Comments on: FBI Agents Witnessed 26 Incidents of Possible Mistreatment

By: Sam

Sam — Thu, 04 Jan 2007 00:09:59 +0000

Seriously, book abuse is torture? I mean yea, its rude but c’mon. People are being actually, physically tortured and this is what we focus on? The militias in Iraq are taking power drills to their prisoners and we are worried about books? For all I know our boys are doing the same to terrorist suspects. I understand the book represents their religon, but its still just a book.

By: CStanley

CStanley — Thu, 04 Jan 2007 00:00:06 +0000

Kevin,
I’m not sure I understand you, but I think you’re asking what if some sort of denigration of Islam were the only way to “get to” a prisoner. I guess I find it hard to believe that this would occur, but regardless I don’t think it should be done under those circumstances either (the ends doesn’t always justify the means). Similarly, I don’t condone torturing the person either, it’s just that the Koran/Islam insults are wrong for a different reason IMO.

By: Kevin H

Kevin H — Wed, 03 Jan 2007 18:51:33 +0000

Paul, I don’t know how well it would work, but I would certainly say we should try it out.

CS, I think your probably right, but a hypothetical keeps bugging me. What if, in the situation Lynx outlined, the person cares more about the book than the family member? Even if you think its wrong or even constitutes a mental illness, does that change the nature of torture? I’m not sure it does.

By: Michael van der Galien

Michael van der Galien — Wed, 03 Jan 2007 16:25:45 +0000

I believe that this is part of a ‘technique’ used by interrogators for at least several years now (not extremely kind but understanding and not constantly of course).

By: SteveK

SteveK — Wed, 03 Jan 2007 16:16:30 +0000

Paul Silver said: I often wonder why we donâ€™t take the opposite approach and treat detainees with extreme kindness and moderate comfort?

Well said, Paul. If people could back away from the emotional entanglements of this debate it would seem very hard for them not to see that everyone (you / me; them / us) responds to others in kind.

Taking this to the next logical step… Treating someone who hates and fears you decently will not be what they expect, it will be a positive step in encouraging them to reevaluate their position. Torture, harassment and humiliation on the other hand will merely fortify their beliefs and be justification to them for their actions.

By: Michael van der Galien

Michael van der Galien — Wed, 03 Jan 2007 14:51:29 +0000

Iâ€™m more concerned not that this kind of act is torturous to the individual Muslim who witnesses it, but that it is an insult to all Muslims and that is why it is so wrong. In other words, Iâ€™m not so much opposed to certain forms of psychological distress being perpetrated on individual detainees (assuming that there is reasonable cause to think that they are enemy combatants or that they have knowledge that is important for the defense of our country). But insulting Islam is a completely separate issue, and any psychological means that are used in interrogation shouldnâ€™t have any relation to that.

C.S. as happens more often: we are – so it appears – in complete agreement.

By: CStanley

CStanley — Wed, 03 Jan 2007 14:34:25 +0000

I think I get your point, MvdG, and I agree that any kind of desecration to the Koran shouldn’t be done. I guess I have to agree with Lynx too though, that this is sort of a separate issue from torture. I’m more concerned not that this kind of act is torturous to the individual Muslim who witnesses it, but that it is an insult to all Muslims and that is why it is so wrong. In other words, I’m not so much opposed to certain forms of psychological distress being perpetrated on individual detainees (assuming that there is reasonable cause to think that they are enemy combatants or that they have knowledge that is important for the defense of our country). But insulting Islam is a completely separate issue, and any psychological means that are used in interrogation shouldn’t have any relation to that.

By: Paul Silver

Paul Silver — Wed, 03 Jan 2007 14:24:08 +0000

I often wonder why we don’t take the opposite approach and treat detainees with extreme kindness and moderate comfort? Have women guards dressed in burkas. Try to appeal to the inner seed of humanity rather than cover it in layers of anger. Imagine treating thousands this way and then releasing back home where their quality of life may even be lower. The Great Satan?

By: Michael van der Galien

Michael van der Galien — Wed, 03 Jan 2007 13:47:24 +0000

I pointed that out in my post on this, however it should not be done anyway. If not out of respect for other religions, then at least because it will hurt the image of the US tremendously once it comes out. By doing so, you’re not just ‘insulting’ those suspects, but every single Muslim.

And that’s not something the US can afford.

By: Lynx

Lynx — Wed, 03 Jan 2007 13:35:00 +0000

I obviously am against torture or any of it’s pretty euphemisms (“stess positions” is my personal favourite), but squatting on a book, no matter how important isn’t torture. A symbol is just a symbol. If a terrorist is going to talk because you burn a Koran then I’ll hand you the matches. That’s not to say psycological TORTURE doesn’t exist and shouldn’t be used. Threatening the family of a prisoner, handing them a lock of hair and telling them it belongs to their child is psycological torture, burning a book, no matter how important, is not.