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	<title>Comments on: War Debate: An Extraordinary Moment in U.S. History</title>
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		<title>By: Rudi</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/10896/war-debate-an-extraordinary-moment-in-us-history/comment-page-1/#comment-52874</link>
		<dc:creator>Rudi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 14 Feb 2007 21:34:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/politics/congress/war-debate-an-extraordinary-moment-in-us-history/#comment-52874</guid>
		<description>OK But Jones was one of a few Republicans that wanted a debate on Iraq. The leadership shot that down. They did vote on a &#039;Victory in Iraq&#039; parade. Anybody hear the date of the PARADE.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>OK But Jones was one of a few Republicans that wanted a debate on Iraq. The leadership shot that down. They did vote on a &#8216;Victory in Iraq&#8217; parade. Anybody hear the date of the PARADE.</p>
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		<title>By: stevesturm</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/10896/war-debate-an-extraordinary-moment-in-us-history/comment-page-1/#comment-52826</link>
		<dc:creator>stevesturm</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 14 Feb 2007 19:08:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/politics/congress/war-debate-an-extraordinary-moment-in-us-history/#comment-52826</guid>
		<description>Rudi: I followed the Jones/fries connection, but still don&#039;t get how it applies to me.  I never was in favor of doing what Bush is trying to do.  I wanted us to go in, get rid of Hussein and whatever WMDs might have existed and get out and leave it to the Iraqis to figure things out for themselves.  As for your &#039;worked well in november&#039;, there are many reasons one can ascribe to the GOP losing control, Iraq being just one of them.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Rudi: I followed the Jones/fries connection, but still don&#8217;t get how it applies to me.  I never was in favor of doing what Bush is trying to do.  I wanted us to go in, get rid of Hussein and whatever WMDs might have existed and get out and leave it to the Iraqis to figure things out for themselves.  As for your &#8216;worked well in november&#8217;, there are many reasons one can ascribe to the GOP losing control, Iraq being just one of them.</p>
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		<title>By: Rudi</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/10896/war-debate-an-extraordinary-moment-in-us-history/comment-page-1/#comment-52823</link>
		<dc:creator>Rudi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 14 Feb 2007 18:54:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/politics/congress/war-debate-an-extraordinary-moment-in-us-history/#comment-52823</guid>
		<description>Shaun,
It was Walter Jones personally going to soldiers funerals and meeting with the families that changed his stance. From Freedom Fries to a rabid critic of the war. Yet, his stance is ignored by the MSM. W does&#039;t hung a family and comfort of dead soldiers, WJ does and represents a district with a large military base. SS - Google Walter Jones and Freedom Fries, Shaun just claimed the coup deâ€™grace I give you the info.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Shaun,<br />
It was Walter Jones personally going to soldiers funerals and meeting with the families that changed his stance. From Freedom Fries to a rabid critic of the war. Yet, his stance is ignored by the MSM. W does&#8217;t hung a family and comfort of dead soldiers, WJ does and represents a district with a large military base. SS &#8211; Google Walter Jones and Freedom Fries, Shaun just claimed the coup deâ€™grace I give you the info.</p>
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		<title>By: stevesturm</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/10896/war-debate-an-extraordinary-moment-in-us-history/comment-page-1/#comment-52811</link>
		<dc:creator>stevesturm</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 14 Feb 2007 18:03:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/politics/congress/war-debate-an-extraordinary-moment-in-us-history/#comment-52811</guid>
		<description>Shaun: that&#039;s my point, this isn&#039;t &#039;action&#039;.  It&#039;s a game, a jockeying for support from each fringe, a meaningless gesture.  And I&#039;m not ho hum, I not only don&#039;t want more troops going, I want the ones who are there to come home.. but I recognize that nothing, I repeat, nothing, is going to make that happen so long as Bush is President.

