Comments on: The common cause of Bush and al Qaeda http://themoderatevoice.com/14120/the-common-cause-of-bush-and-al-qaeda/ An Internet hub for moderates, centrists, and independents, with domestic and international news, analysis, original reporting, and popular features from the left, center, and right Mon, 23 Nov 2009 19:30:20 -0500 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.4 hourly 1 By: Robert Stein http://themoderatevoice.com/14120/the-common-cause-of-bush-and-al-qaeda/comment-page-1/#comment-91708 Robert Stein Fri, 20 Jul 2007 20:01:25 +0000 http://themoderatevoice.com/war/afghanistan/14120/the-common-cause-of-bush-and-al-qaeda/#comment-91708 Going into Pakistan with troops and covert forces is not the kind of invasion that appeals to Bush and Cheney. We might actually achieve our objectives and get out. Iraq is more their style, but they may not have a choice, since it's become so obvious that Musharraf has been stringing them along and not disturbing Al Qaeda: http://ajliebling.blogspot.com/2007/07/straight-talk-about-taking-out-al-qaeda.html Going into Pakistan with troops and covert forces is not the kind of invasion that appeals to Bush and Cheney. We might actually achieve our objectives and get out. Iraq is more their style, but they may not have a choice, since it’s become so obvious that Musharraf has been stringing them along and not disturbing Al Qaeda:

http://ajliebling.blogspot.com/2007/07/straight-talk-about-taking-out-al-qaeda.html

]]> By: Pyst http://themoderatevoice.com/14120/the-common-cause-of-bush-and-al-qaeda/comment-page-1/#comment-91560 Pyst Fri, 20 Jul 2007 06:18:52 +0000 http://themoderatevoice.com/war/afghanistan/14120/the-common-cause-of-bush-and-al-qaeda/#comment-91560 Seems I've heard about this guy that was running for president here a few years ago that had an idea of expanding the special forces by 20k. Yeah, he also hinted at the very thing Hamilton espouses in this post, but was called a defeatist, was said he'd weaken the US, and was a flip flopper. I didn't vote for him because he had no shot of winning my state, and had my own reservations about him, but on this issue I agreed with him. Does this mean he's right now? Seems I’ve heard about this guy that was running for president here a few years ago that had an idea of expanding the special forces by 20k. Yeah, he also hinted at the very thing Hamilton espouses in this post, but was called a defeatist, was said he’d weaken the US, and was a flip flopper.

I didn’t vote for him because he had no shot of winning my state, and had my own reservations about him, but on this issue I agreed with him.

Does this mean he’s right now?

]]> By: afghanistan » Blog Archive » British Actor Jude Law In Afghanistan To Promote United Nations … http://themoderatevoice.com/14120/the-common-cause-of-bush-and-al-qaeda/comment-page-1/#comment-91558 afghanistan » Blog Archive » British Actor Jude Law In Afghanistan To Promote United Nations … Fri, 20 Jul 2007 05:52:17 +0000 http://themoderatevoice.com/war/afghanistan/14120/the-common-cause-of-bush-and-al-qaeda/#comment-91558 [...] US forces should go into Pakistan to rout al Qaeda from the safe haven it has found in the mountains on the border with Afghanistan, a co-chairman of the Iraq Study Group said. Former Rep. Lee Hamilton, who also served as the vice … …more [...] [...] US forces should go into Pakistan to rout al Qaeda from the safe haven it has found in the mountains on the border with Afghanistan, a co-chairman of the Iraq Study Group said. Former Rep. Lee Hamilton, who also served as the vice … …more [...]

]]> By: kimrit http://themoderatevoice.com/14120/the-common-cause-of-bush-and-al-qaeda/comment-page-1/#comment-91514 kimrit Fri, 20 Jul 2007 02:22:27 +0000 http://themoderatevoice.com/war/afghanistan/14120/the-common-cause-of-bush-and-al-qaeda/#comment-91514 I think special ops would need to be used --- that's what we had in there when OSB was spotted a few years ago. The problem is that al queda and OSB are now surrounded by loyal tribesmen, who won't be bribed into giving out information. I think special ops would need to be used — that’s what we had in there when OSB was spotted a few years ago. The problem is that al queda and OSB are now surrounded by loyal tribesmen, who won’t be bribed into giving out information.

]]> By: DLS http://themoderatevoice.com/14120/the-common-cause-of-bush-and-al-qaeda/comment-page-1/#comment-91498 DLS Fri, 20 Jul 2007 00:24:46 +0000 http://themoderatevoice.com/war/afghanistan/14120/the-common-cause-of-bush-and-al-qaeda/#comment-91498 The Pak-Afghan border country has long been out of the reach of the Pakistani government and has long been a haven for terrorists. This isn't the first time we are being told that it is a refuge for al-Qaeda as well as other terrorists. To be sure we get rid of them, yes, we should go in on foot, but there's nothing wrong with de-Earthing the entire region first using B-52s, anti-personnel bombs as well as high explosives... The <a href="http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/taliban/tribal/map.html" rel="nofollow">wild</a> <a href="http://www.cfr.org/publication/13518/pakistans_troubled_tribal_belt.html?breadcrumb=%2Fissue%2F450%2Fhavens_for_terrorism" rel="nofollow">frontier</a> The Pak-Afghan border country has long been out of the reach of the Pakistani government and has long been a haven for terrorists. This isn’t the first time we are being told that it is a refuge for al-Qaeda as well as other terrorists.

