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	<title>Comments on: A Big Bowl of Symbolism Just Won&#8217;t Do It</title>
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		<title>By: Slamfu</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/17441/a-big-bowl-of-symbolism-just-wont-do-it/comment-page-1/#comment-149167</link>
		<dc:creator>Slamfu</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Jan 2008 22:18:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/at-tmv/newsweek-blogitics/17441/a-big-bowl-of-symbolism-just-wont-do-it/#comment-149167</guid>
		<description>Whenever I hear someone mention that a candidate hasn&#039;t outlined how they would deal with problems I wonder if thats even possible?  For one I think Obama answers questions far more thoroughly than any other candidate.  But I guess what I&#039;m wondering is what kind of answer do you expect?   How does Obama not state what he&#039;s planning and another candidate has?   And can you give me an example?  &lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Basically candidates get these monumental questions like how do you plan to fix healthcare, control the budget, and keep recession at bay.   Questions that would essentially require a doctoral thesis worth of explanation just to identify and communicate the causes, let alone the solutions.  And they are expected to respond to this question with a nice 15 or 30 second sound bite that wraps it up.   I say any meaningful answer to these questions is outside the scope of debates or interviews.  But Obama consistently comes the closest in my opinion.   &lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Basically can someone show me what you mean by &quot;putting meat on the bones&quot; of a response to critical issues.   Who does it successfully and what makes a satisfactory arguement as opposed to the fluff Obama is said to lay out there.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Whenever I hear someone mention that a candidate hasn&#39;t outlined how they would deal with problems I wonder if thats even possible?  For one I think Obama answers questions far more thoroughly than any other candidate.  But I guess what I&#39;m wondering is what kind of answer do you expect?   How does Obama not state what he&#39;s planning and another candidate has?   And can you give me an example?  </p>
<p>Basically candidates get these monumental questions like how do you plan to fix healthcare, control the budget, and keep recession at bay.   Questions that would essentially require a doctoral thesis worth of explanation just to identify and communicate the causes, let alone the solutions.  And they are expected to respond to this question with a nice 15 or 30 second sound bite that wraps it up.   I say any meaningful answer to these questions is outside the scope of debates or interviews.  But Obama consistently comes the closest in my opinion.   </p>
<p>Basically can someone show me what you mean by &#8220;putting meat on the bones&#8221; of a response to critical issues.   Who does it successfully and what makes a satisfactory arguement as opposed to the fluff Obama is said to lay out there.</p>
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		<title>By: Fred Thompson &#187; A Big Bowl of Symbolism Just Won’t Do It</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/17441/a-big-bowl-of-symbolism-just-wont-do-it/comment-page-1/#comment-110343</link>
		<dc:creator>Fred Thompson &#187; A Big Bowl of Symbolism Just Won’t Do It</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Jan 2008 19:02:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/at-tmv/newsweek-blogitics/17441/a-big-bowl-of-symbolism-just-wont-do-it/#comment-110343</guid>
		<description>[...] The Moderate Voice - Domestic and international news analysis, irreverent comments, original reporti... wrote an interesting post today on A Big Bowl of Symbolism Just Won&#226;??t Do ItHere&#8217;s a quick excerpt I was all fired up to write a deep-thinking post on Barack Obama’s continuing indifference (or inability) to put meat on the bones of his otherwise captivating hope-and-change mantra after Daniel Larison cited this terrific quote from Joshua Foa Dienstag, an deep thinker whose specialty is the study of pessimism, which certainly would seem to be a growth industry in America: “Since, unlike the present, tomorrow is always imaginary, such idolatry can be manipulated in many ways. On the one h [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] The Moderate Voice &#8211; Domestic and international news analysis, irreverent comments, original reporti&#8230; wrote an interesting post today on A Big Bowl of Symbolism Just Won&acirc;??t Do ItHere&#8217;s a quick excerpt I was all fired up to write a deep-thinking post on Barack Obama’s continuing indifference (or inability) to put meat on the bones of his otherwise captivating hope-and-change mantra after Daniel Larison cited this terrific quote from Joshua Foa Dienstag, an deep thinker whose specialty is the study of pessimism, which certainly would seem to be a growth industry in America: “Since, unlike the present, tomorrow is always imaginary, such idolatry can be manipulated in many ways. On the one h [...]</p>
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		<title>By: shaun</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/17441/a-big-bowl-of-symbolism-just-wont-do-it/comment-page-1/#comment-149165</link>