Rudi: forgive me, I&#039;m slow.  Please explain your coup deâ€™grace to me, perhaps s p e l l i n g  i t  o u t  f o r  m e ?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Shaun: that&#8217;s my point, this isn&#8217;t &#8216;action&#8217;.  It&#8217;s a game, a jockeying for support from each fringe, a meaningless gesture.  And I&#8217;m not ho hum, I not only don&#8217;t want more troops going, I want the ones who are there to come home.. but I recognize that nothing, I repeat, nothing, is going to make that happen so long as Bush is President.</p>
<p>Rudi: forgive me, I&#8217;m slow.  Please explain your coup deâ€™grace to me, perhaps s p e l l i n g  i t  o u t  f o r  m e ?</p>
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		<title>By: Shaun Mullen</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/10896/war-debate-an-extraordinary-moment-in-us-history/comment-page-1/#comment-52805</link>
		<dc:creator>Shaun Mullen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 14 Feb 2007 17:44:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/politics/congress/war-debate-an-extraordinary-moment-in-us-history/#comment-52805</guid>
		<description>&lt;em&gt;stevesturm:&lt;/em&gt;

Rudi&#039;s &lt;em&gt;coup de&#039;grace&lt;/em&gt; was spot on, but I would add that you seem to have a remarkably ho-hum attitude about the most pressing issue in the U.S. today, one that an increasing number of your fellow Republicans also see as something that demands action.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><em>stevesturm:</em></p>
<p>Rudi&#8217;s <em>coup de&#8217;grace</em> was spot on, but I would add that you seem to have a remarkably ho-hum attitude about the most pressing issue in the U.S. today, one that an increasing number of your fellow Republicans also see as something that demands action.</p>
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		<title>By: Chris</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/10896/war-debate-an-extraordinary-moment-in-us-history/comment-page-1/#comment-52803</link>
		<dc:creator>Chris</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 14 Feb 2007 17:41:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/politics/congress/war-debate-an-extraordinary-moment-in-us-history/#comment-52803</guid>
		<description>In response to Steve and Pat,
The Democrats are playing the political game right now, and people that support the Dems have to play it too.

The Dem politicians are asking: Will cutting funding for the war hurt them in the upcoming elections?  Is that risk greater than the risk of staying in Iraq a little longer?

The Dem voters have to ask: Should we continue to support these people even if they won&#039;t cut funding for the war?  Is an extension of the war worse than having Republicans in control of Congress in 2008 and beyond?

Most Republicans are playing the same game, with opposing rhetoric of course.  It&#039;s just too bad our troops, the Iraqi people, global security and our tax dollars hang in the balance.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In response to Steve and Pat,<br />
The Democrats are playing the political game right now, and people that support the Dems have to play it too.</p>
<p>The Dem politicians are asking: Will cutting funding for the war hurt them in the upcoming elections?  Is that risk greater than the risk of staying in Iraq a little longer?</p>
<p>The Dem voters have to ask: Should we continue to support these people even if they won&#8217;t cut funding for the war?  Is an extension of the war worse than having Republicans in control of Congress in 2008 and beyond?</p>
<p>Most Republicans are playing the same game, with opposing rhetoric of course.  It&#8217;s just too bad our troops, the Iraqi people, global security and our tax dollars hang in the balance.</p>
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		<title>By: Rudi</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/10896/war-debate-an-extraordinary-moment-in-us-history/comment-page-1/#comment-52798</link>
		<dc:creator>Rudi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 14 Feb 2007 17:31:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/politics/congress/war-debate-an-extraordinary-moment-in-us-history/#comment-52798</guid>
		<description>Comments #4 and #5 - Nice talking points, worked so well in November. How can you eat your &lt;strike&gt;Freedom&lt;/strike&gt; fries or toast?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Comments #4 and #5 &#8211; Nice talking points, worked so well in November. How can you eat your <strike>Freedom</strike> fries or toast?</p>
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		<title>By: pat44</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/10896/war-debate-an-extraordinary-moment-in-us-history/comment-page-1/#comment-52796</link>
		<dc:creator>pat44</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 14 Feb 2007 17:19:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/politics/congress/war-debate-an-extraordinary-moment-in-us-history/#comment-52796</guid>
		<description>If congressmen truly believe the Iraq is wrong, they should debate the funding of the war. The only benefit of a non-binding resolution is to the congressmen themselves - they get to go back to their districts and say they opposed the president. By continuing to fund the war, they are, in essence, approving the president&#039;s actions (failure to act is still an act), and we have all seen what this president does when he gets outside advice - he ignores it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If congressmen truly believe the Iraq is wrong, they should debate the funding of the war. The only benefit of a non-binding resolution is to the congressmen themselves &#8211; they get to go back to their districts and say they opposed the president. By continuing to fund the war, they are, in essence, approving the president&#8217;s actions (failure to act is still an act), and we have all seen what this president does when he gets outside advice &#8211; he ignores it.</p>
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		<title>By: stevesturm</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/10896/war-debate-an-extraordinary-moment-in-us-history/comment-page-1/#comment-52795</link>
		<dc:creator>stevesturm</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 14 Feb 2007 17:18:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/politics/congress/war-debate-an-extraordinary-moment-in-us-history/#comment-52795</guid>
		<description>I&#039;d say the Dems push for this resolution ranks up there as one of the all time great &#039;stupid and futile gestures&#039;.  Other than giving thrills to you and your fellow anti-war types, what does it accomplish?  Does Bush individually, the troops in Iraq, we as a country, or our friends and enemies across the world need the debate/resolution to know that pretty much all the Dems and some of the GOP in Congress are opposed to the surge, if not to being in Iraq at all?  

