there was no plan for the post-invasion
there was no mushroom cloud
we weren’t greeted as liberators
Iraqi oil was never going to pay for reconstruction
the war was always more about Iraqi oil than Iraqi freedom
there was no connection between 9/11 and Saddam Hussein

If there is such eagerness to attack Iran, why is Clinton ahead of Giuliani as the best able to deal with Iran? Giuliani sounds like he’s ready to attaack yesterday, while Clinton is tough, but more equivocating. That suggests to me that supporit for an air-strikes includes at least some element of caution.

Most glaringly, the poll didn’t specify the conditions for an air strike. Now? When Iran has produced a bomb? Without an all out diplomatic effort, first?

These polls are a bad business, because they give the impression of providing factual information when, in fact, they are providing very ambiguous information.
Yet the results influence people’s thinking – and the results of the next poll.

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Seriously, I was opposed to Iraq when we thought we were going to win, not just when things turned bad. I’m opposed to Iran now for the same reasons. But looking at Iraq, so many of the problems go back to dissolving their army, a decision that makes me really think the Bushies wanted to create a huge mess (oil, guns, profit, duh).

The mismanagement of Iraq does not prove to me that our forces are incapable to fighting the Iranians, especially the Iranians that come across the Iraq border in a counter-attack to our bombing. That doesn’t mean we could handle it, either, just that a guerrilla rebellion and “normal” troops are two different ball-games. On the other hand (again), it’s fair to say the Iranians probably know that, and will fight accordingly. So it probably comes down to a question of Iran’s ability to fight a guerrilla war.

What are the criteria for “success” in Iran? Are we just going to try to kill a bunch of people and destroy their infrastructure? The Israelis mauled Lebanon two summers ago, but Hezbollah was basically intact, psychologically heros. Assuming a similar result, an attack on Iran would do little to decrease insurgent attacks on our troops in Iraq (not to imply that Iran’s responsible for the insurgency), but it may well cripple their economy and nuclear program.

The result Dick Cheney would mostly hope for, I believe, is that a war on Iran would force the Ayatollah to open up his country on our terms, and use his oil money to buy reconstruction services from Western multinationals, consolidating our influence in the heart of Eurasia, in addition to making a bunch of money for Dick’s buddies.

How things would actually turn out is anybody’s guess. As Jello Biafra observed, regime change is a game of russian roulette. The real problem is that most Americans think this sort of murderous, greedy, power-hungry bullshit is A-OK.

People have stopped talking about it, but a huge reason we were in Iraq before we realized it was because we were angry. We wanted revenge. That’s a horrible reason to start a war, but looking at this poll, a douche-bag like Ahmadi-Nejad talking shit is also enough for us to support another war! This is a problem with the moral constitution of the American people, our leaders are a reflection of that.

All this bloodshed is a stupid game played by the rich, for the rich, devouring our boys, their hands and eyes and brains, and causing untold grief to victim civilians, who grow up twisted and violent. We’ve been trying for millennia to end war by winning wars. Peace is the only answer. I’m not naive, I understand the need for self defense, but what’s going on is nothing of the sort. We’re going to pay for being so bloodthirsty, either here, or in the hereafter.

Let’s consider the fact that the majority of Americans (much greater, as I recall, than 52%) supported the initial invasion of Iraq, but that over 60% now think it was a “mistake” (oopsie daisy, sorry about your lost loved ones!). If we consider the fact that Iraq is a joy ride compared to the kind of hell Iran would be, and the fact that our military is in much worse conditions now than before the Iraq war, what do you suppose the proportion of Americans would think that the IRAN war was a “mistake” when we’re 4 years in and no end in sight…with many more thousands dead and our ability to defend ourselves shot to hell and beyond?

Unless we literally found nuclear warheads nearly ready to be launched, I wouldn’t put the “oopsie!” opinion below 75%. I leave 25% in doubt as there are still people who actually think we found WMDs in Iraq.