		<dc:creator>shaun</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Jan 2008 18:36:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/at-tmv/newsweek-blogitics/17441/a-big-bowl-of-symbolism-just-wont-do-it/#comment-149165</guid>
		<description>Rudi:&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Sigh.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Rudi:</p>
<p>Sigh.</p>
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		<title>By: What Does Obama Bring To The Table? : BigMouthFrog</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/17441/a-big-bowl-of-symbolism-just-wont-do-it/comment-page-1/#comment-110341</link>
		<dc:creator>What Does Obama Bring To The Table? : BigMouthFrog</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Jan 2008 18:31:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/at-tmv/newsweek-blogitics/17441/a-big-bowl-of-symbolism-just-wont-do-it/#comment-110341</guid>
		<description>[...] A Big Bowl of Symbolism Just Won’t Do It [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] A Big Bowl of Symbolism Just Won’t Do It [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Rudi</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/17441/a-big-bowl-of-symbolism-just-wont-do-it/comment-page-1/#comment-149164</link>
		<dc:creator>Rudi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Jan 2008 18:23:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/at-tmv/newsweek-blogitics/17441/a-big-bowl-of-symbolism-just-wont-do-it/#comment-149164</guid>
		<description>Shaun - I don&#039;t think he&#039;s all that popular. My guess is that his site was hacked or the service provider has a problem. I read him quite a bit, he&#039;s linked to by quite a few independent minded Republicans. However, he has an issue with his ties to the VDare and Steve Sailer crowd. I don&#039;t think he&#039;s in the white supremist (sp)camp.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;For the &quot;geek squad&quot;, he&#039;s using a really old version of Apache. This could also be a reason for the technical difficulties.&lt;br&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;http://httpd.apache.org/&quot;&gt;Apache&lt;/a&gt;: &lt;blockquote&gt;The Apache HTTP Server Project is proud to announce the release of version 2.2.8 of the Apache HTTP Server (&quot;Apache&quot;). This version is principally a security and bugfix release.&lt;/blockquote&gt;&lt;br&gt;The message from the site say:&lt;blockquote&gt;Bandwidth Limit Exceeded&lt;br&gt;The server is temporarily unable to service your request due to the site owner reaching his/her bandwidth limit. Please try again later.&lt;br&gt;&lt;b&gt;Apache/1.3.37 Server&lt;/b&gt; at &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.larison.org&quot;&gt;www.larison.org&lt;/a&gt; Port 80&lt;/blockquote&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Shaun &#8211; I don&#39;t think he&#39;s all that popular. My guess is that his site was hacked or the service provider has a problem. I read him quite a bit, he&#39;s linked to by quite a few independent minded Republicans. However, he has an issue with his ties to the VDare and Steve Sailer crowd. I don&#39;t think he&#39;s in the white supremist (sp)camp.</p>
<p>For the &#8220;geek squad&#8221;, he&#39;s using a really old version of Apache. This could also be a reason for the technical difficulties.<br /><a href="http://httpd.apache.org/">Apache</a>:<br />
<blockquote>The Apache HTTP Server Project is proud to announce the release of version 2.2.8 of the Apache HTTP Server (&#8221;Apache&#8221;). This version is principally a security and bugfix release.</p></blockquote>
<p>The message from the site say:<br />
<blockquote>Bandwidth Limit Exceeded<br />The server is temporarily unable to service your request due to the site owner reaching his/her bandwidth limit. Please try again later.<br /><b>Apache/1.3.37 Server</b> at <a href="http://www.larison.org">http://www.larison.org</a> Port 80</p></blockquote>
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		<title>By: Polimom</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/17441/a-big-bowl-of-symbolism-just-wont-do-it/comment-page-1/#comment-149161</link>
		<dc:creator>Polimom</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Jan 2008 18:16:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/at-tmv/newsweek-blogitics/17441/a-big-bowl-of-symbolism-just-wont-do-it/#comment-149161</guid>
		<description>I agree with flyerhawk -- there&#039;s quite a lot of policy discussion out there.  And I also agree that his campaign is not focused there.  There is a great deal of symbolism, and for many of us (like me), that&#039;s not a problem.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;IMHO -- part of the disconnect for many folks stems from his not being particularly easy to &quot;pigeonhole&quot; into a political category.  The views of him as a far-left liberal, in particular, strike me as pretty far off.   Since we&#039;re in the middle of the primary campaign, I&#039;m not surprised at the light focus there, but as I wrote at &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.polimom.com/2008/01/30/obama-and-the-radical-left/&quot;&gt;my own blog&lt;/a&gt; this morning -- with Edwards out, Obama&#039;s positions on a number of issues are likely to get rather a lot more airtime.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree with flyerhawk &#8212; there&#39;s quite a lot of policy discussion out there.  And I also agree that his campaign is not focused there.  There is a great deal of symbolism, and for many of us (like me), that&#39;s not a problem.</p>
