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	<title>Comments on: Center of Attention</title>
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		<title>By: Tully</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/14056/center-of-attention-112/comment-page-1/#comment-91158</link>
		<dc:creator>Tully</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 18 Jul 2007 00:40:01 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>McQ is inconveniently correct, and invective is a poor substitute for facts. Tax level changes can &lt;em&gt;and do&lt;/em&gt; affect growth rates from baseline in a completely predictable fashion. They&#039;re just not the &lt;em&gt;only&lt;/em&gt; thing that affects growth rates, as the tax-hawks claim. They only want their own side of the picture. As do tax-hikers. 

The major source of growth in the US economy in the 90&#039;s was the same thing that drove the dot.com bubble. Namely, a quantum leap in computer technology driving a massive increase in productivity and other production efficiencies. While the tax-hawks will never admit an up side to tax hikes, the Clinton-era tax hikes acted as a growth restraint when one was actually needed. Without them, the bubble would have been bigger, and the post-bubble recession much larger and longer. 

IOW, restraining growth isn&#039;t always a &lt;em&gt;bad&lt;/em&gt; thing. Just as there is something to be said for cutting rates in a downswing, there things to be said for raising them in an upswing. Tax-hawks, of course, much prefer spending control to tax hikes--but spending control does nothing to restrain economic growth, and there really are times where restraining growth is smart.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>McQ is inconveniently correct, and invective is a poor substitute for facts. Tax level changes can <em>and do</em> affect growth rates from baseline in a completely predictable fashion. They&#8217;re just not the <em>only</em> thing that affects growth rates, as the tax-hawks claim. They only want their own side of the picture. As do tax-hikers. </p>
<p>The major source of growth in the US economy in the 90&#8217;s was the same thing that drove the dot.com bubble. Namely, a quantum leap in computer technology driving a massive increase in productivity and other production efficiencies. While the tax-hawks will never admit an up side to tax hikes, the Clinton-era tax hikes acted as a growth restraint when one was actually needed. Without them, the bubble would have been bigger, and the post-bubble recession much larger and longer. </p>
<p>IOW, restraining growth isn&#8217;t always a <em>bad</em> thing. Just as there is something to be said for cutting rates in a downswing, there things to be said for raising them in an upswing. Tax-hawks, of course, much prefer spending control to tax hikes&#8211;but spending control does nothing to restrain economic growth, and there really are times where restraining growth is smart.</p>
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		<title>By: Jim Satterfield</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/14056/center-of-attention-112/comment-page-1/#comment-91005</link>
		<dc:creator>Jim Satterfield</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 17 Jul 2007 01:35:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/at-tmv/center-of-attention/14056/center-of-attention-112/#comment-91005</guid>
		<description>McQ&#039;s piece is the same pathetic excuse for reasoning as most modern conservatives produce when it comes to taxes and the economy. Notice that they never account for the economic growth during the Clinton administration that existed outside of the Internet bubble and after the tax increases that they swore would drive us into recession. As far as the claims of amazing economic growth from 2003 to 2008 are concerned, even if it was true (A debatable proposition.) do McQ and those who agree with him really care how little of it has reached the larger population? I have yet to see any evidence of it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>McQ&#8217;s piece is the same pathetic excuse for reasoning as most modern conservatives produce when it comes to taxes and the economy. Notice that they never account for the economic growth during the Clinton administration that existed outside of the Internet bubble and after the tax increases that they swore would drive us into recession. As far as the claims of amazing economic growth from 2003 to 2008 are concerned, even if it was true (A debatable proposition.) do McQ and those who agree with him really care how little of it has reached the larger population? I have yet to see any evidence of it.</p>
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		<title>By: GreenDreams</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/14056/center-of-attention-112/comment-page-1/#comment-90886</link>
		<dc:creator>GreenDreams</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Jul 2007 03:58:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/at-tmv/center-of-attention/14056/center-of-attention-112/#comment-90886</guid>
		<description>Oh, as for the tax piece, what rubbish! Yes, &lt;strong&gt;obviously &lt;/strong&gt;it is possible to crank up the economy briefly by cutting taxes, just as you can stimulate spending by letting everyone spend money they don&#039;t have. Our tax-cut-driven deficit spending is nothing more or less than borrowing money from our children to pay for our illusory healthy economy today. The Visa bill always comes and you can only delay paying it briefly, and at great cost in interest. We&#039;re robbing future generations so we don&#039;t have to pay our way now. Disgusting.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oh, as for the tax piece, what rubbish! Yes, <strong>obviously </strong>it is possible to crank up the economy briefly by cutting taxes, just as you can stimulate spending by letting everyone spend money they don&#8217;t have. Our tax-cut-driven deficit spending is nothing more or less than borrowing money from our children to pay for our illusory healthy economy today. The Visa bill always comes and you can only delay paying it briefly, and at great cost in interest. We&#8217;re robbing future generations so we don&#8217;t have to pay our way now. Disgusting.</p>
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		<title>By: GreenDreams</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/14056/center-of-attention-112/comment-page-1/#comment-90885</link>
		<dc:creator>GreenDreams</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Jul 2007 03:53:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/at-tmv/center-of-attention/14056/center-of-attention-112/#comment-90885</guid>
		<description>There&#039;s either a big magic man (white beard and all) in the sky who personally decides if that football player will catch or miss that pass, or there is not. Dawkins may be right, that in a hundred years, believing in such magic might be thought just as superstitious as believing that eclipses are caused by demons or that the planets, sun and stars all revolve around the earth. Or that some women are witches and need to be burned. Religion has not been a good teachers of values or morals! We&#039;re locked in a struggle with religious zealots who think God wants them to kill us, just as we think God wants us to kill them. (Remember W, when asked if he had consulted his father for advice about Iraq, he said he had consulted &quot;a higher father&quot;)

