The Debt Ceiling Limit: An Outsider’s View from the Water Cooler
In a rebuttal to the President tonight the Speaker of the House, John Boehner at one point said a “serious bipartisan committee of Congress would begin the hard work necessary of dealing with the tough challenges our country faces.” He went on to say “The individuals doing this work will not be outsiders, but elected representatives of the people.” Boehner also continued to tell us he spoke for the American People.
Saying or thinking you speak for Americans doesn’t mean its true, Mr. Speaker.
You might want to check that pulse again Mr. Speaker. According to the latest Quinnipiac poll 67 percent of Americans believe raising the debt ceiling should include tax hikes. 48 to 34 percent will blame the Republicans instead of the President if the debt ceiling was not raised. It is repeated in most every poll. A Pew Research poll goes even further. It not only tells us 64 percent of Americans think deficit reduction should include a combination of both taxes and spending cuts but, 59 percent of “Main Street Republicans” agree. The real less talked about shocker in this poll is the fact 34 percent of “Staunch Conservatives” feel there should be a combination of taxes and spending cuts. This is the group who should be most impressed by Boehner’s stance. Even the Rasmussen Reports, a poll known for favorable conservative results, tells us Americans prefer a generic candidate who would promise a balanced approach over one that would promise not to raise taxes (56 to 34%).
So why are Americans not buying what the Speaker is selling?
Around my water cooler my fellow workers, including some real wingnuts who should support him, take one look at Boehner and wonder what exactly he is negotiating. See, the Americans Boehner speaks for negotiate a little differently. The way they negotiate is by giving the other side something they want. They laugh when the Republicans say we will negotiate but, you can’t have anything you want.
The other thing that does not pass the smell test around our water cooler is how the Republicans call this Obama’s recession. Apparently other water coolers are the same because in the previously cited Quinnipiac poll 54 percent still blamed President Bush for the recession. We are not the smartest people in the world but we can understand a timeline. We know the bailout began before Obama.
While according to a CNN poll only 25 percent of Americans think the Obama’s stimulus helped the middle class. Contrary to what Republicans are trying to sell, around my water cooler, we liked the programs the stimulus funded. So, relentless Republican messaging has worked to a certain extent but, when questioned further 8 out of 10 Americans liked stimulus programs. Around the water cooler most outsiders can point to at least one worthwhile project.
The outsiders around my water cooler have seen the hard work done on the debt ceiling for weeks. What the Speaker and his caucus do not understand is that many Americans have already decided who to blame. Republicans may want to make sure there is no reason to blame them by insuring the debt ceiling is raised.
17 Responses to “The Debt Ceiling Limit: An Outsider’s View from the Water Cooler”
In the Republican party, the Rich are getting Representation without Taxation. Everybody else gets Taxation without Representation.
You have some weird associates, to say the least. Both speeches were poor, as well as politically and publicly degrading, but Obama’s was worse. Blaming Bush was bad, insisting on tax increases and scummy class warfare was bad (notably since Reid’s as well as Boehner’s plan has no tax increases), and his demagoguery (stupid campaign style) was bad. Insisting on enough debt room to go past the 2012 election was bad; misusing “balance” to appeal to the stupid was bad. Obama was a figurehead that was truly pathetic, even more than disgusting, last night — out of touch with the past two weeks, out of touch with reality once more.
Boehner and Reid should just write their own plans and then get some agreement between the two parties and the House and the Senate without Mr. Superfluous screwing it up. (Nobody now likely is still waiting for Obama to present his own plan.)
“In the Republican party, the Rich are getting Representation without Taxation. Everybody else gets Taxation without Representation.”
In the Democrat’s nomenclature, “rich” means “employed”.
No offense DR but “a stimulus project you liked” in the course of spending $860 billion is a pretty low bar.
As to the polls, they are meaningless. First the questions are mostly skewed as in the poll you cited…a better poll would give more options. Second, the word cut has a different meaning to the average American than to the average person working in Congress. Reduction in the rate of increase such that the rate of increase is still above the rate of growth of inflation plus population is not how most Americans would define the word cut.
