Comments on: (Update 4) John McCain, D.C. Lobbyists & Fixating On the Bun, Not the Burger http://themoderatevoice.com/17951/fixating-on-the-bun-not-the-burger/ An Internet hub with domestic and international news, analysis, original reporting, and popular features from the left, center, indies, centrists, moderates, and right Wed, 15 Feb 2012 08:05:44 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.1.2 By: DLS http://themoderatevoice.com/17951/fixating-on-the-bun-not-the-burger/comment-page-1/#comment-130772 DLS Fri, 22 Feb 2008 23:19:49 +0000 http://themoderatevoice.com/media/newspapers/the-new-york-times/17951/fixating-on-the-bun-not-the-burger/#comment-130772 McCain hasn't taken money from HMOs like Health Net, has he?<br><br>Not only is Health Net being sued by LA for rescissions, but an arbitrator has just ordered Health Net to pay millions to someone who was subject to this after she developed cancer.<br><br><a href="http://www.calendarlive.com/media/acrobat/2008-02/35955051.pdf">http://www.calendarlive.com/media/acrobat/2008-...</a><br><br><a href="http://www.latimes.com/business/la-fi-insure23feb23%2C1%2C5039339.story">http://www.latimes.com/business/la-fi-insure23f...</a> McCain hasn't taken money from HMOs like Health Net, has he?

Not only is Health Net being sued by LA for rescissions, but an arbitrator has just ordered Health Net to pay millions to someone who was subject to this after she developed cancer.

http://www.calendarlive.com/media/acrobat/2008-…

http://www.latimes.com/business/la-fi-insure23f…

]]> By: Andy http://themoderatevoice.com/17951/fixating-on-the-bun-not-the-burger/comment-page-1/#comment-130770 Andy Fri, 22 Feb 2008 19:28:22 +0000 http://themoderatevoice.com/media/newspapers/the-new-york-times/17951/fixating-on-the-bun-not-the-burger/#comment-130770 Shaun,<br><br>Can you see the irony here?<br><br><blockquote>McCain denies the allegations and innuendos made in The Times story, of course, but it’s unclear what he is denying because of an intentional lack of specificity on his part.</blockquote> Shaun,

Can you see the irony here?

McCain denies the allegations and innuendos made in The Times story, of course, but it’s unclear what he is denying because of an intentional lack of specificity on his part.

]]> By: shaun http://themoderatevoice.com/17951/fixating-on-the-bun-not-the-burger/comment-page-1/#comment-130769 shaun Fri, 22 Feb 2008 18:51:52 +0000 http://themoderatevoice.com/media/newspapers/the-new-york-times/17951/fixating-on-the-bun-not-the-burger/#comment-130769 Addendum:<br><br>While it is off my focus, which is old-fashioned lying through one's teeth and ethical breaches, I was asked by a commenter at my own blog if I thought that McCain and lobbyist Vickie Iseman had . . . you know what.<br><br>I do. Addendum:

While it is off my focus, which is old-fashioned lying through one's teeth and ethical breaches, I was asked by a commenter at my own blog if I thought that McCain and lobbyist Vickie Iseman had . . . you know what.

I do.

]]> By: GeorgeSorwell http://themoderatevoice.com/17951/fixating-on-the-bun-not-the-burger/comment-page-1/#comment-130768 GeorgeSorwell Fri, 22 Feb 2008 18:31:49 +0000 http://themoderatevoice.com/media/newspapers/the-new-york-times/17951/fixating-on-the-bun-not-the-burger/#comment-130768 I think McCain may be subject a certain amount of drip, drip, drip on ethics. He was popular with the press, so maybe he didn't get enough scrutiny. <br><br>At any rate, I'm looking forward to March 22. I think McCain may be subject a certain amount of drip, drip, drip on ethics. He was popular with the press, so maybe he didn't get enough scrutiny.

At any rate, I'm looking forward to March 22.

]]> By: Andy http://themoderatevoice.com/17951/fixating-on-the-bun-not-the-burger/comment-page-1/#comment-130766 Andy Fri, 22 Feb 2008 18:22:01 +0000 http://themoderatevoice.com/media/newspapers/the-new-york-times/17951/fixating-on-the-bun-not-the-burger/#comment-130766 Shaun,<br><br>No apology is necessary no matter what happens, though I'm happy to see what transpires over the next month. Given the months the Times has already spent on this article I doubt much more will be forthcoming. Shaun,

No apology is necessary no matter what happens, though I'm happy to see what transpires over the next month. Given the months the Times has already spent on this article I doubt much more will be forthcoming.

