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	<title>Comments on: Sabato&#8217;s Crystal Ball: The Romneys Run for President</title>
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		<title>By: Holly in Cincinnati</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/15215/sabatos-crystal-ball-the-romneys-run-for-president/comment-page-1/#comment-99052</link>
		<dc:creator>Holly in Cincinnati</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 21 Sep 2007 02:02:01 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Well, now it&#039;s clear which side you support. 

It&#039;s useless because, in my opinion, Christianity is false.  So, Christians attacking each other simply baffles me.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well, now it&#8217;s clear which side you support. </p>
<p>It&#8217;s useless because, in my opinion, Christianity is false.  So, Christians attacking each other simply baffles me.</p>
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		<title>By: Bot</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/15215/sabatos-crystal-ball-the-romneys-run-for-president/comment-page-1/#comment-99046</link>
		<dc:creator>Bot</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 21 Sep 2007 01:27:20 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Why is it useless?  You have hundreds of Evangelical pastors railing against the Mormons based on false and defamatory information.  The Mormons simply follow First Century Christianity theology more closely than Evangelicals (or Catholics or Protestants). 

 How can Evangelical pastors say the Church of Jesus Christ (LDS) is not Christian?  I can only conclude they are denigrating Mormons to protect their flock (and their livlihood).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Why is it useless?  You have hundreds of Evangelical pastors railing against the Mormons based on false and defamatory information.  The Mormons simply follow First Century Christianity theology more closely than Evangelicals (or Catholics or Protestants). </p>
<p> How can Evangelical pastors say the Church of Jesus Christ (LDS) is not Christian?  I can only conclude they are denigrating Mormons to protect their flock (and their livlihood).</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Holly in Cincinnati</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/15215/sabatos-crystal-ball-the-romneys-run-for-president/comment-page-1/#comment-98939</link>
		<dc:creator>Holly in Cincinnati</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 20 Sep 2007 16:59:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/politics/15215/sabatos-crystal-ball-the-romneys-run-for-president/#comment-98939</guid>
		<description>Bot, this material is interesting but quite useless.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Bot, this material is interesting but quite useless.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Bot</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/15215/sabatos-crystal-ball-the-romneys-run-for-president/comment-page-1/#comment-98923</link>
		<dc:creator>Bot</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 20 Sep 2007 15:35:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/politics/15215/sabatos-crystal-ball-the-romneys-run-for-president/#comment-98923</guid>
		<description>The Church of Jesus Christ (LDS) is often accused by Evangelical pastors of not believing in Christ and, therefore, not being a Christian religion   This post helps to clarify such misconceptions by examining early Christianity&#039;s theology relating to baptism, the Godhead, the deity of Jesus Christ and His Atonement.

Â·	&lt;strong&gt;Baptism: &lt;/strong&gt; .
 
Early Christian churches, practiced baptism of youth (not infants) by immersion by the father of the family.  The local congregation had a lay ministry. An early Christian Church has been re-constructed at the Israel Museum, and the above can be verified. http://www.imj.org.il/eng/exhibitions/2000/christianity/ancientchurch/structure/index.html
The Church of Jesus Christ (LDS) continues baptism and a lay ministry as taught by Jesusâ€™ Apostles.  Early Christians were persecuted for keeping their practices sacred, and prohibiting non-Christians from witnessing them.
 
Â·	&lt;strong&gt;The Trinity: .&lt;/strong&gt;
 
A literal reading of the New Testament points to God and Jesus Christ , His Son ,  being separate , divine beings , united in purpose. .  To whom was Jesus praying in Gethsemane, and Who was speaking to Him and his apostles on the Mount of Transfiguration?
 
The Nicene Creedâ€s definition of the Trinity was influenced by scribes translating the Greek manuscripts into Latin.  The scribes embellished on a passage explaining the Trinity , which is the Catholic and Protestant belief that God is Father, Son and Holy Spirit.  The oldest versions of the epistle of 1 John, read: &lt;em&gt;&quot;There are three that bear witness: the Spirit, the water and the blood and these three are one.&quot; &lt;/em&gt; 
Scribes later added &lt;em&gt;&quot;the Father, the Word and the Spirit,&quot;&lt;/em&gt; and it remained in the epistle when it was translated into English for the King James Version, according to Dr. Bart Ehrman, Chairman of the Religion Department at UNC- Chapel Hill.  He no longer believes in the Nicene Trinity. .
 