To be sure we get rid of them, yes, we should go in on foot, but there’s nothing wrong with de-Earthing the entire region first using B-52s, anti-personnel bombs as well as high explosives…

The wild frontier

]]> By: Sam http://themoderatevoice.com/14120/the-common-cause-of-bush-and-al-qaeda/comment-page-1/#comment-91490 Sam Thu, 19 Jul 2007 23:57:30 +0000 http://themoderatevoice.com/war/afghanistan/14120/the-common-cause-of-bush-and-al-qaeda/#comment-91490 Well Jdeldelle, I think the main point wasn't about the viablility of invading Pakistan, more about how Bush has made terrorism a bigger threat by using ham handed policies. Terrorists thrive in weak countries and chaotic political climates. So what does he do, makes a HUGE chaotic mess with little to no gov't to keep the order. Had he gone about dealing with them like the international criminals they are instead of using 9/11 to live out some fantasy about fixing the world and going to war on a whim, we'd be in a much better place. Maybe his dad presiding over the fall of the Soviet Union, our last real signifigant threat, was inspiring him to take down something big and leave his mark on history. Someone should have told him you go to war with the enemies you have, not the ones you wish you had. Well Jdeldelle, I think the main point wasn’t about the viablility of invading Pakistan, more about how Bush has made terrorism a bigger threat by using ham handed policies. Terrorists thrive in weak countries and chaotic political climates. So what does he do, makes a HUGE chaotic mess with little to no gov’t to keep the order.

Had he gone about dealing with them like the international criminals they are instead of using 9/11 to live out some fantasy about fixing the world and going to war on a whim, we’d be in a much better place. Maybe his dad presiding over the fall of the Soviet Union, our last real signifigant threat, was inspiring him to take down something big and leave his mark on history. Someone should have told him you go to war with the enemies you have, not the ones you wish you had.

]]> By: University Update - George W Bush - The common cause of Bush and al Qaeda http://themoderatevoice.com/14120/the-common-cause-of-bush-and-al-qaeda/comment-page-1/#comment-91479 University Update - George W Bush - The common cause of Bush and al Qaeda Thu, 19 Jul 2007 22:52:01 +0000 http://themoderatevoice.com/war/afghanistan/14120/the-common-cause-of-bush-and-al-qaeda/#comment-91479 [...] Clark Link to Article george w bush The common cause of Bush and al Qaeda » Posted at The Moderate [...] [...] Clark Link to Article george w bush The common cause of Bush and al Qaeda » Posted at The Moderate [...]

]]> By: University Update - Iraq - The common cause of Bush and al Qaeda http://themoderatevoice.com/14120/the-common-cause-of-bush-and-al-qaeda/comment-page-1/#comment-91472 University Update - Iraq - The common cause of Bush and al Qaeda Thu, 19 Jul 2007 21:54:18 +0000 http://themoderatevoice.com/war/afghanistan/14120/the-common-cause-of-bush-and-al-qaeda/#comment-91472 [...] House Link to Article iraq The common cause of Bush and al Qaeda » Posted at The Moderate Voice » [...] [...] House Link to Article iraq The common cause of Bush and al Qaeda » Posted at The Moderate Voice » [...]

]]> By: jdledell http://themoderatevoice.com/14120/the-common-cause-of-bush-and-al-qaeda/comment-page-1/#comment-91460 jdledell Thu, 19 Jul 2007 21:15:08 +0000 http://themoderatevoice.com/war/afghanistan/14120/the-common-cause-of-bush-and-al-qaeda/#comment-91460 Michael - I am not so sure about trying to tackle Pakistan at this time. The only way to rout out AlQaeda in the mountains along the border is with ground troops. Aerial bombing will not do the trick. We are hard pressed to field enough ground troops in Iraq and Afganistan. Where are we going to get sufficient numbers to do the job right in those mountains? Pakistan tried with 80,000 troops and failed miserably. I know we are better but... Even if Musharraf cooperated in such an invasion most of Pakistan would not. We would have tens of thousands of new mujahideen pouring in to help AlQaeda. I'm not sure whose side the Pakistani army would be on in such an invasion. I think enough of them would be suspect to put our mission in jeopardy. These things are not as simple as many warriors think. Look at our cakewalk in Iraq. We are still in a 50-50 proposition in Afganistan after 6 years. We are asking for a lot of trouble by taking on Pakistan at this time. Doing so will put even more pressure on our military in Iraq and Afganistan. Just think what opening up another muslim front will do for AlQaeda/Islamic militant recruiting. Taking on Pakistan at this time will free Iran to be even MORE aggressive. People have a lot of faith in the US military but this organization is not omnipotent. I vote to "keep our powder dry" in Pakistan for the forseeable future. Let Musharraf try to contain AlQaeda to minimize the potential damage they can cause. Michael – I am not so sure about trying to tackle Pakistan at this time. The only way to rout out AlQaeda in the mountains along the border is with ground troops. Aerial bombing will not do the trick.

We are hard pressed to field enough ground troops in Iraq and Afganistan. Where are we going to get sufficient numbers to do the job right in those mountains? Pakistan tried with 80,000 troops and failed miserably. I know we are better but…

Even if Musharraf cooperated in such an invasion most of Pakistan would not. We would have tens of thousands of new mujahideen pouring in to help AlQaeda. I’m not sure whose side the Pakistani army would be on in such an invasion. I think enough of them would be suspect to put our mission in jeopardy.

These things are not as simple as many warriors think. Look at our cakewalk in Iraq. We are still in a 50-50 proposition in Afganistan after 6 years. We are asking for a lot of trouble by taking on Pakistan at this time. Doing so will put even more pressure on our military in Iraq and Afganistan. Just think what opening up another muslim front will do for AlQaeda/Islamic militant recruiting. Taking on Pakistan at this time will free Iran to be even MORE aggressive.

People have a lot of faith in the US military but this organization is not omnipotent. I vote to “keep our powder dry” in Pakistan for the forseeable future. Let Musharraf try to contain AlQaeda to minimize the potential damage they can cause.

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