DLS – Whenever I see your name by a response I know what it says without reading – Democrats and lefties are bad and have no redeeming value and Republicans and conservatives are good and have all the brilliant policy prescriptions.
In your world if the Conservatives held ALL the power we would have utopia.
jdledell: DLS is a troll. Do not feed the trolls, do not bother to read the trolls. It is a complete and utter waste of your precious time.
It is difficult to tell who is telling the truth since very few specifics have been released. All we have to go on is generalities, media leaks and the claims of Obama and Boehner. The left is inclined to believe Obama, the right Boehner.
My own feeling is that the GOP is more the problem than the Democrats, but that both parties are having difficulty compromising.
The polls are next to worthless and continue to show that most Americans, or at least a plurality, don’t want to raise the debt ceiling at all (a view I do not share).
“DLS – Whenever I see your name by a response I know what it says without reading” ~ jdledell
As do I and probably most of the regulars here. He’s a troll yes, but he’s our troll.
Truth be told, DLS often provides good information and commentary on non-political subjects, which is why I like the guy. The obsessive insulting and bashing of the left does get insufferable at times though which is why I generally ignore or skim over many of his posts.
To the subject: Re: John Boehner claiming to speak for the American people, this is an old and tactic I’ve seen politicians use endlessly. I hate it whenever I hear it being trotted out because I almost always know it’s going to be a lie – especially when it comes from the starboard side. Sorry to be so blunt, but I don’t subscribe to false equivalence (however popular) anymore than I would the suggestion that 3+3 = 2+3.
Tax increases (or revenue – we all know what it means) must be a part of the total package or there is no serious and genuine desire to address the problem.
DLS, class warfare is not an artificial construct of any ideology, it is a reality. You’d better get used to thinking of it in those terms.
As for John Boehner’s concept of “bi-partisan”? I think we all know what they really means.
I have to admit one thing that’s rather amusing in all of this (you’ve gotta laugh at something in order to not sob)…watching Boehner trying to herd the cats of his side of the House. House Republicans have become the new Democrats in terms of solidarity.
Big difference is that more of the cats in the Republican house are feral.
“DLS – Whenever I see your name by a response I know what it says without reading” ~ jdledell
DLS’s obsession with liberals / lefties sounds exactly like superdestroyer’s fear and paranoia of brown and black people, they’re both all inclusive in their condemnations.
SOS from the peanut gallery — do you prefer your myths that much?
Weird Associates,
I will tellem all tomorrow. I am sure they will be interested in your hourly rate. We could always use a guy round the cooler who has all the answers. Infallibility being in short supply and all.
Feral cats
Best metaphor I have heard all day.
Infallibility: It comes with gargantuan humility, too, of course.
If you are in any of numerous places in New England, New York City or other eastern central cities, certain sites in California, or in the Pacific Northwest, the water cooler discussion could be understood, though not accepted, because it’s so untrue and distorted.
Nobody is defending or supporting Boehner. The real issue is that Obama’s speech was no good, just stupid loser-appeal campaign behavior, and he was still trying to press for envy-based tax policy items and other things that have been written off by Dems and the GOP in Congress. (Bashing Bush was so pathetic it may not even appeal to many losers any longer.) It’s as if he has been missing for two weeks, another example of being out of touch (as he has been in 2009-2010) and refusing to face reality, hope for more taxing and spending ability even now(!). It’s a shame so many are insensitive or unthinking about it. (But they’re the basis of his campaigning and of his speech.)
Now, that rankles liberals, a number of whom have engaged in all kinds of ridiculous behavior (including toward the messenger), but facts are facts.
Maybe Obama should just shut up, stop doing more damage, and wait for Congress to try to get a budget deal, then sign it and be done with it. (If he vetoes a budget bill because it doesn’t raise taxes…)
J. Spencer wrote:
??? Nothing I ever have said about class warfare, the reality about which I’ve written numerous times, leads anyone normally to react and write what you wrote. Now if you’re referring to what’s called the “plutocracy,” you’re imagining too much atop what is real.
Pardon me if I sometimes misconstrue what takes place in the labyrinth of your mind. After all this time though, I think you should give me points for continuing to try.
Personally, I’ve deducted points… for wasting time.