Scholars agree that Early Christians believed in an embodied God; it was neo-Platonist influences that later turned Him into a disembodied Spirit.  Divinization, narrowing the space between God and humans, was also part of Early Christian belief.   St. Athanasius of Alexandria (Eastern Orthodox) wrote, regarding theosis, &lt;em&gt;&quot;The Son of God became man, that we might become God. &quot;&lt;/em&gt; . The Church of Jesus Christ (LDS) views the Trinity as three separate divine beings , in accord with the earliest Greek New Testament manuscripts.
 
&lt;strong&gt;Â·	The Deity of Jesus Christ&lt;/strong&gt;
 
Mormons hold firmly to the deity of Christ.  For members of the Church of Jesus Christ (LDS), Jesus is not only the Son of God but also God the Son.  Evangelical pollster George Barna found in 2001 that while only 33 percent of American Catholics, Lutherans, and Methodists (28 percent of Episcopalians) agreed that Jesus was â€œwithout sinâ€, 70 percent of Mormons believe Jesus was sinless.  http://www.adherents.com/misc/BarnaPoll.html
 
Â·	&lt;strong&gt;The Cross and Christâ€™s Atonement: .&lt;/strong&gt;
 
The Cross became popular as a Christian symbol  in the Fifth Century A.D. .  Members of the Church of Jesus Christ (LDS) believe the proper Christian symbol is Christâ€™s resurrection , not his crucifixion on the Cross.  Many Mormon chapels feature paintings of the resurrected Christ or His Second Coming.  Furthermore, members of the church believe the major part of Christâ€™s atonement occurred in the Garden of Gethsemane as Christ took upon him the sins of all mankind. 
 
Â·	&lt;strong&gt;Definition of â€œChristianâ€:&lt;/strong&gt; .
 
But Mormons donâ€™t term Catholics and Protestants â€œnon-Christianâ€.   They believe Christâ€™s atonement applies to all mankind.  The dictionary definition of a Christian is &lt;em&gt;â€œof, pertaining to, believing in, or belonging to a religion based on the teachings of Jesus Christâ€:   &lt;/em&gt;All of the above denominations are followers of Christ, and consider him divine, and the Messiah foretold in the Old Testament.  They all worship the one and only true God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, and address Him in prayer as prescribed in The Lordâ€™s Prayer.
 
Itâ€™s important to understand the difference between Reformation and Restoration when we consider who might be authentic Christians. . Early Christians had certain rituals which defined a Christian http://sacred-texts.com/chr/ecf/207/2070037.htm , which members of the Church of Jesus Christ (LDS) continue today. .  If members of the Church of Jesus Christ (LDS) embrace early Christian theology,  they are likely more â€œChristianâ€ than their detractors.

Â·	  &lt;strong&gt;The Need for a Restoration of the Christian Church:&lt;/strong&gt;

 The founder of the Baptist Church in America, Roger Williams, just prior to leaving the church he established, said this:

 &lt;em&gt;&quot;There is no regularly constituted church of Christ on earth, nor any person  qualified to administer any church ordinances; nor can there be until new  apostles are sent by the Great Head of the Church for whose coming I am  seeking.â€ &lt;/em&gt;(Picturesque America, p. 502.)

 Martin Luther had similar thoughts: &lt;em&gt;&quot;Nor can a Christian believer be forced beyond sacred Scriptures,...unless some new and proved revelation should be added; for we are forbidden by divine law to believe except what is proved either through the divine Scriptures or through Manifest revelation.&quot;&lt;/em&gt;
 He also wrote: &lt;em&gt;&quot;I have sought nothing beyond reforming the Church in conformity with the Holy Scriptures. The spiritual powers have been not only corrupted by sin, but absolutely destroyed; so that there is now nothing in them but a depraved reason and a will that is the enemy and opponent of God.  I simply say that Christianity has ceased to exist among those who should have preserved it.&quot;&lt;/em&gt;

The Lutheran, Baptist and Church of Jesus Christ (LDS) churches recognize an apostasy from early Christianity. The Lutheran and Baptist churches have attempted reform, but Mormonism (and Roger Williams, and  perhaps Martin Luther) require inspired restoration, so as to re-establish an unbroken line of authority and apostolic succession.
 