And if/when it passes, what are you going to do with your resolution?  Frame it?  Pass out copies at anti-war rallies?  You&#039;ve got to know that Bush is determined to ignore you and is going to go ahead and do what he wants so long as he is in office.  

So what&#039;s the point?  Other than making yourselves feel good and morally superior, which you certainly don&#039;t need a non-binding resolution for, just why are the Dems using up so much time on something that matters not in the least?

And, yes, for the same reasons, it is ridiculous that the GOP is bothering to even debate this.  Let the Dems have their vote.  The troops will know, as will the country, that it all for show and means nothing.  Absolutely nothing.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;d say the Dems push for this resolution ranks up there as one of the all time great &#8216;stupid and futile gestures&#8217;.  Other than giving thrills to you and your fellow anti-war types, what does it accomplish?  Does Bush individually, the troops in Iraq, we as a country, or our friends and enemies across the world need the debate/resolution to know that pretty much all the Dems and some of the GOP in Congress are opposed to the surge, if not to being in Iraq at all?  </p>
<p>And if/when it passes, what are you going to do with your resolution?  Frame it?  Pass out copies at anti-war rallies?  You&#8217;ve got to know that Bush is determined to ignore you and is going to go ahead and do what he wants so long as he is in office.  </p>
<p>So what&#8217;s the point?  Other than making yourselves feel good and morally superior, which you certainly don&#8217;t need a non-binding resolution for, just why are the Dems using up so much time on something that matters not in the least?</p>
<p>And, yes, for the same reasons, it is ridiculous that the GOP is bothering to even debate this.  Let the Dems have their vote.  The troops will know, as will the country, that it all for show and means nothing.  Absolutely nothing.</p>
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		<title>By: Fly At Night</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/10896/war-debate-an-extraordinary-moment-in-us-history/comment-page-1/#comment-52792</link>
		<dc:creator>Fly At Night</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 14 Feb 2007 16:55:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/politics/congress/war-debate-an-extraordinary-moment-in-us-history/#comment-52792</guid>
		<description>&lt;strong&gt;The DEMS Iraq Plan â€“ Do You Have A Better One?...&lt;/strong&gt;

	In the end, the Dems have given us a world without Islamic terrorists and fossil fuels. Global warming will be stopped and we will live happily ever after.

......</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><strong>The DEMS Iraq Plan â€“ Do You Have A Better One?&#8230;</strong></p>
<p>	In the end, the Dems have given us a world without Islamic terrorists and fossil fuels. Global warming will be stopped and we will live happily ever after.</p>
<p>&#8230;&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Chris</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/10896/war-debate-an-extraordinary-moment-in-us-history/comment-page-1/#comment-52784</link>
		<dc:creator>Chris</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 14 Feb 2007 16:20:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/politics/congress/war-debate-an-extraordinary-moment-in-us-history/#comment-52784</guid>
		<description>It&#039;s good to finally see our elected representatives taking this issue on, even if it&#039;s only for a non-binding resolution.

With that said, I can&#039;t believe Republicans are still trotting out some of these arguments

&lt;blockquote&gt;We cannot support our troops without supporting their mission. The resolution before us, unfortunately, undermines the ability of our troops to complete their mission. -- Rep. David Dreier, R-Calif.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

And I think Boehner said something along the lines of &quot;if we leave Iraq, they will follow us home.&quot;

Does any moderate or thinking person actually fall for these tactics anymore?