]]> By: shaun http://themoderatevoice.com/17951/fixating-on-the-bun-not-the-burger/comment-page-1/#comment-130765 shaun Fri, 22 Feb 2008 18:11:36 +0000 http://themoderatevoice.com/media/newspapers/the-new-york-times/17951/fixating-on-the-bun-not-the-burger/#comment-130765 Brainster:<br><br>You are invited to get together with Andy and I (see my previous comment) on March 22. Brainster:

You are invited to get together with Andy and I (see my previous comment) on March 22.

]]> By: DLS http://themoderatevoice.com/17951/fixating-on-the-bun-not-the-burger/comment-page-1/#comment-130764 DLS Fri, 22 Feb 2008 17:57:31 +0000 http://themoderatevoice.com/media/newspapers/the-new-york-times/17951/fixating-on-the-bun-not-the-burger/#comment-130764 "I am more concerned with McCain's leveraging of public campaign financing as collateral for him to get a private loan for his campaign."<br><br>Yes, this is a real issue, unlike the Times's smearing of McCain after endorsing him. In fact, this potentially could shut down McCain's campaign.<br><br>"The nation's top federal election official told Sen. John McCain [Thursday, February 21] that he cannot immediately withdraw from the presidential public financing system as he had requested, a decision that threatens to dramatically restrict his spending until the general election campaign begins in the fall. ..."<br><br><a href="http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/02/21/AR2008022103141.html?hpid=topnews">http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/ar...</a> “I am more concerned with McCain's leveraging of public campaign financing as collateral for him to get a private loan for his campaign.”

Yes, this is a real issue, unlike the Times's smearing of McCain after endorsing him. In fact, this potentially could shut down McCain's campaign.

“The nation's top federal election official told Sen. John McCain [Thursday, February 21] that he cannot immediately withdraw from the presidential public financing system as he had requested, a decision that threatens to dramatically restrict his spending until the general election campaign begins in the fall. …”

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/ar…

]]> By: Brainster http://themoderatevoice.com/17951/fixating-on-the-bun-not-the-burger/comment-page-1/#comment-130763 Brainster Fri, 22 Feb 2008 17:53:42 +0000 http://themoderatevoice.com/media/newspapers/the-new-york-times/17951/fixating-on-the-bun-not-the-burger/#comment-130763 Well, when the bun is a juicy sex scandal for which no evidence exists, and the burger appears to be largely a rehashing of the Keating Five scandal, it's hard to see what else we should be focusing on. And the attempt to tie this together with Stolen Honor is risible; Stolen Honor was not about the Swift Boat Veterans allegations about Kerry. It was a film about POWs and how they were harmed by John Kerry's fabricated testimony to the Senate Foreign Relations Committee. But please, try to tie this stuff together, because it will backfire nicely, just as the Times story has caused the conservative blogs to circle the wagons. Well, when the bun is a juicy sex scandal for which no evidence exists, and the burger appears to be largely a rehashing of the Keating Five scandal, it's hard to see what else we should be focusing on. And the attempt to tie this together with Stolen Honor is risible; Stolen Honor was not about the Swift Boat Veterans allegations about Kerry. It was a film about POWs and how they were harmed by John Kerry's fabricated testimony to the Senate Foreign Relations Committee. But please, try to tie this stuff together, because it will backfire nicely, just as the Times story has caused the conservative blogs to circle the wagons.

]]> By: DLS http://themoderatevoice.com/17951/fixating-on-the-bun-not-the-burger/comment-page-1/#comment-130762 DLS Fri, 22 Feb 2008 17:52:02 +0000 http://themoderatevoice.com/media/newspapers/the-new-york-times/17951/fixating-on-the-bun-not-the-burger/#comment-130762 "Bun, not the burger" describes the Obama campaign, I hope you realize. “Bun, not the burger” describes the Obama campaign, I hope you realize.