*  *  *
Â·	&lt;strong&gt;Christ-Like Lives:&lt;/strong&gt;  

The 2005 National Study of Youth and Religion published by UNC-Chapel Hill found that Church of Jesus Christ (LDS) youth (ages 13 to 17) were more likely to exhibit these 11 Christian characteristics than Evangelicals (the next most observant group):
   
 
1. Attend Religious Services weekly
2. Importance of Religious Faith in shaping daily    life â€“   extremely important  
3. Believes in life after death
4. Does NOT believe in psychics or fortune-tellers 
5. Has taught religious education classes 
6. Has fasted or denied something as spiritual discipline  
7. Sabbath Observance  
8. Shared religious faith with someone not of their faith
9. Family talks about God, scriptures, prayer daily 
10. Supportiveness of church for parent in trying to raise teen     (very supportive)
11. Church congregation has done an excellent job in helping teens better understand their own sexuality and sexual morality                                                          

   LDS                    Evangelical
1.  71%                          55%
2.  52                             28
3.  76                             62
4. 100                            95     

5.   42                             28
6.   68                             22     
7.   67                             40

8.   72                             56

9.   50                             19

10.  65                             26

11.  84                             35</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The Church of Jesus Christ (LDS) is often accused by Evangelical pastors of not believing in Christ and, therefore, not being a Christian religion   This post helps to clarify such misconceptions by examining early Christianity&#8217;s theology relating to baptism, the Godhead, the deity of Jesus Christ and His Atonement.</p>
<p>Â·	<strong>Baptism: </strong> .</p>
<p>Early Christian churches, practiced baptism of youth (not infants) by immersion by the father of the family.  The local congregation had a lay ministry. An early Christian Church has been re-constructed at the Israel Museum, and the above can be verified. <a href="http://www.imj.org.il/eng/exhibitions/2000/christianity/ancientchurch/structure/index.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.imj.org.il/eng/exhibitions/2000/christianity/ancientchurch/structure/index.html</a><br />
The Church of Jesus Christ (LDS) continues baptism and a lay ministry as taught by Jesusâ€™ Apostles.  Early Christians were persecuted for keeping their practices sacred, and prohibiting non-Christians from witnessing them.</p>
<p>Â·	<strong>The Trinity: .</strong></p>
<p>A literal reading of the New Testament points to God and Jesus Christ , His Son ,  being separate , divine beings , united in purpose. .  To whom was Jesus praying in Gethsemane, and Who was speaking to Him and his apostles on the Mount of Transfiguration?</p>
<p>The Nicene Creedâ€s definition of the Trinity was influenced by scribes translating the Greek manuscripts into Latin.  The scribes embellished on a passage explaining the Trinity , which is the Catholic and Protestant belief that God is Father, Son and Holy Spirit.  The oldest versions of the epistle of 1 John, read: <em>&#8220;There are three that bear witness: the Spirit, the water and the blood and these three are one.&#8221; </em><br />
Scribes later added <em>&#8220;the Father, the Word and the Spirit,&#8221;</em> and it remained in the epistle when it was translated into English for the King James Version, according to Dr. Bart Ehrman, Chairman of the Religion Department at UNC- Chapel Hill.  He no longer believes in the Nicene Trinity. .</p>
<p>Scholars agree that Early Christians believed in an embodied God; it was neo-Platonist influences that later turned Him into a disembodied Spirit.  Divinization, narrowing the space between God and humans, was also part of Early Christian belief.   St. Athanasius of Alexandria (Eastern Orthodox) wrote, regarding theosis, <em>&#8220;The Son of God became man, that we might become God. &#8220;</em> . The Church of Jesus Christ (LDS) views the Trinity as three separate divine beings , in accord with the earliest Greek New Testament manuscripts.</p>
<p><strong>Â·	The Deity of Jesus Christ</strong></p>
<p>Mormons hold firmly to the deity of Christ.  For members of the Church of Jesus Christ (LDS), Jesus is not only the Son of God but also God the Son.  Evangelical pollster George Barna found in 2001 that while only 33 percent of American Catholics, Lutherans, and Methodists (28 percent of Episcopalians) agreed that Jesus was â€œwithout sinâ€, 70 percent of Mormons believe Jesus was sinless.  <a href="http://www.adherents.com/misc/BarnaPoll.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.adherents.com/misc/BarnaPoll.html</a></p>
<p>Â·	<strong>The Cross and Christâ€™s Atonement: .</strong></p>