Guess what Dreier, supporting our troops means giving them our respect, and how do you claim to respect our troops if you don&#039;t give them tools, traning and objectives that will lead to success and safety?

And Boehner, why would Shiite Militias and Sunni insurgents follow us home?  They are mostly fighting each other and when they do attack us, they do it because we are an incompetent occupying power that has pissed off most of the population.  There is hardly any security or utilities.  Unemployment is high and we&#039;ve even been caught torturing innocent Iraqis.

The bulk of the insurgency is not the Al-Qaeda types, and the Al-Qaeda types that are there are there because of us.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s good to finally see our elected representatives taking this issue on, even if it&#8217;s only for a non-binding resolution.</p>
<p>With that said, I can&#8217;t believe Republicans are still trotting out some of these arguments</p>
<blockquote><p>We cannot support our troops without supporting their mission. The resolution before us, unfortunately, undermines the ability of our troops to complete their mission. &#8212; Rep. David Dreier, R-Calif.</p></blockquote>
<p>And I think Boehner said something along the lines of &#8220;if we leave Iraq, they will follow us home.&#8221;</p>
<p>Does any moderate or thinking person actually fall for these tactics anymore?</p>
<p>Guess what Dreier, supporting our troops means giving them our respect, and how do you claim to respect our troops if you don&#8217;t give them tools, traning and objectives that will lead to success and safety?</p>
<p>And Boehner, why would Shiite Militias and Sunni insurgents follow us home?  They are mostly fighting each other and when they do attack us, they do it because we are an incompetent occupying power that has pissed off most of the population.  There is hardly any security or utilities.  Unemployment is high and we&#8217;ve even been caught torturing innocent Iraqis.</p>
<p>The bulk of the insurgency is not the Al-Qaeda types, and the Al-Qaeda types that are there are there because of us.</p>
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		<title>By: Shaun Mullen</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/10896/war-debate-an-extraordinary-moment-in-us-history/comment-page-1/#comment-52762</link>
		<dc:creator>Shaun Mullen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 14 Feb 2007 15:34:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/politics/congress/war-debate-an-extraordinary-moment-in-us-history/#comment-52762</guid>
		<description>Alan G:

You make two good points.

I disagree with the first. While you are correct in describing the Senate&#039;s parliamentary parameters, this is no time for business as usual.

I agree with the second and have removed the name of the Marine from the caption.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Alan G:</p>
<p>You make two good points.</p>
<p>I disagree with the first. While you are correct in describing the Senate&#8217;s parliamentary parameters, this is no time for business as usual.</p>
<p>I agree with the second and have removed the name of the Marine from the caption.</p>
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		<title>By: Alan G</title>
		<link>http://themoderatevoice.com/10896/war-debate-an-extraordinary-moment-in-us-history/comment-page-1/#comment-52748</link>
		<dc:creator>Alan G</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 14 Feb 2007 14:51:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://themoderatevoice.com/politics/congress/war-debate-an-extraordinary-moment-in-us-history/#comment-52748</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m not sure I&#039;d blame the Senate too much for the impasse.  Not only is the Democratic majority extremely thin, but the Senate rules encourage debate and a slower, more consensus-based approach than the House.

And I&#039;m not sure if I&#039;d include a photo of a casket along with the name of the deceased in a political discussion...unless you &lt;em&gt;know&lt;/em&gt; that the deceased would agree with you on that particular issue and wouldn&#039;t object to the picture being used.  Otherwise you might be dragging them into something they don&#039;t agree with and can&#039;t object to (being dead).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m not sure I&#8217;d blame the Senate too much for the impasse.  Not only is the Democratic majority extremely thin, but the Senate rules encourage debate and a slower, more consensus-based approach than the House.</p>
<p>And I&#8217;m not sure if I&#8217;d include a photo of a casket along with the name of the deceased in a political discussion&#8230;unless you <em>know</em> that the deceased would agree with you on that particular issue and wouldn&#8217;t object to the picture being used.  Otherwise you might be dragging them into something they don&#8217;t agree with and can&#8217;t object to (being dead).</p>
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