<p>IMHO &#8212; part of the disconnect for many folks stems from his not being particularly easy to &#8220;pigeonhole&#8221; into a political category.  The views of him as a far-left liberal, in particular, strike me as pretty far off.   Since we&#39;re in the middle of the primary campaign, I&#39;m not surprised at the light focus there, but as I wrote at <a href="http://www.polimom.com/2008/01/30/obama-and-the-radical-left/">my own blog</a> this morning &#8212; with Edwards out, Obama&#39;s positions on a number of issues are likely to get rather a lot more airtime.</p>
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		<title>By: flyerhawk</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/17441/a-big-bowl-of-symbolism-just-wont-do-it/comment-page-1/#comment-149159</link>
		<dc:creator>flyerhawk</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Jan 2008 18:15:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/at-tmv/newsweek-blogitics/17441/a-big-bowl-of-symbolism-just-wont-do-it/#comment-149159</guid>
		<description>Oh I agree, Shaun.  What works in the primaries  doesn&#039;t necessarily work in the general.  He will have to sharpen his edges more and start speaking about specific issues which play well to Democrats and Independents.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;The truth is that Hillary and Obama are generally aligned politically.  Sure there are differences.  But if Obama, the underdog, wants to beat Hillary, the heir apparent, the last thing he wants to do is get into a argument/agreement over how little their policies differentiate.  &lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;If he makes it to the General against McCain he needs to flesh out his Iraq plan and leverage that against McCain&#039;s &quot;100 years&quot; plan.  He needs to focus on health care.  Those are winning arguments for both Hillary and Obama.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oh I agree, Shaun.  What works in the primaries  doesn&#39;t necessarily work in the general.  He will have to sharpen his edges more and start speaking about specific issues which play well to Democrats and Independents.</p>
<p>The truth is that Hillary and Obama are generally aligned politically.  Sure there are differences.  But if Obama, the underdog, wants to beat Hillary, the heir apparent, the last thing he wants to do is get into a argument/agreement over how little their policies differentiate.  </p>
<p>If he makes it to the General against McCain he needs to flesh out his Iraq plan and leverage that against McCain&#39;s &#8220;100 years&#8221; plan.  He needs to focus on health care.  Those are winning arguments for both Hillary and Obama.</p>
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		<title>By: shaun</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/17441/a-big-bowl-of-symbolism-just-wont-do-it/comment-page-1/#comment-149158</link>
		<dc:creator>shaun</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Jan 2008 18:09:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/at-tmv/newsweek-blogitics/17441/a-big-bowl-of-symbolism-just-wont-do-it/#comment-149158</guid>
		<description>Flyerhawk:&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;I think that you&#039;re mostly on the money in general and spot on about FDR&#039;s political philosophy being pragmatism.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Maybe I have become addicted to pat terms like &quot;populism&quot; and &quot;neoconservatism,&quot; but Obama -- if he survives the primary season -- is gonna have to move beyond generalities.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Flyerhawk:</p>
<p>I think that you&#39;re mostly on the money in general and spot on about FDR&#39;s political philosophy being pragmatism.</p>
<p>Maybe I have become addicted to pat terms like &#8220;populism&#8221; and &#8220;neoconservatism,&#8221; but Obama &#8212; if he survives the primary season &#8212; is gonna have to move beyond generalities.</p>
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		<title>By: shaun</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/17441/a-big-bowl-of-symbolism-just-wont-do-it/comment-page-1/#comment-149155</link>
		<dc:creator>shaun</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Jan 2008 18:07:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/at-tmv/newsweek-blogitics/17441/a-big-bowl-of-symbolism-just-wont-do-it/#comment-149155</guid>
		<description>Rudy:&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;I&#039;ve been trying to link to Larison every which way but keep encountering bandwidth problem.  Guess the guy&#039;s really popular.  I know he&#039;s really good.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Rudy:</p>
<p>I&#39;ve been trying to link to Larison every which way but keep encountering bandwidth problem.  Guess the guy&#39;s really popular.  I know he&#39;s really good.</p>
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		<title>By: flyerhawk</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/17441/a-big-bowl-of-symbolism-just-wont-do-it/comment-page-1/#comment-149154</link>