<p>The Cross became popular as a Christian symbol  in the Fifth Century A.D. .  Members of the Church of Jesus Christ (LDS) believe the proper Christian symbol is Christâ€™s resurrection , not his crucifixion on the Cross.  Many Mormon chapels feature paintings of the resurrected Christ or His Second Coming.  Furthermore, members of the church believe the major part of Christâ€™s atonement occurred in the Garden of Gethsemane as Christ took upon him the sins of all mankind. </p>
<p>Â·	<strong>Definition of â€œChristianâ€:</strong> .</p>
<p>But Mormons donâ€™t term Catholics and Protestants â€œnon-Christianâ€.   They believe Christâ€™s atonement applies to all mankind.  The dictionary definition of a Christian is <em>â€œof, pertaining to, believing in, or belonging to a religion based on the teachings of Jesus Christâ€:   </em>All of the above denominations are followers of Christ, and consider him divine, and the Messiah foretold in the Old Testament.  They all worship the one and only true God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, and address Him in prayer as prescribed in The Lordâ€™s Prayer.</p>
<p>Itâ€™s important to understand the difference between Reformation and Restoration when we consider who might be authentic Christians. . Early Christians had certain rituals which defined a Christian <a href="http://sacred-texts.com/chr/ecf/207/2070037.htm" rel="nofollow">http://sacred-texts.com/chr/ecf/207/2070037.htm</a> , which members of the Church of Jesus Christ (LDS) continue today. .  If members of the Church of Jesus Christ (LDS) embrace early Christian theology,  they are likely more â€œChristianâ€ than their detractors.</p>
<p>Â·	  <strong>The Need for a Restoration of the Christian Church:</strong></p>
<p> The founder of the Baptist Church in America, Roger Williams, just prior to leaving the church he established, said this:</p>
<p> <em>&#8220;There is no regularly constituted church of Christ on earth, nor any person  qualified to administer any church ordinances; nor can there be until new  apostles are sent by the Great Head of the Church for whose coming I am  seeking.â€ </em>(Picturesque America, p. 502.)</p>
<p> Martin Luther had similar thoughts: <em>&#8220;Nor can a Christian believer be forced beyond sacred Scriptures,&#8230;unless some new and proved revelation should be added; for we are forbidden by divine law to believe except what is proved either through the divine Scriptures or through Manifest revelation.&#8221;</em><br />
 He also wrote: <em>&#8220;I have sought nothing beyond reforming the Church in conformity with the Holy Scriptures. The spiritual powers have been not only corrupted by sin, but absolutely destroyed; so that there is now nothing in them but a depraved reason and a will that is the enemy and opponent of God.  I simply say that Christianity has ceased to exist among those who should have preserved it.&#8221;</em></p>
<p>The Lutheran, Baptist and Church of Jesus Christ (LDS) churches recognize an apostasy from early Christianity. The Lutheran and Baptist churches have attempted reform, but Mormonism (and Roger Williams, and  perhaps Martin Luther) require inspired restoration, so as to re-establish an unbroken line of authority and apostolic succession.</p>
<p>*  *  *<br />
Â·	<strong>Christ-Like Lives:</strong>  </p>
<p>The 2005 National Study of Youth and Religion published by UNC-Chapel Hill found that Church of Jesus Christ (LDS) youth (ages 13 to 17) were more likely to exhibit these 11 Christian characteristics than Evangelicals (the next most observant group):</p>
<p>1. Attend Religious Services weekly<br />
2. Importance of Religious Faith in shaping daily    life â€“   extremely important<br />
3. Believes in life after death<br />
4. Does NOT believe in psychics or fortune-tellers<br />
5. Has taught religious education classes<br />
6. Has fasted or denied something as spiritual discipline<br />
7. Sabbath Observance<br />
8. Shared religious faith with someone not of their faith<br />
9. Family talks about God, scriptures, prayer daily<br />
10. Supportiveness of church for parent in trying to raise teen     (very supportive)<br />
11. Church congregation has done an excellent job in helping teens better understand their own sexuality and sexual morality                                                          </p>
<p>   LDS                    Evangelical<br />
1.  71%                          55%<br />
2.  52                             28<br />
3.  76                             62<br />
4. 100                            95     </p>
<p>5.   42                             28<br />
6.   68                             22<br />
7.   67                             40</p>
<p>8.   72                             56</p>
<p>9.   50                             19</p>
<p>10.  65                             26</p>
<p>11.  84                             35</p>
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