Pete, the Sun Times piece is a great read and highlights the point that religion can be &quot;a dangerous idea&quot; 
&lt;blockquote&gt;For millennia, the monotheistic religions have persecuted countless heresies, together with nuisances from science such as geocentrism, biblical archeology, and the theory of evolution. We can be thankful that the punishments have changed from torture and mutilation to the canceling of grants and the writing of vituperative reviews. But intellectual intimidation, whether by sword or by pen, inevitably shapes the ideas that are taken seriously in a given era, and the rear-view mirror of history presents us with a warning.&lt;/blockquote&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There&#8217;s either a big magic man (white beard and all) in the sky who personally decides if that football player will catch or miss that pass, or there is not. Dawkins may be right, that in a hundred years, believing in such magic might be thought just as superstitious as believing that eclipses are caused by demons or that the planets, sun and stars all revolve around the earth. Or that some women are witches and need to be burned. Religion has not been a good teachers of values or morals! We&#8217;re locked in a struggle with religious zealots who think God wants them to kill us, just as we think God wants us to kill them. (Remember W, when asked if he had consulted his father for advice about Iraq, he said he had consulted &#8220;a higher father&#8221;)</p>
<p>Pete, the Sun Times piece is a great read and highlights the point that religion can be &#8220;a dangerous idea&#8221; </p>
<blockquote><p>For millennia, the monotheistic religions have persecuted countless heresies, together with nuisances from science such as geocentrism, biblical archeology, and the theory of evolution. We can be thankful that the punishments have changed from torture and mutilation to the canceling of grants and the writing of vituperative reviews. But intellectual intimidation, whether by sword or by pen, inevitably shapes the ideas that are taken seriously in a given era, and the rear-view mirror of history presents us with a warning.</p></blockquote>
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		<title>By: Lynx</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/14056/center-of-attention-112/comment-page-1/#comment-90875</link>
		<dc:creator>Lynx</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jul 2007 22:21:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/at-tmv/center-of-attention/14056/center-of-attention-112/#comment-90875</guid>
		<description>Oh and as to the &quot;questions atheists can&#039;t answer&quot;, it&#039;s evident that the author never, you know, &lt;em&gt;asked&lt;/em&gt; an atheist. First he says that morality is not dependent on religious belief as exemplified by the wealth of good atheists (to his credit, he cites prickly-pear Dawkins as an example) and then turns a 180Âº by saying that while the capacity for good and evil resides innately in humans, the ability to choose good over bad is something only a religion can accomplish (mind you, he says a religion, not necessarily with a real god). Huh? So those of us who are atheists have the capacity for good and bad, but no guide to tell us which is which? Ridiculous. 

What he basically accuses Atheism of is not having it&#039;s own moral code to &quot;compete&quot; with those of religion. Of course it doesn&#039;t, because it&#039;s not an organized belief system, just a lack of one. As to the religious moral codes, they say love your neighbor and they also say kill the infidel. We choose to do the first and ignore the second because &lt;em&gt;it&#039;s not really the religion that&#039;s guiding us&lt;/em&gt;, but a wider social sense of right and wrong that we all, believers and non-believers, share.