]]> By: shaun http://themoderatevoice.com/17951/fixating-on-the-bun-not-the-burger/comment-page-1/#comment-130761 shaun Fri, 22 Feb 2008 15:53:47 +0000 http://themoderatevoice.com/media/newspapers/the-new-york-times/17951/fixating-on-the-bun-not-the-burger/#comment-130761 Andy:<br><br>Fair enough.<br><br>The Keating Five scandal is "cuddling up" at its cuddliest. Based on what we know from an imperfect Times story and what already is coming out as a consequence of that imperfect story, it appears that McCain not only broke his post-Keating Five vow but in doing so did pretty much the same thing again.<br><br>Tell you what: Let's see what the next month brings and revisit this on March 22. One of the cats has just entered a note into my Blackberry. <br><br> We should have a pretty good idea of who's who in this zoo and can recap all of the denials McCain has had to make as further details drip drip drip out. If this turns out to have been much ado about nothing, I owe you an apology. if this turns out to be much more -- and my gut tells me it will -- then you owe me nothing other than continuing to visit The Moderate Voice.<br><br>Deal? Andy:

Fair enough.

The Keating Five scandal is “cuddling up” at its cuddliest. Based on what we know from an imperfect Times story and what already is coming out as a consequence of that imperfect story, it appears that McCain not only broke his post-Keating Five vow but in doing so did pretty much the same thing again.

Tell you what: Let's see what the next month brings and revisit this on March 22. One of the cats has just entered a note into my Blackberry.

We should have a pretty good idea of who's who in this zoo and can recap all of the denials McCain has had to make as further details drip drip drip out. If this turns out to have been much ado about nothing, I owe you an apology. if this turns out to be much more — and my gut tells me it will — then you owe me nothing other than continuing to visit The Moderate Voice.

Deal?

]]> By: lurxst http://themoderatevoice.com/17951/fixating-on-the-bun-not-the-burger/comment-page-1/#comment-130760 lurxst Fri, 22 Feb 2008 15:24:06 +0000 http://themoderatevoice.com/media/newspapers/the-new-york-times/17951/fixating-on-the-bun-not-the-burger/#comment-130760 I am more concerned with McCain's leveraging of public campaign financing as collateral for him to get a private loan for his campaign. As much as the NYT piece appears fishy, this maneuver is clear case of unethical behavior on his part. As a taxpayer and contributor to the presedential campaign fund, I am appalled that he is being allowed to do this without the FEC slamming him.<br><br>Even worse is watching him make his appeal/challenge to Obama to commit to public campaign fianancing, which the broadcast media delivers unflinchingly without even a reference to his shady money deals. I am more concerned with McCain's leveraging of public campaign financing as collateral for him to get a private loan for his campaign. As much as the NYT piece appears fishy, this maneuver is clear case of unethical behavior on his part. As a taxpayer and contributor to the presedential campaign fund, I am appalled that he is being allowed to do this without the FEC slamming him.

Even worse is watching him make his appeal/challenge to Obama to commit to public campaign fianancing, which the broadcast media delivers unflinchingly without even a reference to his shady money deals.

]]> By: Andy http://themoderatevoice.com/17951/fixating-on-the-bun-not-the-burger/comment-page-1/#comment-130759 Andy Fri, 22 Feb 2008 15:22:48 +0000 http://themoderatevoice.com/media/newspapers/the-new-york-times/17951/fixating-on-the-bun-not-the-burger/#comment-130759 Well, Shaun, one does not serve in Congress for any period of time without getting to know some lobbyists. And define "cuddle up" please. Neither you nor the times can seem to generate anything more than the innuendo of impropriety on McCain's lobbyist relations. If that minimal level of non-evidence is all that's required to cast aspersions, then I hope you're equally critical of the other senators in this race on that regard.<br><br>Frankly, with your journalism background I find it hard to understand how you can defend an article that's based on two anonymous and disgruntled sources. Is the result of using disgruntled anonymous sources not obvious? Combined with a complete lack of any substantive evidence on the allegations how can anyone not view this reporting skeptically? Well, Shaun, one does not serve in Congress for any period of time without getting to know some lobbyists. And define “cuddle up” please. Neither you nor the times can seem to generate anything more than the innuendo of impropriety on McCain's lobbyist relations. If that minimal level of non-evidence is all that's required to cast aspersions, then I hope you're equally critical of the other senators in this race on that regard.

Frankly, with your journalism background I find it hard to understand how you can defend an article that's based on two anonymous and disgruntled sources. Is the result of using disgruntled anonymous sources not obvious? Combined with a complete lack of any substantive evidence on the allegations how can anyone not view this reporting skeptically?

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