		<dc:creator>flyerhawk</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Jan 2008 17:59:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/at-tmv/newsweek-blogitics/17441/a-big-bowl-of-symbolism-just-wont-do-it/#comment-149154</guid>
		<description>Shaun,&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;I have read this argument that Obama offers no substance to his campaign other than Hope and other vague notions.  &lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;I don&#039;t believe this to be particularly accurate.  It is NOT that Obama has avoided outlining his policy ideas.  He most certainly has.  To name a few.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;1.  He has stated that he wants the Federal government to become more involved in our national health care specifically by offering insurance to those who currently cannot afford it.   &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.barackobama.com/issues/healthcare/&quot;&gt;Here is a link to his plan.&lt;/a&gt;&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;2.  He has given several detailed discussion on his foreign policy views.  He gives  a fairly detailed and nuanced look at his foreign policy views &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.foreignaffairs.org/20070701faessay86401/barack-obama/renewing-american-leadership.html&quot;&gt;here&lt;/a&gt;&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;3. He has stated on numerous occasion that he is supportive of immigrant rights and opposing politically popular but counter-productive policies such as banning driver&#039;s licenses for illegals.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;In truth he has spoken, on many occasions, about just about every policy issue there is.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;The problem isn&#039;t that he is weak on issues.  The problem is that his campaign doesn&#039;t focus on issues.  Issues based campaigns are for losers, as Fred Thompson sorely learned.    So his critics like to point to his campaign speeches which are big on inspiration but rarely delve into boring policy wonk stuff that most people don&#039;t care about.  &lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;I also disagree that FDR had a core set of principles that guided him.  He was, if nothing else, the master of pragmatic politics.  He didn&#039;t really care what the solution was as long as it worked.   He would have pushed for Lochner-style Laissez-Faire if he thought that would fix the problem.  He was not dogmatic at all.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Shaun,</p>
<p>I have read this argument that Obama offers no substance to his campaign other than Hope and other vague notions.  </p>
<p>I don&#39;t believe this to be particularly accurate.  It is NOT that Obama has avoided outlining his policy ideas.  He most certainly has.  To name a few.</p>
<p>1.  He has stated that he wants the Federal government to become more involved in our national health care specifically by offering insurance to those who currently cannot afford it.   <a href="http://www.barackobama.com/issues/healthcare/">Here is a link to his plan.</a></p>
<p>2.  He has given several detailed discussion on his foreign policy views.  He gives  a fairly detailed and nuanced look at his foreign policy views <a href="http://www.foreignaffairs.org/20070701faessay86401/barack-obama/renewing-american-leadership.html">here</a></p>
<p>3. He has stated on numerous occasion that he is supportive of immigrant rights and opposing politically popular but counter-productive policies such as banning driver&#39;s licenses for illegals.</p>
<p>In truth he has spoken, on many occasions, about just about every policy issue there is.</p>
<p>The problem isn&#39;t that he is weak on issues.  The problem is that his campaign doesn&#39;t focus on issues.  Issues based campaigns are for losers, as Fred Thompson sorely learned.    So his critics like to point to his campaign speeches which are big on inspiration but rarely delve into boring policy wonk stuff that most people don&#39;t care about.  </p>
<p>I also disagree that FDR had a core set of principles that guided him.  He was, if nothing else, the master of pragmatic politics.  He didn&#39;t really care what the solution was as long as it worked.   He would have pushed for Lochner-style Laissez-Faire if he thought that would fix the problem.  He was not dogmatic at all.</p>
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		<title>By: Rudi</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/17441/a-big-bowl-of-symbolism-just-wont-do-it/comment-page-1/#comment-149153</link>
		<dc:creator>Rudi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Jan 2008 17:35:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/at-tmv/newsweek-blogitics/17441/a-big-bowl-of-symbolism-just-wont-do-it/#comment-149153</guid>
		<description>Shaun - You didn&#039;t link to Larison&#039;s site, here&#039;s a link to the site: &lt;a href=&quot;http://larison.org/&quot;&gt;Real thinking conservative&lt;/a&gt;. On my PC the site has a bandwith problem.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Shaun &#8211; You didn&#39;t link to Larison&#39;s site, here&#39;s a link to the site: <a href="http://larison.org/">Real thinking conservative</a>. On my PC the site has a bandwith problem.</p>
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