Finally this:
&lt;blockquote&gt;one of this amounts to proof of God&#039;s existence. But it clarifies a point of agreement -- which reveals an even deeper division. Atheists and theists seem to agree that human beings have an innate desire for morality and purpose. For the theist, this is perfectly understandable: We long for love, harmony and sympathy because we are intended by a Creator to find them. In a world without God, however, this desire for love and purpose is a cruel joke of nature -- imprinted by evolution, but destined for disappointment, just as we are destined for oblivion, on a planet that will be consumed by fire before the sun grows dim and cold.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

The wording shows a very old stereotype of atheists; that we are essentially unhappy, depressed, empty and devoid of purpose. This stems from a false extrapolation; the religious person thinks what they themselves would be like without the comfort of their deity, if &quot;God died&quot; and assumes that this is what atheism is like. Many in religious authority carefully cultivate this prejudice. The happy, social atheist, who feels no less awe when contemplating as amazing as the diversity of the Earth achieved from such a simply mechanism as is evolution as others do thinking of God, is denied.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oh and as to the &#8220;questions atheists can&#8217;t answer&#8221;, it&#8217;s evident that the author never, you know, <em>asked</em> an atheist. First he says that morality is not dependent on religious belief as exemplified by the wealth of good atheists (to his credit, he cites prickly-pear Dawkins as an example) and then turns a 180Âº by saying that while the capacity for good and evil resides innately in humans, the ability to choose good over bad is something only a religion can accomplish (mind you, he says a religion, not necessarily with a real god). Huh? So those of us who are atheists have the capacity for good and bad, but no guide to tell us which is which? Ridiculous. </p>
<p>What he basically accuses Atheism of is not having it&#8217;s own moral code to &#8220;compete&#8221; with those of religion. Of course it doesn&#8217;t, because it&#8217;s not an organized belief system, just a lack of one. As to the religious moral codes, they say love your neighbor and they also say kill the infidel. We choose to do the first and ignore the second because <em>it&#8217;s not really the religion that&#8217;s guiding us</em>, but a wider social sense of right and wrong that we all, believers and non-believers, share.</p>
<p>Finally this:</p>
<blockquote><p>one of this amounts to proof of God&#8217;s existence. But it clarifies a point of agreement &#8212; which reveals an even deeper division. Atheists and theists seem to agree that human beings have an innate desire for morality and purpose. For the theist, this is perfectly understandable: We long for love, harmony and sympathy because we are intended by a Creator to find them. In a world without God, however, this desire for love and purpose is a cruel joke of nature &#8212; imprinted by evolution, but destined for disappointment, just as we are destined for oblivion, on a planet that will be consumed by fire before the sun grows dim and cold.</p></blockquote>
<p>The wording shows a very old stereotype of atheists; that we are essentially unhappy, depressed, empty and devoid of purpose. This stems from a false extrapolation; the religious person thinks what they themselves would be like without the comfort of their deity, if &#8220;God died&#8221; and assumes that this is what atheism is like. Many in religious authority carefully cultivate this prejudice. The happy, social atheist, who feels no less awe when contemplating as amazing as the diversity of the Earth achieved from such a simply mechanism as is evolution as others do thinking of God, is denied.</p>
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		<title>By: Lynx</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/14056/center-of-attention-112/comment-page-1/#comment-90873</link>
		<dc:creator>Lynx</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jul 2007 21:56:51 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>I have to disagree about Harry Potter. Just because many people, particularly kids and early teens, have latched on to the Harry Potter Phenomenon because of it&#039;s fame does not mean they will come to expect such fireworks from all books. Quite simply, getting a kid to read enthusiastically can never hurt his or her chances of becoming an avid reader, quite the contrary. A 12 year old who otherwise wouldn&#039;t bother might look at Harry Potter because of the hype and find that reading isn&#039;t so dull, after all.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have to disagree about Harry Potter. Just because many people, particularly kids and early teens, have latched on to the Harry Potter Phenomenon because of it&#8217;s fame does not mean they will come to expect such fireworks from all books. Quite simply, getting a kid to read enthusiastically can never hurt his or her chances of becoming an avid reader, quite the contrary. A 12 year old who otherwise wouldn&#8217;t bother might look at Harry Potter because of the hype and find that reading isn&#8217;t so dull, after all.</p>
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