hairs about this person. It is a direct statement about her ability to be C-in-C.
This victim thing she has going is really unseemly and, again a statement about her ability to be president and C-in-C. I can see it now – “oooo, those nasty Ruskies, they're aren't playing nice”. Or “the Chinese are really being unfair to us by beating our economy up”.
It's simple competency that is at issue. The story as oft repeated by Sen. Clinton was an entire narrative. Someone after hearing it from the deputy took the time to think it out, and write it down, and Sen. Clinton took the time to rehearse her telling of it before rolling it out in her stump speech. But no one ever bothered to make sure it was true – took the time for due diligence on a story that is central to a plank in her campaign, health care.
That is the problem, and has been since her inevitability meme fell apart on Feb. 5. Her campaign since then has been a slow-motion train wreck. All drama all the time, with everything including the kitchen sink thrown in, or at, the voting public.
To paraphrase a James Carville quote from '92, “it's the competency, stupid!”
Fair treatment, when did women ever receive fair treatment? You've come a long way baby, yea right! The media has been brutal on Hillary, at everyturn, starting with
Chris Matthews
Clicking on the link to the WaPo piece it seems that there are names and hospitals and a real incident.
But I'd like to throw in a couple thoughts….
First, Hillary was relating an anecdote told to her by a Deputy Sheriff. I don't believe it is up to each candidate to independently verify every story that they may use on the campaign trail, as long as there is no reason to doubt that story adn the source seemed reasonably reputable (and this was from a Deputy Sheriff). Now if names were named and if Hillary were going to use those names… then yes, she would have verified more of the details. But she didn't name anyone/any hospital and because the source of the story was reputable then she should feel free to use the story as it was told to her.
Second, the story Hillary told was illustrative of the problems with the healthcare system. I think if politicians tell a story that gets their point across (and does not mislead or misrepresent the underlying issue) then that's fine. The problem Hillary brought up is very real and that is what she was getting across and that's what Americans need to understand (the problems).
I don't have a problem with Hillary (or any politician) telling these sorts of stories- as long as the represent the underlying issues clearly and accurately.
The whole reporting on this seems to be horrible and sloppy and I hope the rest of the press doesn't waste its time on it. Hillary didn't lie, didn't misrepresent anything and was trying to expeditiously get a point across about a true issue… that's exactly what I'd like to see in a candidate…
I hope I never hear anything more about this issue ever again… it's just such a non-issue and distraction of what the real issues are. It also shows that some reporters don't have any judgement and should have their reporter cards taken away and given a “F” on their report cards.
In the meantime, I'd like to know more about McCain's 'gaffes” misstatements, etc. And what about his public financing in the primary- what's the latest on that? And there were questions about whether he was actually considered a natural American citizen and whether he could be president…. anything new on that? It's a real concern and if the Republicans can bash Obama because of his middle name, then I don't see why we can't explore whether McCain can or can not be President for a very real constitutional issue. By the way, I've seen how Bush and his Repub. cronies have subverted the US Constitution to get what they want… and the press giving them a free pass. I'd hate to think that the press continues to give that free pass to McCain… I'm not saying that McCain can't be prez because he was born in Panama, rather I'd like to see more coverage and true discussion on this vital topic.
So yeah, the media is being unfair to Hillary on this hospital story, especially compared with lower hanging and juicier fruit out there.
This isn't an anti-Hillary issue. This is what happens to all politicians. It just so happens that it's Hillary this time.
Its times like this that make me glad I didn't follow my dream into journalism. If I even start to read a story about Hillary's campaign problems, my eyes start glazing over. I wish the election were over already.
I get very tired of HRC always being a victim. I don't think it reflects well on women in general, and a presidential candidate in particular.
I personally don't think victimhood is the right place for anyone, any time.
This isn't an anti-Hillary issue. This is what happens to all politicians. It just so happens that it's Hillary this time.
Bulls**t!!!
The media has three standards,
A republican standard: As long as you aren't caught with a dead girl or live boy in your bed all is OK. (see Vitter scandal)
A democratic standard: Don't ever get caught with your hand in the cookie jar cause if it is, your career is over. (see Spitzer scandal)
A Clinton/Gore standard:Don't ever have your hand seen anywhere near a cookie jar.
I think Clinton was very unfairly labelled a liar. She heard a story from a source she trusted and repeated it. That's not lying.
But I don't agree that it was OK for her to use the story over and over again as part of her stump speech as she did. Yes, she didn't use the woman's name, and the story is illustrative of real problems in the health system, but without her own campaign verifying the details (which hospital(s) were involved? Did the woman have insurance or did she not?) and without getting permission directly from the woman's family, she left herself open for this mess.
If this story had been framed as a hypothetical, or if Clinton had talked about stats, that's one thing. But taking a specific story and talking about it with crucial details left out because the campaign apparently didn't even know these details was foolish. It takes a human tragedy and drops it to the level of an urban legend.
A single source told his version, which he later had to backtrack and correct on the record, then more sources came forward with conflicting details — and the Clinton campaign was left flatfooted because they didn't do the minimum: ask to speak to the family, ask for their permission to either name the woman or use her story anonymously — still risking identification — and, most importantly, getting the details right.
Clinton has been ill-served by many people in the media. We're seeing some damn lazy pack journalism here. But compare this to the way some conservative bloggers and “citizen journalists” went nuts over the boy who advocated for S-CHIP a few months ago. The boy was named, his family stood behind him, and the Democrats knew all the details of his story. Now what would have happened if some member of the party had given a radio speech based on what they had heard of that boy's story from another source, and a similar furor broke out from people who refused to believe this was possible? The core issue would have been lost in squabbling and accusations of bias and lies, and an important story would be forever branded in many citizen's eyes as a fable.
Now the story of this woman is being fleshed out and verified, but it should have been backed up behind the scenes, at the very least, in the first place. How many potential voters are still going to be aware of this story as “another Clinton lie” (which it isn't)? And of course lazy and vicious journalists bear the vast majority of the responsibility for this mess. But Clinton's campaign was sloppy to share the story without being better prepared. If the story was important enough to be used repeatedly in a stump speech, it was important enough to be checked out by them before using it.
And the Bosnia story? That is plainly a bald faced lie. Pure, unadulterated fantasy.
Let's not split hairs about this person. It is a direct statement about her ability to be C-in-C.
This victim thing she has going is really unseemly and, again a statement about her ability to be president and C-in-C. I can see it now – “oooo, those nasty Ruskies, they're aren't playing nice”. Or “the Chinese are really being unfair to us by beating our economy up”.
Get over the victimhood!
It's simple competency that is at issue. The story as oft repeated by Sen. Clinton was an entire narrative. Someone after hearing it from the deputy took the time to think it out, and write it down, and Sen. Clinton took the time to rehearse her telling of it before rolling it out in her stump speech. But no one ever bothered to make sure it was true – took the time for due diligence on a story that is central to a plank in her campaign, health care.
That is the problem, and has been since her inevitability meme fell apart on Feb. 5. Her campaign since then has been a slow-motion train wreck. All drama all the time, with everything including the kitchen sink thrown in, or at, the voting public.
To paraphrase a James Carville quote from '92, “it's the competency, stupid!”